Enemies on Hard

[Sconkel]

At start there is always the 1 guy enemy, even on quests.
At day 140 now there are everywhere 3 enemies with all axe and they start to attack.. .
Game over.

Really bad balanced.

[Scynix]

By day 140 your people should be able to handle a team of enemies. Easily. Make sure ypure using the punchng bags to train ypur peoples STR and outfit them with better equipment. My two daughters can one shot average crooks.

[Goweigus]

by day 140 i wouldnt ever send anyone out without the best body armor on hard, that said, axes do a lot of damage its true, im not sure what determines who attacks first but its probably best not to go anywhere near gang territory without well armed fighters

[Sconkel]

All trainable stats on 20.
You are both right, but it doesnt matter what you do.
I think that the axe even got stronger since the betha, from about 40 dmg to 60 dmg.
So 2 hit kills.
All the guns are not worth the ammo due to that axe dmg +bonus aiming.
When the enmies has 1st turn , you loose people.. .

It is also not "realisitic"/ good gameplay , that when I have the first turn, i kill all instant.
Also why can't I "scout" how many people are there .. or take more people within the fights.. etc.
The basebuilding is quite nice, the scavangeing/fighting not really.

Btw. my guys kill bears with knife and 3 hits so.. people shouldnt be a problem ;)


There should be a big rebalance like that :


Knife 3 dmg max + 10% bonus chance - 3 dmg bleeding + 15% hit chance
Crowbar 5 dmg max + 15% bonus chance - dazed
Baseball bat 5 dmg max + 10% bonus chance - dazed + overwhelming
Axe 8 dmg max + 15% bonus chance - 3 dmg bleeding

Pistol (1 shot) 5 dmg max + 50% chance 1 dmg bleeding+ 50% hit chance
Pistol (burst clip) 15 dmg max + 50% chance 1 dmg bleeding + 30% hit chance
Hunting rifle (1 shot) 20 dmg max + 50% chance 2 dmg bleeding + 80% hit chance
Shotgun (1 shot) 10 dmg max + 70 % hit chance
Shotgun (burst clipt) 20 dmg max + 50 % hit chance

max means at maximum lvl (20).
strength counts for short range attacks dmg.
agility counts for ranged attacks dmg.
agility counts for hit chance of all weapons + fleeing.
the bleedings are not additive for sure. highest bleeding stays.
dazed means -25 % to 50% attack hit chance.( 50 maybe too much)

Lets say knife start at 1 dmg. you hit 3 times per turn.
you have 2 people. means 6 dmg per turn (without bleeding) means ~15 turns for fight 1 person.
Means knife is just a knife.. not a samurai sword like now.

Best protectioncloth = -50% dmg
Perhaps evade skill dependend on agility = additional -25% dmg on lvl 20.
Perhaps some bonus protection at clothing vs shotgun cause of small slow bullets.

And for all of that an UI that shows the chances of your teammates in the fights !
For enemy you just have your eyes if they wear armor etc.

And in my opinion gas masks may not count towards the inventory slots.... so you have 2 slots ready for equipment + bag + weapon.

Really what i miss in so many games are so simple things.. just some if else .. and gameplay gets 100% better.

Hmm that seems to be soo good, i post it on the problem forum.

[Scynix]

I'm getting hte impression you aren't really using your gear properly. First, if you wear camo, you can actually ambush squads. You'll "catch them off guard" and can sneak up on them.

Second, the highest tier body armor protects against multiple hits. I've never lost someone in one turn to an enemy squad. With my daughters trained up, they frequently evade attacks and counter with their hatchets.

I usually send one with a shotgun and a pipebomb, and the other with a hatchet. I save the pipe bombs for groups.

Honestly, you're experiencing a different gameplay than I am. Maybe you could record some of your combat, give us an idea of how you're outfitting?

I'd really like to see your squad of "max 20's" by day 140. I know the rest of us could use tips on how you trained everyone that high, that fast. Strength training alone past 12 can consume entire days.

