Ending

[Shylaar]

So... What? We get "I'll explain everything later", and then it ends. No resolution, no closure, nothing outside of a video of human Ida sending a text of the numbers which I never actually understood the purpose of (outside of their repeatedly stated importance).

It highlighted some articles in the yurt as well, but I already read all of those, so I don't think those are the trigger to an extended ending or anything. Anyone care to weigh in?

[Wisnoskij]

I think the best analogy has to be Gone Home. Gone Home is a terrific game with an amazing story, told through notes you do not have to read.

But where Cradle just haphazardly scattered notes around, Gone Home set up still-life plays for its story. Entire rooms organised around a few notes to show the story as well as tell it.

[Hobbes]

I'd say the comparison to Analogue is the best one I've seen to date, that makes the most sense to me, because it's an accurate feeling of where the game is. In Analogue, you're going through the entries and the game conversation is part of that navigation. In this game you're focussed on the interaction with Ida, so the text stuff, whilst interesting doesn't actually fit together or even get referenced until very, very near the end. Once it does get hinted at, then the end just ... happens.

Bleh.

[RabidTreeMonkey]

Originally posted by Hobbes:

Therein lies the real problem. The central thread of the story only JUST began to really hint at the wider things before it slammed into the wall of "the end" which was that video that made all of no sense if you hadn't actually picked up all of the hidden stuff -and- figured out what it all meant -and- come to the correct conclusions that you were supposed to as opposed to other conclusions that you could concievably come to.

This could have been done far more elegantly and with more interest by adding another four hours of voiced content / exploration with Ida and the player, perhaps with more going on after the lighting strike and then the player and Ida untangling the web together and actually making sense of everything and answering all the questions properly, and resolving the plot points in an organic manner. Right now? No. It doesn't work. It slams to a halt right as it's beginning to get interesting.

Yeah, the screeching halt to end the story is definitely too abrupt. That alone will piss a lot of people off. Did the devs not see that coming? oO

I'm playing devil's advocate here:

The design decisions involving how to present all facets of the story to the player were... optimistic at best, but from a writing perspective, it could be argued that the story was presented in a perfectly organic fashion which many players chose to ignore.

Think about it, if YOU really were Enebish, awoke with amnesia, and had a burning desire to know who you are and how you came to be in the place would you-

a) be more likely to dig around the house you awoke and live in looking for every hint of information about your past?
or
b) ignore most/all of the obvious and prominently displayed photos, clippings, notes as you help someone else figure out their own problems?

The problem is, no matter which answer you chose, it's the developers JOB to guide and orient the player towards the goal. It's true that finish-line-first mentality metagamer/powergamers get out of Cradle's story what they put into it, but as a developer do you really want to deliberately craft a game that alienates some of your audience? Even if that wasn't the intention, clearly that's what's happened.

If the developer had simply added a few conversations between Enebish and Ida that forced the player to look around their yurt/house, thereby unearthing many of the details burried in the scraps of paper etc, that alone would have gone a long way towards clarifying the ending and at satisfying a larger percentage of players. Not perfect, but better than their current assumption that players will take the initiative or else not mind too much as they replay the game a second time to figure out what happened.

[RabidTreeMonkey]

Originally posted by UltraJay:

The monotone voice of Enebish is the developer's intentional design. In the game's Youtube page, there is a behind-the-scenes video regarding adding voice acting to the game. In it the actor for Enebish describes that he was continually told to be more monotone and expressionless by the director.

Emotionless Enebish is canon. Not bad voice acting. Enebish has no emotions. What can this tell us about his character?

Huh... I was wondering why the performance was so terrible. If it's not the actor's performance, but rather the developer's vision, I think artistically-speaking, that's a bad call. Look at Tabaha's speech which is full of inflection (perhaps because of his more frequent social interaction) whereas Ida and Enebish are more muted. Enebish's actor does frequently attempt mild inflection, but did the devs intend that the character's monotone is a result of swapping bodies recently? If the devs intent was that Enebish speaks flatly because his (new) consciousness was less acclimated to speaking (or whatever other reasons), man... they went too far methinks.

