Frustrated: I want to like this game

[your literal mum]

I want to like this game, I really do. All my friends have been telling me to buy it for months and I finally caved and now I feel like I've wasted my money. It's not a bad game per se, there's just so many minor issues that work together to become something far worse than the sum of their parts.

1) hacking is awful. If the minigame weren't seizure-inducing enough, the controls are terrible.
2) combat is awful. Aiming is floaty and imprecise, and when you do hit, half the time it doesn't register. Sometimes enemies seem to have hitboxes eight feet wide and sometimes they seem to have hitboxes the size of a bean. I've had direct chest-shots miss and obvious misses insta-kill.
3) the save system is awful. The checkpoints keep dropping me right in the middle of a group of enemies. I want to do a stealth run, but it's impossible because every time I die, I've got keep going back back back back through the checkpoints until I find one that won't auto-blow my cover.

All of this stuff combines to make stealth a million times harder than it needs to be. Oh look, that sneaky headshot flew off into a bush somewhere and all the guards heard. Oh look, the hacking game screwed up and selected something 1 to the left where you wanted, and the alarms have been set off. Oh look, we've randomly dropped you in the middle of a group of angry terrorists standing up and waving your arms and now we want you to be stealthy. Good luck!

If I genuinely screw up and the guards get alerted, it's my fault. If the game keeps screwing up and dropping combat on my head, it's the game's problem. It's frustrating, and it's just not fun.

Sure, you can do your standard cover-based run-and-gun COD mode thing, but that's not why I got the game. I like the ambiance, I like the dialogue, I like the characters, I like what I've seen of the skill tree so far, but it seems like the actual gameplay is just terrible. The fun dialogue doesn't make up for the missions.

What am I missing here? I respect my friends enough to believe there's a reason to hang in there with this game, but right now I'm just sick of it and want to uninstall it. Help me out here guys.

[Hara]

What difficulty are you playing on? My first ever playthrough was on hard, and when you're not used to the inaccurate weapons, sticky cover that can't be trusted to hide you from enemies in front and so forth, that becomes painful. I stopped playing two years ago stuck on what I think is the last boss battle.

I started a new playthrough this month, also wanting to do the proper stealthy spy experience, but on easy because I did not want to let the game's short-comings repeatedly hit me in my face again. It seems on easy enemies are a lot less eager to set off the alarms when they spot you.
I'd advise to start an angry commando kind of character on normal difficulty, and do it guns blazing (it can actually be fun). That way getting spotted isn't a failure, and you can familiarize yourself with the maps before doing them stealth. Knowing some hiding places from a previous playthrough gives you that edge needed to act like a super spy.

Also, it's a terrible port, and as of such I found that using a gamepad worked better. Ones accuracy with the mouse doesn't translate to the imprecise weapons of this game.

[sagevallant]

I've never had any issues playing on PC, outside of that mouse acceleration on the sniper rifle. Minigames were a bit of a challenge at first but I usually ace them now so it just took practice.

Shooting? I feel like anyone complaining about the shooting is upset that it takes a second to aim. Yes, your shots go off randomly if you don't take the time to aim and set up. It slants the gameplay toward stealth. Take pistols, take the time to get your critical locked in, and shoot at the right moment to avoid detection. Although after you sink enough points into any weapon your accuracy should be just fine anyway.

What? A game where your character gets better at stuff as he levels up and gains experience? What is this, an RPG? Oh wait, yeah, it is. :p

[BokeemRay]

AP is not a game you should be "caved" into getting. It should be something you yourself become interested in to buy. Yes AP has a lot of issues. The AI is bad, combat is bad, hacking can be the end of your controller/keyboard from smashing it to pieces in frustration after repeated failure, and stealth is damn near hard at most times. However there was always something about it that kept me playing more and more. Perhaps because I was always into 007 movies but I think its because its a genuine choose your own adventure.

The actor that played Mike Thornton said in an interview that even he saw the chaos Obsidian went through in development. The game had a lot of potential but it fell short thanks to its bugs. Though I can name a few buggy games that are now applauded as the "best games ever". Keep going at it. The more you level up and improve your skill sets, the easier it will be.

[DiamondPugs]

I love this game. So I'll give you some tips, and then you may like it!

Originally posted by Banned on Television:

1) hacking is awful. If the minigame weren't seizure-inducing enough, the controls are terrible.

Are you playing with K/M or controller. Controller is highly recomended for the hacking mini-game. There's people that uses the controller just for that. If you want to avoid hacking you can learn to use EMP granades for that on the first upgrade of Sabotage.

2) combat is awful. Aiming is floaty and imprecise, and when you do hit, half the time it doesn't register. Sometimes enemies seem to have hitboxes eight feet wide and sometimes they seem to have hitboxes the size of a bean. I've had direct chest-shots miss and obvious misses insta-kill.

