MRM 10 and 20, hard to use?

[gunner]

Hi guys, I have been experimenting for a while and I think just having a MRM 10 or a MRM 20 is not very useful. I tested in the academy and most of the time I only hit the turrets with around 50% of the MRM system.

I think if you really like MRMs, you should arm it with IS Heavy Mechs like at least MRM 30 and above and have a decent speed Engine.

What is your take and experience with MRMs?

[salamatmahal]

I'm generally not a fan of taking MRMs smaller than MRM40 whenever it would be possible to take an MRM40. MWO is a great game and everything is generally a trade-off and whatever choice I make, there will be people that make other choices.

ETA: I've got 2xMRM40 loaded on a hunchback, a dervish, a quickdraw, an Orion, and a MAD-9M right now. I'm a fan:)

[gunner]

MRMs generate quite a lot of heat, do you think so? I need a Coolshot just in case.

I think ideally MRMs are meant to be Slow Heavy and Assault Killers, but Your Mileage May Vary.

[salamatmahal]

Boating MRM tubes can generate a considerable amount of heat.

If we are only considering firing one MRM weapon, the MRM40 is the most heat efficient per potential damage point.

MRM10 = 4 Heat = 2.50 damage per heat
MRM20 = 6 Heat = 3.33 damage per heat
MRM30 = 9.5 Heat = 3.16 damage per heat
MRM40 = 11.5 Heat = 3.48 damage per heat

If we consider triggering Ghost Heat by firing two MRM40s at once, we are still more heat efficient than firing two MRM30s that would not have ghost heat.

2xMRM30 = 19 Heat = 3.16 damage per heat
2xMRM40 = 24.61 Heat = 3.25 damage per heat

I tend to run 2 cool shots on mechs boating energy and/or MRMs.

I run the Raven Huginn with 1xMRM40 and it runs relatively cold.

[gunner]

@Salamatmahal, MRMs generally speaking without Quirks have a relatively high Cool Down. Basically if you miss your shots, you are going to have to torso twist or run away, do you agree?

[Bones Johnson]

MRM's have excellent damage and ammo/damage efficiency, but you're firing all the missiles in a 'shotgun pellet' fashion, so they aren't great against smaller targets and their damage tends to be scattered at anything other than close range.

They're less accurate then SRM's and for the weight, SRM's do more damage, but MRM's have double or so the range of SRM's and require less missile hardpoints.

I think MRM 30's are currently meta weapons since you can fire 2 at once with no ghost heat, and that's giving you 60 damage over a second or so and only requires 2 missile hard points and a 20 tons for the weapons themselves.

I personally like MRM's from what I've tried. Truth be told I haven't tried them too much as most of my mechs are energy weapon focused, but they've got good alpha damage, good range, good ammo efficiency, and they don't weigh too much.

[gunner]

@Bones Johnson, I was thinking IS Heavy mechs are the best platform for 2 MRM 30, as having a good speed Engine helps to make it safer to fall back or push with MRMs.

[salamatmahal]

Originally posted by gunner:

@Salamatmahal, MRMs generally speaking without Quirks have a relatively high Cool Down. Basically if you miss your shots, you are going to have to torso twist or run away, do you agree?

Kind of?

Mostly I'm looking to shoot and not get shot back. If I'm taking MRMs to brawl, I'm probably taking my Orion with a dead-side and twisting to take fire in the arm and side torso that have nothing much in them. (I rarely run this mech. I generally don't want to brawl.)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuREQN9Gg0A&ab_channel=RandomMechwarrior

In the other mechs, I'm looking to peek out of cover and shoot someone that ideally isn't looking. Good mounts and/or ECM and/or good cover spots are pretty significant in making this work. The MAD-9M and the Raven Huginn are pretty decent at this. The Raven in particular is quite mobile.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sQdD6-g_l_E&ab_channel=RandomMechwarrior

The Hunchback, Dervish, and Wolverine with 2xMRM40 aren't looking for extended engagements. We're either looking to dunk someone one or more times using JJs (in dervish or wolverine) to get off a shot from an unexpected angle, or we're using cover to control our exposure. We don't have the speed to be a real skirmisher, we don't have the sustained heat management to have a drawn out engagement. We need to be dunking or using cover and positioning to get off basically free shots. These are much more challenging builds to do well in and will lean on your team's performance much more than the builds that have ECM.

And a caveat - I'm not a comp player and I don't think MRMs are even a consideration for competitive play. I'm just talking about having fun in quick-play verses random players.

[gunner]

Which comes back to the point of the Topic, MRM 10 & MRM 20s by themselves do not seem to be effective theoretically speaking. They have the same cool down as MRM 30, so ideally speaking you want to have at least MRM 30 to maximise the MRM systems.

[Ishan451]

There is, in my opinion, no reason to use a single MRM10. Its entirely overshadowed by the SRM6. A single, non Artemis, SRM6 has more damage and less spread than a MRM20. The only advantage of the MRM10 is the longer reach and even that isn't really as much of an advantage, given that most fights seem to happen around 300meters anyway, and everyone should have an easy enough time to get the enemy into the 270 meter range of the SRM6.

MRM20 is a different beast. I honestly wish, that all the people that equip a single LRM 15 or 20 launcher on their mechs would use a MRM20 instead. MRM20 weights the same as the LRM15, does more damage and gets people up front and not hanging back thinking they are a LURM boat with their single launcher.