Originally posted by TheUnknownFactor:

...

Before anyone says you should read the scraps: Reading tiny little blurbs of text is horrible story telling. Imagine having a book; but instead of the book weaving information about the world into the story, all those pieces are torn out of their context and cut into little pieces; each without any context.

It is okay to have little blurbs of text that fill in extra details; a good example of a game that does a good job with this is Deus Ex: Human revolution. It's a good example because any blurbs that you read are: 1. Contextualized through location (where did you find it?). 2. Contextualized in time (What happened leading up to this time?). and most importantly 3: Not crucial to the overal story. Because little bits of text that someone might or might not read should **never** be an essential part of the story.

This game had some fantastic artists and designers, it had some pretty good programmers; it had some mediocre writers. (Or alternatively, the story written by the writers was never fully implemented).

...

Bold emphasis mine, and agreed with your post. I'm left wondering which, if any, of the following are true about the developers:

a) they wanted things exactly as they are, and their goal from the start was to put the onus on the player to uncover the story's wrinkles, encourage community discussion, and make it easier for the player to dissect as they replay chapters with the easy-to-discern load screens. In movie terms, the devs watched stuff like 12 Monkeys, Memento etc and wanted to leave the player asking lots of questions even if players think they "got it" upon first viewing.

b) they crafted a walking simulator (with ho-hum skipable minigame) that should have been marketed directly at the Gone Home/Dear Esther/Stanley Parable crowd, but their promo vids etc pulled in too many fps fans that hate digging around for crap to read in what is supposed to be a visual medium. "Come on man, put it in an audio-log or something, even Gone Home did a better job of this than your flower vase synthoid!"

c) they ran out of money and had to wrap things up before their vision was fully realized

d) They got in over their heads, and couldn't quite figure how to reconcile their story. Next thing you know, the original game that had a few tidbits of newspaper scraps etc was suddenly flooded with 'em. From then on, the devs struggled to fit all the pieces together while engaging the player to the various bits of plot-critical info.

e) the voice acting sessions/budget were done with, and they couldn't spring for more time with the original Enebish and Ida to redo some portions, so instead they brought in a some new guy to do Enebish (which is why his micing sounds odd and the acting quality is awful), scattered a few A-HA notes about the place, and called it a day. =p

[b1ngnx33]

I didn't read every thread. Not going to.

This time travel theory creates a paradox.

Send a magic number back in time to fix "everything".

BUT if there is nothing to fix, why would you send a number back in the first place?

Paradox.

Congratulations.

YOU just destroyed time.

Hah hah hah.

[Dark Aasimon]

From story telling point of view protagonist wakes up with no memory of the past. So we experience it. We learn about the world as he does and our view of the world wides as we progress. Game captures this beautifully. From our perspective ending needs more closure but since the storytelling style of the game does not involve a narrator, an intro text or anyting similar even those highlighted items are too much :).
I think overall story telling is well executed.

However I agree with some peoples opinions about:
- Bad VA: Siri talks better (I think it is one of the developers :) )
- Lowres textures: come on beautiful enviroment but lowres?
- Problematic inventory: I got the toy horse but after a puzzle it just vanised
- Irrelevant mini game: This story with a jumping jack mini game? It would be better with circuit connecting mini game or some other thing to do with the robot.

[ゼロ⎛⎝Teletha⎠⎞ツー]

i don't get it whats with the " look into my eyes" in the end? and what was the deal with the cell phone text with the codes and all =S and what was so important in the newspaper?