It is not bad. It is just different. Keep in mind that this game was made as an RPG and not a third person shooter even though we can argue that that's what actually is.
It is worse at the beginning because you don't have much upgrades and they do make a difference. For shooting always go for critical hit (As you upgrade the weapon skill the aiming dots will get closer faster for critical hit). All weapons are extremely accurate when they are in critical hit, and once you upgrade the pistol skill you have the marksman skill that lets you slow time and take a couple of critical hits (Like Splinter Cell). If you go for headshots you can clear rooms really fast. The other weapons have similar things when you upgrade them.

3) the save system is awful. The checkpoints keep dropping me right in the middle of a group of enemies. I want to do a stealth run, but it's impossible because every time I die, I've got keep going back back back back through the checkpoints until I find one that won't auto-blow my cover.

Even though sometimes it gets you close to enemies you always have a chance for crunching, and go for cover (There is one mission in Saudi Arabia that has a bug that spawns you right in front of enemy sight though). When you are in crunch position or in cover you are really hard to see (specially if you have the first stealth upgrade and the digital camouflage equipped). If you go for a stealthy playthrough all you need to upgrade is the pistol, stealth, and the second upgrade of sabotage (This one makes mini-games easier)

Oh look, the hacking game screwed up and selected something 1 to the left where you wanted, and the alarms have been set off.

I almost forget, on the hacking mini-games if you screw up and you know you won't be able to finish it in time you can abort it. As long as you abort it before the time runs out the alarm won't be activated.

I really advise you to give it some time. The start is the frustrating one, after a few upgrades you get the hand of it, and you become an overpowered stealthy (or killing) machine. If you blow up your cover just kill everyone and get the alarm off. The guards of all the other sectors won't even know the alarm went on. It's a very forgiving system.

Good luck!

[Xhazahh]

In order to alleviate the irritation of breaking stealth on a miss i ALWAYS go martial arts with stealth. after a while it wont at all how many/where they are because you'll be stealth killing/knocking them out. the only gun i found to be even slightly useful was the pistol and even that had its issues.

[manthathascomputer]

If this game only had the dialogue and choices, it would be in my top 10. Add in the terrible, terrible mini games, ♥♥♥♥ combat, and all around poorly designed missions and it's frustratingly terrible.

[sagevallant]

Yeah. How dare an RPG have skills related to your combat, that you have to level to improve your abilities. :p

Combat is mostly fine imo. Not that I go running in stupidly in the first place, this isn't Doom. Creep in, pick people off, keep it quiet. I don't get all the complaints about the mini games, the only one I ever had trouble with was hacking. The rng aiming system discourages you from Run n Gun, that's not a bad thing in an espionage game. But its perfectly functional once you've got the levels into your weapon of choice. Even SMGs, though that certainly takes a while...

[BokeemRay]

Exactly, once you get leveled up, the frustration doesnt become as much. The mini games become easier if you level up your Sabotage skillset. Or if you hate minigames that much, carry a stack of EMPs so you can just disable the locks without having to hack them.

[DiamondPugs]

Originally posted by sagevallant:

I don't get all the complaints about the mini games, the only one I ever had trouble with was hacking.

That's odd. I find hacking quite easy. The one that usually gets me in trouble is picklocking.

[diligent_d]

Adding the boss fights are a bit of confounding decision, in my opinion. Would have been nice if there was also a non-combat way to kill each of the bosses...

[DiamondPugs]

Originally posted by damonjames2003:

Adding the boss fights are a bit of confounding decision, in my opinion. Would have been nice if there was also a non-combat way to kill each of the bosses...

I didn't like bosses neither. That's one of my main complains about this game.

[BokeemRay]

Originally posted by MadXav:

Originally posted by damonjames2003:

Adding the boss fights are a bit of confounding decision, in my opinion. Would have been nice if there was also a non-combat way to kill each of the bosses...

I didn't like bosses neither. That's one of my main complains about this game.

I found them to be easy after a while. I just activate my Chain Shot skill with the most damaging ammo type and in no time the fight is over.

[Awareness]

Here's what I did, I put all my points into stealth and pistols. And 3 points into the hacking thingy. After I picked up half a million tranquiliser ammo from the "shoot guy in his balls" mission I pretty much cleared most and it was a breeze. The steel core ammo and a chainshot stacked on a boss' head did the rest. I def also had some immersion breaking bugs, especially related to reloading a save and doors somehow locking behind you denying you access to an earlier part of the map :<

If you can get over that though the game is pretty fun :3

[sagevallant]

The doors locking behind you is a pretty common thing in video games these days, unfortunately. A poor decision in a stealth game, but such is modern gaming. :(

I can understand the frustration with the boss fights. The game in general is designed to punish you for always dealing with all your problems the same way, and does force you to vary up your approach at times, which I would consider to be a good thing rather than bad. But the bullet-sponge bosses are a weak point. And they don't even sponge that many bullets, if you're using Chain Shot. Pistols are undeniably the best gun in the game.

[Cosmic Monster]

I tried to play about ten minutes ago and the game will not launch. I know that I tried it when I bought it, just briefly, in order to make sure it works. :( Life is like that at times.