Mkb-42, G41 and MG42

[Philokèkos]

I'm sure there are people out there who, like me, think it's complete ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ these weapons are in the game. First of all, they pose a serious threat to balance as the Allies have no such weapons : their MG is ♥♥♥♥, they have no assault rifle and the SVT, while better than the G41, is not unique to the Allies as the Axis still has its own semi-automatic rifle.
Second of all, those weapons aren't even accurate ! The game is supposed to take place around 42-43 durung the battle of Stalingrad, so how the hell are the Germans equipped with anachronical MGs-42 and very unstable prortypes (G41 and Mkb-42) ? Both for historical and balance reasons, they should be removed.
I shall add that I'm by no means an Allied fanboy, in fact I think their heroes should'nt have access to MGs-34 as this weapon is unique to the Germans, but they sadly suffer serious drawbacks from having access to an overall weaker loadout.

[IRDCAM]

Fantasy and marketing to the fan boys who have to have toys. If we went total historical would be pretty balanced, but to keep the game alive the fantasy toys had to be. YOu can still win as Soviets as we prove all the time, you just have to play on the weakness of the German weapons and thenplayers that use them.

[Trem]

You're a little late to the party, nothing is going to be changed this late into the development of the game.

Also G41 and MG42 have been proven to have been at Stalingrad.

[IRDCAM]

Very few MG42's made it to Stalingrad, only 17,900 available for whole Wehrmacht in 1942. France, Norway, Greece, North Africa and whole of Russia.

[Philokèkos]

I know it's too late, of course... I just wanted to share some of my oldest frustrations as a veteran, lol
And you know, MGs-42 were widely adopted during summer of 1943, they were still being tested by the time the battle of Stalingrad was raging. I don't mind some fantasy weapons, but then they should be allowed to heroes only for example, instead of this enemy loadout system.

Take RS for instance, Axis have no semi-auto rifles but Allies have the M1-Garand available for just any random riflemen, they have flamers and excellent automatic weapons, and yet the game is pretty much balanced still because of the banzai charge and knee mortar the Axis have. It is the evidence we needed to prove that each side doesn't have to have access to the same weaponry as the other : we could have had a Russian loadout with SVT-40 but the very bad DP-28 and an Axis loadout with no semi-automatic rifles but the excellent MG-34.

[Philokèkos]

Originally posted by SrSgt Ivan Patapov:

Fantasy and marketing to the fan boys who have to have toys. If we went total historical would be pretty balanced, but to keep the game alive the fantasy toys had to be. YOu can still win as Soviets as we prove all the time, you just have to play on the weakness of the German weapons and thenplayers that use them.

It's true you can roflstomp as Soviet (thank God) but it's simply harder overall, the Germans just have superior firepower because of their unrealistic loadout

[IRDCAM]

Germany did not adopt a semi full scale based on their doctrine of the light machinegun as the base of fire. They still prefered the bolt 98K for accuracy and range, and by the time a change was seen as needed logistically it was too late to ramp up production.

Japan went to war with damn near 19th century weapons and eqipment, but the 7.7 model 99 was an excellant rifle. The American M-1 Garand was universally issued by mid 42, Marines storming Guadalcanal still had M-1903's.

The Soviets had production issues with the SVT and reverted back to the 91/30, and the DP 28 was quite effective if used right, more as an automatic rifle than LMG, soldiers on even to today, so something about it works.

When RO and RO2 came out tried to be historic, but marketing went off the rails and here we are.

[Philokèkos]

And on top of all those historical hints, it just takes one lool to how RS works to realise that designing the two loadouts according to their own tactical doctrines and behaviours REALLY PAYS, both in terms of gameplay and balance (RS is one of the funniest games ever), so Tripwire really has no excuse, even more so since they issued the MG42 one year or so after RS

[Philokèkos]

P.S I'm sure the DP-28 was a good weapon, I was refferring to it as bad only when it comes to RO2. Gameplay-wise, it just can't compare to the German MGs. Any organised Allies team will tend to letting the machinegunners go heroes first so they can take the MG-34

[Scrotum Scratcher]

comrade, all you need is big long mosin and ppsh to engage in glorious close combat with the fascist invaders

[Rei]

I'm not sure if it was to appeal to the people who always wanted to play as the Germans or whatever it was, but having something like the MG42 (which by the way, Russians heroes can't use) available to even just 2 people is absurd. For me the MG42 is the biggest factor. It's not only got very little recoil, but can be sprayed without the barrel absolutely melting. Probably one of the few downsides of this game, but as others have said, you can still win as the Soviets, albeit not as easy. I imagine guns like this contribute to the whole stAxis thing too.