It would have been better if ida could have been repaired and he could just have lived with her selling digital flowers and maybe adding some love in between if that was a thing to be able to with the android (dunno) or something would have been a much easier ending. kinda feels a bit sad feels like ida died there even though he changed the past and all and ida lived or something( but i don't like the one i've bonded with dying lol even if shes saved in the past it doesn't feel like the same person is being saved)

[lastbreath]

Sorry for my bad English, I will try to explain

1. Scientists tries to transfer human conciousness into m-body
2. It's impossible because conciousness shock reaction
3. Scientists discovered connection to DNA
4. Conciousness transfer is succesful!
5. Synchronizer creates collateral ingredient. It depends on quality of original DNA
6. m-body with low quality DNA can suddenly blow after strong emotions.
7. Explosions are toxic and they causes the epidemy
8. Also explosions cause spheric anomalies into their epicenter, which can be time holes
9. Koch said that number 3813 could save us (maybe senseless, like 42)
10. One of such explosions was in the Dome.
11. Enebish was born from the anomaly and was connected to it.
12. He tries to escape through transfer but process was invalid and he lost his memories
13. Game events.
14. Enebish discovers Babilonian phenomen - telepathy
15. Mark and Ida were connected with such phenomen (people thought they were in love)
15. Enebish use Ida and sphere to transfer 3813 into past
16. Mark gets the number and sens it to dr. Koch
17. Humanity is saved

The end )

[AbusingBruno]

two things:

1) i've subscribed to this thread to read about story speculations, not to dive through endless complaints about "oh this is just pretentious arthouse crap". i had 40+ notifications about this thread and was looking forward to having the time to sit in front of my pc, relax, and see some interesting speculations. finally i find the time and instead what i got was mostly complaints about the price/ending/duration. i get you guys didn't like the game and didn't like the ending, and certainly it is something that can be discussed, but can you go the ♥♥♥♥ off and talk about it somewhere else? thanks

2) i'm noticing the magic number is slightly different from time to time, someone says it's 3413, the last message here says 3813, i remember a 3513 from my playthrough. just confusion in remembering, or does it change randomly indeed?

[lastbreath]

I really forget true number )
Maybe 3513. It doesn't matter )

[Xaito]

Anybody notice that Enebish's field of view is framed by black borders at the edges? Is this supposed to be a m-body visor?

[ゼロ⎛⎝Teletha⎠⎞ツー]

Originally posted by lastbreath:

Sorry for my bad English, I will try to explain

1. Scientists tries to transfer human conciousness into m-body
2. It's impossible because conciousness shock reaction
3. Scientists discovered connection to DNA
4. Conciousness transfer is succesful!
5. Synchronizer creates collateral ingredient. It depends on quality of original DNA
6. m-body with low quality DNA can suddenly blow after strong emotions.
7. Explosions are toxic and they causes the epidemy
8. Also explosions cause spheric anomalies into their epicenter, which can be time holes
9. Koch said that number 3813 could save us (maybe senseless, like 42)
10. One of such explosions was in the Dome.
11. Enebish was born from the anomaly and was connected to it.
12. He tries to escape through transfer but process was invalid and he lost his memories
13. Game events.
14. Enebish discovers Babilonian phenomen - telepathy
15. Mark and Ida were connected with such phenomen (people thought they were in love)
15. Enebish use Ida and sphere to transfer 3813 into past
16. Mark gets the number and sens it to dr. Koch
17. Humanity is saved

The end )

still have no idea what the numbers are for

[RabidTreeMonkey]

Originally posted by AbusingBruno:

2) i'm noticing the magic number is slightly different from time to time, someone says it's 3413, the last message here says 3813, i remember a 3513 from my playthrough. just confusion in remembering, or does it change randomly indeed?

Myself and others are accidentally typing the wrong numbers. The correct number is 3513.

Originally posted by 2 Sugoi To Die -Teletha-私はかわいいです:

still have no idea what the numbers are for

Sounds like you're one of the many people who missed key plot documents/scraps, some of which are shown briefly in the end-game video sequence via flashbacks. Without these bits of info, the game's ending makes almost no sense. I got some free time so I'll type two of the most relevant docs below.

