Beautiful game but awful controls

[Hunkulees]

Attacks are on a timer, which just feels awkward. It’s like playing Castlevania except you can only whip every 3 seconds. Odd design choice. Not really digging that

But even weirder of a design choice is the way jump is handled. Jump is mapped to a button instead of simply pressing up, which feels clunky, and even worse it’s considered a “skill” and takes up a valuable slot unnecessarily

What is the logic in that?

[lo]

you want jump as up? every game i've played has jump mapped to a button, its not weird at all.

[Andrew R]

Attacks are on a timer? You mean kind of like a cool down period?

[Codebread]

Jump doesn't count as a skill. I'm not sure where that is coming from.

You have five skill slots - on XBOX this would be: B / X / Y / RB / LT.

All skills have a cooldown, yes. You're meant to chain skills together to create a combo system with them, instead of simply spamming a single ability. It has a bit of a learning curve, but the combat system isn't meant to be button-mashing style. This opens up much more once you have four abilities equipped.

[Vvef]

For what it is worth, the controls initially seemed odd to me too. But once I understood the intention of how the controls themselves worked in conjunction with the skill cooldown, as well as the myriad of skill effects (push back, launch, etc) it all just clicked.

The idea, I think, is to find sets of skills that you like working together and creating combinations which are effective for you as a player.

[Codebread]

That's totally fair! I can understand why it's not for some people. I hope most decide to give it a chance and progress a bit and see if their view changes.

[Hunkulees]

Originally posted by Serenis:

you want jump as up? every game i've played has jump mapped to a button, its not weird at all.

You must not have played many of these type of games then

[Hunkulees]

Originally posted by Codebread:

Jump doesn't count as a skill. I'm not sure where that is coming from.

You have five skill slots - on XBOX this would be: B / X / Y / RB / LT.

All skills have a cooldown, yes. You're meant to chain skills together to create a combo system with them, instead of simply spamming a single ability. It has a bit of a learning curve, but the combat system isn't meant to be button-mashing style. This opens up much more once you have four abilities equipped.

Different skills have different effects, I get that, so no, i wouldnt have been “spamming” any one attack. I would have used the appropriate attack for the situation

However having them on cool down is the problem. That’s what felt frustrating

Say I have 2 enemies quite a ways away. On both sides of me. Then a ranged attack would be the solution. But with the cool down I can only use it once, so sorry second guy, just run up on me I guess

Same with the close range attacks. Use it once then backflip away multiple times while waiting 3 seconds for it to recharge

Instead of using the right attack for the right situation your cooldown is basically forcing us to cycle through each “skill” repeatedly, which ends up being just as repetitive as “spamming” a single attack

And by “jumping is a skill” I mean that it is assigned to a button, leaving one less button for assigning skills, when pressing up would have worked much better

I get that you we’re trying to be different on this one, but I’m sorry, the controls just feel needlessly convoluted, and the cooldown would have been better left out. Let us use what attack we want when we decide to use it. Waiting for a timer just feels awkward

[Codebread]

Hey, fair enough! When designing the combat system I knew it wouldn't be for everyone, but I was having a blast playing it and I know others feel the same way.

We've made a pretty divisive game between the unique combat, weird artstyle, and the humor. Some people just aren't into it and that's totally cool.

Thanks for checking it out and leaving your feedback though - this is our first game and it started as a side project in my early college years, so if we do get the chance to create another game I'll be taking all feedback like this into account!

[NeonGlass]

Steam platformer games in my library that use a separate button (Space on keyboard for WASD games, Z or X for UDLR games, A(most of the time) for gamepad/controller):
They Bleed Pixels
Super Meat Boy
Hollow Knight
Steamworld Dig
Celeste
Axiom Verge
Bleed
Starbound
Iconoclasts
Bunny Must Die! Chelsea and the 7 Devils
Rabi-Ribi
N++
Cuphead
Apotheon
Salt and Sanctuary
The Cave
The end is nigh
Even the Ocean
Environmental Station Alpha
Starbreak
Wuppo
Ori and the Blind Forest
Tobari and the Night of the Curious Moon
Flinthook
Rain World
Shovel Knight
Dust: An Elysian Tale
Teslagrad
Mark of the Ninja
XenonValkyrie
Speedrunners
Spelunky
Fez
Risk of Rain
Offspring fling
Cave Story
Mutant Mudds
Cavern Kings
Thomas Was Alone
Electronic Super Joy
Dustforce
Terraria
Momodora

Last but not least (Uses separate button):
any Super Mario Brothers game

Games that use both separate button and W/Up:
VVVVVV
Battleblock Theater(button on controller, keyboard uses W)
Trine
Dead Cells
Limbo (button on controller, keyboard uses W)
Super Daryl Deluxe (button on controller, keyboard uses Up)

Games that use W/Up:
Knytt Underground
Deios II // DEIDA
A Night in the Woods
Starseed pilgrim


Given that you are talking about it being a button and not up, I can assume you are using a controller, which overwhelmingly uses A to jump.

It is my assumption that jump is mapped to A because it is in almost every platformer game on a controller. I believe this trend began because for games that use projectile weaponry W/Up are typically used to aim up, so jump needs its own button

[Hunkulees]

Originally posted by Codebread:

Hey, fair enough! When designing the combat system I knew it wouldn't be for everyone, but I was having a blast playing it and I know others feel the same way.

We've made a pretty divisive game between the unique combat, weird artstyle, and the humor. Some people just aren't into it and that's totally cool.

Thanks for checking it out and leaving your feedback though - this is our first game and it started as a side project in my early college years, so if we do get the chance to create another game I'll be taking all feedback like this into account!

I totally dig the humor, and the gorgeous art. It's mainly just the controls (the cooldown timer in particular) that didn't work for me

Still, that said... the fact that you accomplished all of this this is pretty damn impressive man. Massive props. This one isn't for me obviously, but I am really looking forward to whatever you make next

[Too Metal]

The controls are fine though. Even had the ability to rebind to whatever you wanted for keyboard and controller.