I was wrong, swords are not OP in Exanima

[Iron Prankster]

Check this out: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9eCzG8AAoQ

"ThatOneEngineeringStudent4 days ago
I think that when this sword was being developed the developers (the Scottish? I'm not sure) were looking to make a, excuse me for this, 'sword hammer'

Take notice of the fact that the sword was never able to slice through the armor but was able to shatter bone. I think the developers thought that if they created a sword with a thick rain guard and fuller it would be able to be swung faster than a hammer but with the ability to cause blunt trauma to an extent almost equal to that of a hammer."

Fun fact: the Chinese called one of their cleaver weapons "thin hammer" ... it all makes sense now.

btw video relevant since those kinds of attacks happen in Exanima all the time. I wouldn't want to be that dummy. Also, maybe chain mail should convert slashing damage to crushing at some % setup. I use a lot of light chain mail vests in my Adept+ armor setups in Arena RPG and haven't bothered with anything more. Pauldrons or re-rebraces + vambraces + best helmet + cuisses are critical though. Exceptional gambeson too. ... man I must be a masochist asking for more punishment. I still die in like 2-3 good hits to the torso from anything, which only happens when I feel tired when I play.

P.S. "Thin hammer" cleavers were probably blunt too. Can we get blunting of sharp metal sticks to contribute to crushing damage or something? Right now, at best, we only get more impact damage, like the whole two-handed swords progression from rusty to nice cross-guard to two-handed scalpel-sword.

oh and btw falchions vs chain mail are pretty brutal as is... they end up feeling like slow hammer-swords vs chain. The slowness makes them easy to handle. So that actually matches what the guy in the video says at the end. It's only impact damage that goes through though. Or maybe Exceptional Gambesons are just that OP under mail. I keep calling it the most important armor for a reason.

Also, I heard that we are getting an armor-damage mechanic at some point. Is that true?

[Corus]

Oh dude... Where do I start?
1 He's using the sword like a baseball bat (lol)
2 that armor is the cheapest thing I have ever seen, it literally falls apart.

I get it, this is clearly entertainment, but real life doesn't work like that. Swords are for cutting flesh, not breaking bones, they simply lack the mass to do it. That's what warhammers are for. A properly made claymore is 2-3 kg.
So as for the game, it kinda cheats putting impact damage to swords, which isn't accurate at all, but it's all for game balance, there's no way you would be able to use halfswording accurately and stab people in the gaps of the armor, atleast not in the current state of the game.

Now this is a good video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hlIUrd7d1Q

And by the way, I'm mad at the video, not you. It's extremely inaccurate.

[affairs most succubussian]

that armour probably costed like 1500$. If you want some actual footage, get 10000+$ and ask a master smith to forge you some armour.

[Iron Prankster]

Originally posted by Corus:

Oh dude... Where do I start?
1 He's using the sword like a baseball bat (lol)
2 that armor is the cheapest thing I have ever seen, it literally falls apart.

I get it, this is clearly entertainment, but real life doesn't work like that. Swords are for cutting flesh, not breaking bones, they simply lack the mass to do it. That's what warhammers are for. A properly made claymore is 2-3 kg.
So as for the game, it kinda cheats putting impact damage to swords, which isn't accurate at all, but it's all for game balance, there's no way you would be able to use halfswording accurately and stab people in the gaps of the armor, atleast not in the current state of the game.

Now this is a good video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hlIUrd7d1Q

And by the way, I'm mad at the video, not you. It's extremely inaccurate.

1. We swing swords like baseball bats in Exanima. That was part of the point of my post ;) So the video remains valid from this perspective specifically because of that. :P

2. Haven't you seen rusty breast plates in the store? 100% accurate to the video. I still fail to see the problem. :P

The video you linked I have linked before on these forums. My main ♥♥♥♥♥ was really not having slash+impact convert into impact+crush vs chainmail+gambeson. You can still take someone out in 2-3 hits vs chain mail in the game technically. So it's not exactly a valid ♥♥♥♥♥ on my side. It's more like nit-picking. Plate takes forever in comparison. I would like to see one-handed swords do less impact damage to chain though, which would force everyone to either use two-handers or crush weapons or falchions. Often it feels like there is little difference between two-handers and one-handers to me to the point where one-handers seem superior.

On the plus side, what the guy said at the end, does work in the game. You can use heavier bashier weapons quite effectively against someone in a full mail hauberk setup. Falchions are indeed quite effective. I hope we get Messers soon. I need a Messer version of that two-handed sword with a wide cross-guard.