Inside the yurt, on the bed between/underneath two pillows:

Koch's Code of Salvation

"Were I given the magical opportunity today to send a one-word text into the past, I would write '3513' and send it to myself. Yes, it is only four digits. But if would have been enough to save our world."

This famous quote of Helmut Koch naturally tugs at our heartstrings. Today, when the prospects of returning to our former lives are all but nil, the thought of the chance we had missed torments us all. These days everybody knows the number 3513. We associate it with a spell that could have saved us all, if only it were cast in time. But how is it that four simple digits could have prevented a disaster?

Our exclusive interview with Professor ♥♥♥♥, the pioneer of neurocopying, sheds new light on the previously unknown details of this tragic story.

Outside the yurt's fence near a tree:

The work of Helmut Koch, once rejected by his colleagues, has been accepted by the scientific community with fatal tardiness.

An advanced behavioral model of the 'bitter substance' indeed forecasts an abrupt change in its properties upon reaching a critical mass of 31 grams. The error of the previous model, as astutely explosed by ♥♥♥♥, lay in the calculations of the four-digit constant, now known as the ♥♥♥♥ Constant.

In the serene summer of 2050, ♥♥♥♥ was the only one at the Institute of Neurocopying to foresee the sinister potential of passium's bitter isomer. It is all we can do now to regret his failure to find his constant and stop the consciousness emulation experiements before tragedy struck.

[ゼロ⎛⎝Teletha⎠⎞ツー]

Originally posted by RabidTreeMonkey:

Originally posted by AbusingBruno:

2) i'm noticing the magic number is slightly different from time to time, someone says it's 3413, the last message here says 3813, i remember a 3513 from my playthrough. just confusion in remembering, or does it change randomly indeed?

Myself and others are accidentally typing the wrong numbers. The correct number is 3513.

Originally posted by 2 Sugoi To Die -Teletha-私はかわいいです:

still have no idea what the numbers are for

Sounds like you're one of the many people who missed key plot documents/scraps, some of which are shown briefly in the end-game video sequence via flashbacks. Without these bits of info, the game's ending makes almost no sense. I got some free time so I'll type two of the most relevant docs below.

Inside the yurt, on the bed between/underneath two pillows:

Koch's Code of Salvation

"Were I given the magical opportunity today to send a one-word text into the past, I would write '3513' and send it to myself. Yes, it is only four digits. But if would have been enough to save our world."

This famous quote of Helmut Koch naturally tugs at our heartstrings. Today, when the prospects of returning to our former lives are all but nil, the thought of the chance we had missed torments us all. These days everybody knows the number 3513. We associate it with a spell that could have saved us all, if only it were cast in time. But how is it that four simple digits could have prevented a disaster?

Our exclusive interview with Professor ♥♥♥♥, the pioneer of neurocopying, sheds new light on the previously unknown details of this tragic story.

Outside the yurt's fence near a tree:

The work of Helmut Koch, once rejected by his colleagues, has been accepted by the scientific community with fatal tardiness.

An advanced behavioral model of the 'bitter substance' indeed forecasts an abrupt change in its properties upon reaching a critical mass of 31 grams. The error of the previous model, as astutely explosed by ♥♥♥♥, lay in the calculations of the four-digit constant, now known as the ♥♥♥♥ Constant.

In the serene summer of 2050, ♥♥♥♥ was the only one at the Institute of Neurocopying to foresee the sinister potential of passium's bitter isomer. It is all we can do now to regret his failure to find his constant and stop the consciousness emulation experiements before tragedy struck.

i feel the answer lies in that last text but i think im to stupid to understand it, what was the numbers for a model for a android or?

[Shred]

It's a constant, the opposite of a variable. Imo, it was a part of a mathematical formula used in the development of the technology, and had they at the time applied the correct constant, the whole disaster could've been averted.