First mech - Phoenix Hawk?

[Jimmy The Jim Jimmies]

Greetings!

I just finished my 25 cadet battles and I'm looking to buy a mech. Yesterday they offered the Phoenix Hawk Champion on Trial and it played so nice that I would like something similar for my purchase. This is what I particularly liked:
* The speed of 140 KPH
* 2x3 medium lasers, grouped per arm, which seemed just right in terms of power and control.
* The ECM that made it possible to sneak up on people.

I tried some other Light mechs, but they seemed to require an edge in mastery that I have yet to acquire. I die quick, with no kills or contribution to the team. With that Champion Phoenix Hawk I left no battleground without kills (IIRC) and easily carried my weight.
The other medium mechs felt either too slow or less intuitive in their mixed bag weapon setup.

The starter guides all point to Hellbringers (used to be my favourite in Mechwarrior 2), hunchbacks or Timberwolves.. Or something like it. I do appreciate their flexibility and armour, but I enjoyed that speed and sneaking a lot more. It feels easier to contribute to the team.

I'm still a Tier 5 pilot though and a pixel away from T4 ...I saw a direwolf alphastrike the sky like it meant something. Perhaps lighter/faster mechs don't fare so well on higher tiers but this model worked like a charm.

Should I go for the Phoenix Hawk or is there another model I can reconfigure to similar specs, that should be better?

[Imperialus]

The PXH is one of my favourite mechs. It has a bit of a bad reputation because most of it's weapons are arm mounted and when it first came out it had some... challenges regarding the frequency with which its arms got blown off but armour quirks really helped with that.

I'm running my 1B right now with a pair of stub nose PPC's in the right arm plus a pair of medium lasers. A heavy PPC in the torso along with a couple medium lasers is also pretty awesome, as it has a +30% velocity quirk for the PPC and it makes good use of the ECM. My PXH-1 has an LBX-10 and lasers for backup. My second PXH-1 has an ER large and a pair of ER mediums plus LMG's, while my 1K has six medium pulse lasers and a pair of flamers for funsies.

There aren't a lot of mechs that do what the PXH does IMO. The assassin comes close, but it's kinda stuck in a short range brawl mode, while I tend to use the PXH more like a skirmisher poking around the flanks and keeping up constant damage. I typically run a XL 280 in the chassis as honestly 108 KPH is fast enough 99% of the time. My laser focused PXH-1 does have an XL 325 which lets it just fly across the battlefield.

[tutzdes]

If you like the mech, I can't really talk you out of it.

Phoenix Hawk is a "confused light" type of medium mech, Its firepower and speed is comparable to that of light mechs. In its category it is considered sub-par due to large size and weapon placement (low arm mounts). While most humanoid mechs can shield itselves with arms, Phoenix Hawk is somewhat limited in this regard as it needs both of its arms to carry its weapons. With all this in mind, the mech can be a pretty effective harasser/flanker.

This playstyle is viable at every tier, so it won't become obsolete as you progress the tiers.

The mechs I consider better for this role: Assassin (much harder to kill, a bit more focused on missiles, ASN-27 variant can carry ECM, Assassins are considered OP by some), Shadow Cat (slower by default, but is extremely nimble with MASC, it can carry a wide variety of weapon options due to being a clan omni-mech, SHC-B left torso can be installed on every variant for that tasty ECM slot), Arctic Cheetah (clan light omni-mech - ach-prime left torso is ECM one - that can do everything that Phoenix Hawk can, while being smaller and much more verstaile).

Still, if you really like the Phoenix Hawk, buy it. The existence of better mech didn't prevent me from buying the other mechs I wanted to play :}

[Ishan451]

Originally posted by Dieter de Verschrikkelijke:

Should I go for the Phoenix Hawk or is there another model I can reconfigure to similar specs, that should be better?

There is nothing really wrong with the Phoenix Hawk as a first mech.. even if people will probably tell you otherwise.

It can perform and in Tier 5 and even tier 4 you will get away with a lot of things you will not get away with once you get higher... because Tier 5 and 4 is filled with new players and bad players..

Would i want to pilot a Phoenix Hawk in Tier 1? Ehhh... not really. It has a few glaring weakpoints... but you see them often enough, to be honest,.... so as long as you are aware that you are not gonna be the one throwing the biggest damage numbers around... and speed is your thing...

My first mech was also one that ran over 120kph... and many players enjoy that. Its always good to see another speedfreak.

The phoenix hawk with its weakness of all its weapons being in the arms, probably also will teach you how to protect those valuable arms.... so i really don't see a reason to talk you out of it. Someone will be shortly by to do that, i am sure. Even if the first couple posts encourages you.


Thing i learned about playing MWO: Even if people tell you xy is the meta and ABC is a bad mech.. its always a better idea to make up your own mind. Yes, the cadet bonus is a precious thing for a newbie... but you never loose access to the Trial mechs and if you spend enough time in those to have made up your mind of what you are looking in a mech... go for it.

Most important thing: You have to like the mech you are piloting. Nobody can pilot it for you.

[Jimmy The Jim Jimmies]

Thank you for the supportive feedback. Though.. I can't say I have a good view of all the mechs available. I have only 30-ish games played, and only had a couple of mechs to try. What I do know is that I particularly enjoyed the role of that Phoenix Hawk. I'll try those other models you mentioned, when they come up as Trial mechs. I don't mind holding on to my C-bills a bit longer.

[tutzdes]

Originally posted by Dieter de Verschrikkelijke:

I'll try those other models you mentioned, when they come up as Trial mechs.

You are lucky as the next round of trial mech is coming soon.

Shadow Cat and Arctic Cheetah will be available as well as Panther (comparatively slow and tanky light mech with jump jets).