How useful a single MRM20 launcher is? That depends on your mech size. I have a single MRM20 launcher on my Vindicator and i immensely enjoyed that mech with a MRM20 and an ER PPC. I kept out of brawling range with it, and it was quite fun playing it as Midrange mech. So the MRM20 is certainly not useless.


Of course, if you are a heavy pilot then i would say the consideration depends on your overall loadout. If you don't carry at least 50 damage or 10-15 DPS into the match on your Heavy, then i'd say you are doing it wrong, regardless of your weapon system. And as such you should never use a MRM on its own or as the "main" weapon. So the question is rather, what else are you bringing?

[spartanspud]

I would say your basic premise seems pretty accurate. There's not much point in using MRM 10 or 20. They're not very effective compared to other options. I have been using a mech with double mrm 30 though and it is pretty fun. If you stick a pair of those on an archer even, which isn't a great mech, and follow it up with a few lasers most players will be given pause. So it can be good for brawling or for defending your gun line. But if it was between a 10 or 20 and an SRM6 I would pick those since you should have room and weight for other weapons.
I am pretty new though so my perception might be a bit off.

[Chillidoge]

MRM 10 is inaccurate like an SRM 6, more or less. The comparison between the two is SRM does more damage, MRM has more range, SRM deals more heat damage, MRM fires more often for less heat. 2x MRM 20 is great damage for heat cost, with a concession of more tonnage spent. 2x MRM 10 is pretty good, too. These are not pinpoint weapons, they go all over your target unless you lead your crosshair like an absolute boss.

[Chillidoge]

Originally posted by salamatmahal:

Boating MRM tubes can generate a considerable amount of heat.

If we are only considering firing one MRM weapon, the MRM40 is the most heat efficient per potential damage point.

MRM10 = 4 Heat = 2.50 damage per heat
MRM20 = 6 Heat = 3.33 damage per heat
MRM30 = 9.5 Heat = 3.16 damage per heat
MRM40 = 11.5 Heat = 3.48 damage per heat

If we consider triggering Ghost Heat by firing two MRM40s at once, we are still more heat efficient than firing two MRM30s that would not have ghost heat.

2xMRM30 = 19 Heat = 3.16 damage per heat
2xMRM40 = 24.61 Heat = 3.25 damage per heat

I tend to run 2 cool shots on mechs boating energy and/or MRMs.

I run the Raven Huginn with 1xMRM40 and it runs relatively cold.

Hehe, nice. The Huginn turbocharges MRMs with its range buffs.

[The Bone Doctor]

Originally posted by gunner:

Hi guys, I have been experimenting for a while and I think just having a MRM 10 or a MRM 20 is not very useful. I tested in the academy and most of the time I only hit the turrets with around 50% of the MRM system.

I think if you really like MRMs, you should arm it with IS Heavy Mechs like at least MRM 30 and above and have a decent speed Engine.

What is your take and experience with MRMs?

MRMs are burst-damage weapons that sacrifice precision for raw damage (if you bring enough of them). And MRMs have a rather long optimal range on paper, but it doesn't mean you should fire them at 550 meters (just like the LB-X cannons) because they travel slowly and have a huge spread. IMHO, MRMs are best used in the following situations:
- against large, slow targets (preferably hitting them at the angle with the biggest exposed surface area) at around 300-450 meters
- on mechs that have trouble getting into optimal brawling range (250 meters or less) because of speed or size (usually both)
- on mechs with generic missile quirks

Also, just like (all) SRMs and small-caliber LRMs, having only one or two small-caliber MRMs is not really a good build philosophy. You either take one or two large MRM launchers (like 1x 40, 2x 30 or 2x 40) or you boat 4x MRM 10s for crit-padding purposes and a slightly faster ROF (but it runs hotter than a single MRM 40 and uses 1 more critical slot). I don't think there's any point in running 2x MRM20 when you can just run 1x MRM40 for 2 less tons and more heat efficiency.

[Sloths]

The only time I would take mrm10's is for weight and if I have space. With 3 mrm10's you save tonnage vs taking 1 mrm30. Not only that most tubes can accommodate 10 missiles so when firing it comes out as more of a shotgun missile splat blob rather than say with a 30 or 40 a stream of missiles.
For mrm20's if I am running a mech with 2 mrm's instead 2 mrm30's I sometimes do 1 mrm30 and 1 mrm20 and use the extra tonnage for little more speed, ammo, or cooling.
Also as far as mrm10's vs srm6's the one thing I really like with mrm's is their range. We are talking mrm's at 580 or more and srm's at 270. That's a big range difference.

[Diomedes]

Originally posted by salamatmahal:

I'm generally not a fan of taking MRMs smaller than MRM40 whenever it would be possible to take an MRM40. MWO is a great game and everything is generally a trade-off and whatever choice I make, there will be people that make other choices.

ETA: I've got 2xMRM40 loaded on a hunchback, a dervish, a quickdraw, an Orion, and a MAD-9M right now. I'm a fan:)

Lower number launchers, like a MRM30, have significant cool down reduction compared to 40.. Also less weight.. For something like a quick draw, you're forced to use a XL if you go two mrm 40's.