[Das_Reich]

Yes, at a certain point this does not have a balance for both sides. I think being a "hero" is a bit bad, firstly because you can choose weapons from the other side, and that's a bit silly. And well, if they really wanted an experience where the level of the player (Hero, Veteran, Etc) does not matter they would play the classic mode, where the weapons are completely made to choose the corresponding side. and of course it is more difficult. This is a bit off the subject, but I think that at some point I would solve your discomfort. But what I have seen within the Red orchestra 2 community, is that they do not like to have difficulties when playing. And that at a certain point is a bit silly. Is for that reason why there is only "Realism" Servers

[Das_Reich]

The Realism Mode Is Like A Arcade Mode Compared To Red Orchestra Ostfront Or The Classic Mode.

[Zeno]

Originally posted by Philokèkos:

I'm sure there are people out there who, like me, think it's complete ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥t these weapons are in the game. First of all, they pose a serious threat to balance as the Allies have no such weapons : their MG is♥♥♥♥♥♥ they have no assault rifle and the SVT, while better than the G41, is not unique to the Allies as the Axis still has its own semi-automatic rifle.
Second of all, those weapons aren't even accurate ! The game is supposed to take place around 42-43 durung the battle of Stalingrad, so how the hell are the Germans equipped with anachronical MGs-42 and very unstable prortypes (G41 and Mkb-42) ? Both for historical and balance reasons, they should be removed.
I shall add that I'm by no means an Allied fanboy, in fact I think their heroes should'nt have access to MGs-34 as this weapon is unique to the Germans, but they sadly suffer serious drawbacks from having access to an overall weaker loadout.

1. The game is more focused on realism than balance, Soviets vs Germans, both sides have decent weapons that can compete with each other.

2. MG42 was indeed NOT used in Stalingrad and is pretty much the only point I agree with you.

3. G41 was used in Stalingrad, not sure where you've heard else.

4. SVT better than the G41? Didn't know you have served during the battle of Stalingrad and had the privileg and punishment to use both. Well, thank you for your service, how old are you now? 95? 100 ?

5. Again, the Soviets do not have a weaker loadout, the only flaw in their loadout is their terrible LMG. But that's it.

They have the mighty PPsh, a decent carbine and the SVT is also not worse nor better than the G41. There isn't any disadvantage to be honest.
The Mg42 can easily be taken out by a Sniper or decent shooter. It's usually up to your team letting enemy MGs survive for that long.

[IRDCAM]

Just the fact the SVT was a detachable box magazine rifle made it far more effective than the non detachable 10rd magazine of the G41. The G-41 had to be loaded by using 2 standard 5 round rifle clips inserted one after the other, the SVT just unlatch one 10rd box magazine, and latch in the next. Both rounds were simular and the ROF was better on the SVT because of the magazine, G-41 was only 20-30 rounds per minute due to stripper loading, SVT was 80-90 based on whole 10 rd detachable box loading.

Both rifles were mechanical nighmares for maintenence based on the two diferent gas operating systems, and both were limited in production, the Soviets actually returning to M91/30 production for more and faster resupply of rifles to the fronts.

[Philokèkos]

The G41 was indeed in Stalingrad, albeit in very limited number since it was a PROTOTYPE. It's wrong that half a team has access to it (officers + ingeneers + elite riflemen + snipers)

And I NEVER talked about the actual efficiency of the weapons I mentionned, only about their efficiency in-game ; although Sgt Patapov's latest post should give you a better understanding of the subject