So overall I am mostly nit-picking at chain mail vs swords here, since I play with chain vests so much and know what it's like. It's not perfect, but it's totally like 70-80% of where it needs to be. Where is my Messer?

[Corus]

Originally posted by Mistar Red:

Originally posted by Corus:

Oh dude... Where do I start?
1 He's using the sword like a baseball bat (lol)
2 that armor is the cheapest thing I have ever seen, it literally falls apart.

I get it, this is clearly entertainment, but real life doesn't work like that. Swords are for cutting flesh, not breaking bones, they simply lack the mass to do it. That's what warhammers are for. A properly made claymore is 2-3 kg.
So as for the game, it kinda cheats putting impact damage to swords, which isn't accurate at all, but it's all for game balance, there's no way you would be able to use halfswording accurately and stab people in the gaps of the armor, atleast not in the current state of the game.

Now this is a good video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hlIUrd7d1Q

And by the way, I'm mad at the video, not you. It's extremely inaccurate.

1. We swing swords like baseball bats in Exanima. That was part of the point of my post ;) So the video remains valid from this perspective specifically because of that. :P

2. Haven't you seen rusty breast plates in the store? 100% accurate to the video. I still fail to see the problem. :P

The video you linked I have linked before on these forums. My main ♥♥♥♥♥ was really not having slash+impact convert into impact+crush vs chainmail+gambeson. You can still take someone out in 2-3 hits vs chain mail in the game technically. So it's not exactly a valid ♥♥♥♥♥ on my side. It's more like nit-picking. Plate takes forever in comparison. I would like to see one-handed swords do less impact damage to chain though, which would force everyone to either use two-handers or crush weapons or falchions. Often it feels like there is little difference between two-handers and one-handers to me to the point where one-handers seem superior.

On the plus side, what the guy said at the end, does work in the game. You can use heavier bashier weapons quite effectively against someone in a full mail hauberk setup. Falchions are indeed quite effective. I hope we get Messers soon. I need a Messer version of that two-handed sword with a wide cross-guard.

So overall I am mostly nit-picking at chain mail vs swords here, since I play with chain vests so much and know what it's like. It's not perfect, but it's totally like 70-80% of where it needs to be. Where is my Messer?

Well, in most video games people seem to think swords are baseball bats (Skyrim anyone?).
But I personally think gameplay>realism, so how the game currently handles this, it works.
And I'd love a kriegmesser too.

[Iron Prankster]

I think I just want some minimal red crushy damage from swords vs chainmail. I feel invincible in chain mail. I do go down in 2-3 solid body hits [where I use chain mail], but it's all yellow damage. Maybe the Exceptional Gambeson underneath it is what's OP. I might play around with this. Maybe I should let someone hit me with a falchion. I bet that will do red damage. Single handed swords are a bit OP vs chainmail, considering it was kinda made against explicitly that kind of weapon.

Again, nit-picking, because it's not quite perfect, and notice how in this particular case gameplay and realism go hand in hand.

Plate is okay. Unless we get a system for half-swording + proper pokes @ exposed parts, what we have right now is fine.

Superb/Exceptional armor in general might need to be toned down a bit. The bonus provided is too big. There is also no price difference really.

In chainmail I am more afraid of single-handed swords hitting me than a single-handed axe ... and that's with swings. It should work the other way around. Two-handers need to annihilate mail in comparison to single-handed swords too. It just feels a bit "off" right now.

Strictly in terms of gameplay, you can always boil it down to "hits to KO/kill" no matter the game or damage/armor system. In this respect Exanima is no different than any other game. I can argue that it's a fancier version of M&B's imperfect setup. I still remember as a noob M&B player encountering my first chain-mail enemy, who instead of going down in 1, max 2 hits from my sword or falchion or whatever, would take 3-5 hits. They felt OP and fat. This is classic video game "difficulty via more hit points" mechanic in effect, which when done right works beautifully, and in this day and age gets abused by noob devs who have no clue. Luckily we have no issues in this regard here. Arguably the big scary monsters have too little HP.

Right now Exanima very much reminds me of M&B's hits2ko setup in regards to weapon vs armor. It's just that we have a higher fidelity simulation happening here in comparison to M&B. Plus the dual-hitpoint-type bar setup is something I have always been a big fan of in any game that implements it one way or another.

Again, nit-picking, because chain mail vs specific weapons feels a bit 'off', despite the game being best in class in terms of 'medieval combat'. Well... there is always the Bushido Blade series, which arguably nobody has replicated or beat since in terms of gameplay.