[Sconkel]

Ok you are right only 2 of my guys are on 20 because they are my scavengers.
The others have 1 or 2 traits of 15 <- the base sitters.
But for sure i could train em up within 5 days. That was just not my focus for them.
Training to lvl 20 should have been possible at around day 100 to 120, could be i had a lucky start.

hmm okay i try that again with best armor now.
In my opinion it makes not really sence to send out a heavy combat unit for scavenging without picklocks or other stuff.
That would be the setup for a kill-quest or else.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=852103696
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=852103881
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=852103753
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=852103815

[Sconkel]

XD
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=852130135
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=852128092

could be this one are thougher because it is a quest.
1 women with good armor , the other with best armor.
3 enemies, 1 with pistol.

Pistol enemy starts. bäm 50 dmg on girl 1 , bäm 80 dmg on girl 2, bäm evade, bäm evade, bäm dead girl 1 bäm dead girl 2.

Could be one evade more or less, but 1 guy with pistol killed all on 1st turn.

---------------

Tried again,
This time the pistol guy attacks only with near attack XD
Easy kills.

-------------

Tried again with grenade and first turn mine.
XD.

[Scynix]

Wow, that has to be the worst luck I've ever seen in this game. I've fought 2vGang fights and never had that happen. Was the body armor damaged already? It shouldn't have a problem with an initial shot. Tier 3 body armor should only fail that badly if its already taken damage.

I completely agree with you if you really got one shot with full 20's in fresh armor. That's just insane. I've NEVER had a fight like that. I wonder what the statistics are of the gang? Is it possible the gang can get higher statistics? Anyone know?

One guy with a pistol shouldn't be able to shoot everyone, either. It sounded like you never got a turn in six shots. He did full magazine shot I guess? I've never had the AI do that, either. Even in gang fights. I'm almost pretty sure they have limited ammo, so that means he must have spawned with six full shots? Holy cow. Even the guys with AR's I've run into usually only have 2-3 shots.

You should seriously consider recording that fight and uploading it to youtube so we can see it. I bet the devs would want to see it, too. Maybe there's something off statistically?

@Tried with a grenade, I always carry explosives after a certain point. It's just not worth the risk that you get chained by a full group of attackers, ya know? And cordite is easy enough to gather late game.

[Sconkel]

was really as i described, 4 hits + some evades from 1 guy.

the armor hmm ah ok got the hint. Before the fight a wolf attacked me and i wanted to see how it works. so he got a few free hits on the armor with 0 dmg inflicted.. 8-()

Thought the armor has its 3 hits on every fight...
Bad informations ingame..
Can you see if it is damaged somewhere ? hmm i'll have a look.

lol no thx too much effort.
can give you my savegame or so. XD

[Scynix]

I don't think you can check the damage on the armor, no. It's kind of one of those things you have to keep track of mentally. Yeah, if the wolf damaged the armor, that's why you got murdelized. I think it's supposed to represent the way conventional ballistic armor works. One shot is fine, more than that it tends to breach the ceramic plating. THe higher the tier, the more hits it can take, but after x hits, it becomes meaningless.

Be nice if they added a higher tier, like dragonskin body armor that you could replace the plating in.

I'm glad you've figured it out. That's a hell of a story. I hope others playing on hard/hardcore read this.

I only recommended recording because that sounds insane. It would make an amazing clip. :)

Edit: This is the first game in years I have to use my pad and pencil again. :) Reminds me of good ole adventure game days, mapping out the world. I keep track of materials I'm looking for and armor. Haha! Yeah, I suppose they could add hashmarks to armor or something to make it easier to keep track of, though.

[Ruinous]

Hardcore is no joke either. If the enemy goes first, you lose people its that simple. Even with the best possible equip and stats. I think the trick is to avoid fighting in the first place, as much as possible. I only ever use recruits for scavenging, once I'm at the point where I absolutely need to hit up faction zones to progress. Bear in mind its only game over if you lose all the family members.

[Sconkel]

yes you are right.
I don't want to be too offensive .. but i think the devs havn't thought the game to the end in detail. They just had fun to build the game as it is.
For me there are few big issues like the fights and some bad game designs or lets say gaps in the game.
Again basebuilding is quite perfect, scavengeing / fighting / quests / dialogs / can be improved very much.

[Pawnstar]

ALWAYS take out the ones with melee weapons first.

The gun holders will ALWAYS melee weakly on their first turn.