[Ishan451]

Originally posted by Dieter de Verschrikkelijke:

Thank you for the supportive feedback. Though.. I can't say I have a good view of all the mechs available. I have only 30-ish games played, and only had a couple of mechs to try. What I do know is that I particularly enjoyed the role of that Phoenix Hawk. I'll try those other models you mentioned, when they come up as Trial mechs. I don't mind holding on to my C-bills a bit longer.

Have you done 2-3 drops in every one of the trial mechs? If so... report back what you particularily enjoyed about them in terms of weapon systems or handling. I am sure we can find a Mech for you.

[BaneBlackGuard]

i think of my Phoenix Hawk as a heavy light, and i use it that way. it's not a brawler, it's a hit and run light mech that is a bit less squishy. it's pretty good at flanking/harassing, and excellent at hunting lights (which in my opinion is the Phoenix Hawks forte )

[Jimmy The Jim Jimmies]

After trying the Wolfhound, I quite like that one as well. It isn't as armoured, but it seems to compensate by putting the lasers in the Torso.

I tried, in Assault:
* Daishi/Direwolf. It had a mix of weapons, including gauss rifles, that I couldn't get to work properly. I just couldn't get it to work for me (yet)
* Mauler with plenty of ACs. It was occasionally wondeful, but more often I didn't get the placement right, or my team didn't and it's game over. I feel like a liability.

Both assault mechs were so slow I felt inadequate to do something about my situation when it was bad, and either I or my team get me in bad situations more often than not. Reading the situation is definitely a skill I'll take on later.

In heavy I tried the:
* Hellbringer. This one seemed alright, like it had potential with the right training. But it wasn't exactly fast. Like ... if it could go 20Kph faster this would be my dream mech :D I still like this mech a lot though. I just felt cornered into a supportive role where I have to helpless witness the demise of my team if things go bad.
* The Warhammer - felt like an assault mech to me, with all the pro's and cons.

Medium:
* Hunchback with 2 ACs. It puzzled me. It felt like the kind of mech to jump and duke it out, but had neither the weaponry nor the armour to really make that difference. Overall it seemed Okay, but I couldn't get the strength of it in the fight.
* Phoenix Hawk.. which I enjoy for its mobility, focused fire from the lasers and more forgiving nature than the Light mechs.

Light:
* Raven - Piloting it was fun, but the 2 Large Lasers didn't seem to do much in my uncapable hands. When I do get attention from the enemy, it doesn't take much time to take me out.
* The Adder/Uller? just died on me before I could do a thing.
* Wolfhound. This one seemed quite nice, but then it has a similar style to the Phoenix Hawk: fast and focused laser fire.

I guess, the lasers and speed are my thing at the moment. At least, for a first mech, that seems like a good choice!
If the Wolfhound is better in the Light category than the Phoenix Hawk is in the medium range, then perhaps I'll take that one.

[BaneBlackGuard]

yeah, with assaults if you guessed wrong and find yourself in a bad position that's pretty much it. they just don't have the mobility to get out of an ambush. just have to clench your jaw and your buttcheeks and dump as much damage as you can into the enemy. the trick is learning where those sort of situations are likely to arise and avoid them, or make sure you are in a group of mechs intending to punch through.

the Hellbringer i've never really gotten the knack for. it just feels like it's severely lacking armor for it's weight.

trick with the raven with large lasers is to hide and pop out long enough to snipe something then get back under cover. 2 ER large lasers can make the raven a pretty decent flanker. keep in mind it's intended to stay out of the fight and provide info for your team mates while getting in hits on targets of opportunity. watch what parts are damaged on what mechs and hit there. your goal shouldn't be to dish out damage. use those high mounted hardpoints to your advantage. at the extent of your range you can get off a shot with so little mech exposed that you are extremely hard to hit, even if they happen to be looking right at you when you fire.

[-=o\BUTCHER/o=-]

I love my Pheonix Hawk. Don't play it all that much, though. My PC isn't all that great. I just stick to heavy and assault most of the time, but like to jump in my PHX every now and then. Great mech for a first buy.

[Ishan451]

Originally posted by Dieter de Verschrikkelijke:

If the Wolfhound is better in the Light category than the Phoenix Hawk is in the medium range, then perhaps I'll take that one.

I probably would suggest the Wolfhound 1B variant or the Raven 3L over the Phoenix Hawk. While i know the Raven hasn't made the best first impression on you, with its dreadful Dual large laser loadout, that is so popular... but i do use my RVN-3L[mwo.smurfy-net.de] with 3 Medium Lasers and 2 SRM launchers.. and its a quite tough and durable little beast that way with ECM to boot, its like a nice compromise between the Hawk and the Wolfhound.

The Wolfhound 1B WLF-1B[mwo.smurfy-net.de] comes already nicely equipped, all you need to do is buy a bigger XL reactor for that thing and double heatsinks... some endosteel for extra heatsinks.

Given that, by the sounds of it, you are looking for a Mech that goes about 100kph at minimum... the Crab 27B CRB-27B[mwo.smurfy-net.de] would also be an option. Its not quite as fast as the other ones, but it takes a beating like the big ones.


All that being said... go with the mech you enjoy the most. There is nothing wrong with the Phoenix Hawk when you want the Phoenix Hawk.

[PocketYoda]

I know its not for Trial but you might like the Assassins when you can get them.

[Sleeper]

Use it as a hit and run mech or sniper. I have one variant with 3xERLL and another one using 2xPPCs both with ECM very effective. The ROC build with 2xSRM4 & ML - hover around and support heavies and assualts taking opportunity shots.

[Super-XIX]

The Phoenix Hawk was the only Trial mech I got any good use out of, but I didn't buy one. It was fun, though. You'd probably do just fine in T4-5 with it.