Multiplayer [Dedicated servers]

[ReebokRaidZ]

Ive seen this game a coupe times in videos, this is what ive been looking for though i would like to know if there is a plan to have large multiplayer servers, id really like to experience this game on a server that has 30+ people on it, maybe even have a few large scale battles

Edit: I was only wanting to put out that servers (With a reasonable or large player count) would be nice and possibly a great addition as this game is cool, and someone mentioned mod support in the comments that would be cool aswell, i know there a small group making the game but if its possible i wanted to mention it.

[YouTube.com/StoneLegion]

I guess if there was say a lot of sales and a lot of demand for it we prob see something like it someday. But it's going go more on the direction of what people want to see. Spend months working on dedicated backend or adding in 100's of hours of content weighs a lot on small indie games like this.

I have to say I run servers, I love running servers, but at the same time I realistically understand.

[Noita]

Originally posted by YouTube.com/StoneLegion:

I guess if there was say a lot of sales and a lot of demand for it we prob see something like it someday. But it's going go more on the direction of what people want to see. Spend months working on dedicated backend or adding in 100's of hours of content weighs a lot on small indie games like this.

I have to say I run servers, I love running servers, but at the same time I realistically understand.

Bingo. Having worked on, built and supported various forms of "dedicated server" client server architecure, it's way more than "just adding" a server that "allows more people to play" for sure. These things take dev hours, and more than not, there is not a one-solution-fits-all. Unless they expand their team and bring on an extra engineer focused and experienced in this type of work- there is little value *at this point* even though I also prefer this method of gaming w/ friends or others as the same arguement can be made for bringing on another engineer to support the growing content requests.

[mageproto]

a headless client that is booted via command line that only launches the save (by name) and then sits in a terminal window is nothing unheard of.

[Yinyang]

Originally posted by ReebokRaidZ:

Ive seen this game a coupe times in videos, this is what ive been looking for though i would like to know if there is a plan to have large multiplayer servers, id really like to experience this game on a server that has 30+ people on it, maybe even have a few large scale battles

+1 Please add dedicated servers, I would buy this game if dedicated servers are out.

[Kankaku]

Originally posted by YouTube.com/StoneLegion:

I guess if there was say a lot of sales and a lot of demand for it we prob see something like it someday. But it's going go more on the direction of what people want to see. Spend months working on dedicated backend or adding in 100's of hours of content weighs a lot on small indie games like this.

I have to say I run servers, I love running servers, but at the same time I realistically understand.

Content over servers any day.

[mageproto]

I believe what the point of dedicated server is content that is not dependent on a host playing locally so any one can hop on while your buddy is working. while that is a subset of people, having that allows for the creation of user based modifications that can then effect the wider range of people connecting to that server an example of this server based mods look at plugins back in early minecraft days.

Edit: Sorry, I Know that enabling a platform that does allow user input might be the time consuming method. where as a simple headless is the faster dirtier method. the trade offs of the right way vs the fast way.

[Kankaku]

Originally posted by mageproto:

I believe what the point of dedicated server is content that is not dependent on a host playing locally so any one can hop on while your buddy is working. while that is a subset of people, having that allows for the creation of user based modifications that can then effect the wider range of people connecting to that server an example of this server based mods look at plugins back in early minecraft days.

Well that would be redundant as the game doesn't have mod support yet. So hopefully after that's added I guess.

They'd also probably want to do some balance passes to allow pvp or open those settings in a server setup. Those things take time.

[mageproto]

while mod support would be, Early some might even say putting the cart before the horse. I believe the simple implementation of a headless client that is not attached to a char and only a world. would allow the current coop hosting to happen in a dedicated manner this has be done before. while i cant think of a direct case recently examples would be arma, rimworld multiplayer (this is a mod that allowed the use of a headless client to allow client connections where the connections can use a password to remotely command the headless client). I believe Terraria had something along these lines before dedicated servers became a thing.

[YouTube.com/StoneLegion]

I just want to say headless mode not as easy as one thinks... Mostly because this is their own custom engine. This not Unity, etc where they have things already split up and can pretty much click a button and fix a few bugs or issues during compiling of the game.

A lot more work would be needed.

[mageproto]

The hardest bit of all of it is the netcode which is already done. custom engine or not all the code is there and is honestly already how i plan to run my families "dedicated" server i simple had to purchase a second copy of the game and its running on a VM just happened to have a Char attached. so while this is not headless its not difficult to draw the line that it can be done. that and prior cases where i remember this happening before the devs eventually made a dedicated platform. only issues with this method are i have to vnc in rather than just ssh should anything need doing on the "server".

[YouTube.com/StoneLegion]

Yes but for headless you need to start removing client only elements that are not marked as client only elements. Firing off sound effects, visuals, cinematics, the list goes on and on. If there base code is not super clean and organized this could be even more of an undertaking. I been running servers for almost 30 years I know my stuff. Sadly some people think it could take 10 hours and it's done where it could take them 100's or more. There only 2 programmers and 2 artists and a lot of other things are higher priority right now.

[Kankaku]

Originally posted by mageproto:

The hardest bit of all of it is the netcode which is already done. custom engine or not all the code is there and is honestly already how i plan to run my families "dedicated" server i simple had to purchase a second copy of the game and its running on a VM just happened to have a Char attached. so while this is not headless its not difficult to draw the line that it can be done. that and prior cases where i remember this happening before the devs eventually made a dedicated platform. only issues with this method are i have to vnc in rather than just ssh should anything need doing on the "server".

Well even if all the netcode was available for essentially "plug and play" that still doesn't mean the packet pass through is viable. They also are having some disgruntled opinions on how the co op is implemented already. They probably oughta get that sorted out first.

[M.I.K.E.]

Yes, standalone dedicated server files would be nice!

[mageproto]

Originally posted by YouTube.com/StoneLegion:

Yes but for headless you need to start removing client only elements that are not marked as client only elements. Firing off sound effects, visuals, cinematics, the list goes on and on. If there base code is not super clean and organized this could be even more of an undertaking. I been running servers for almost 30 years I know my stuff. Sadly some people think it could take 10 hours and it's done where it could take them 100's or more. There only 2 programmers and 2 artists and a lot of other things are higher priority right now.

so it sounds like you have intimate knowledge of this engine. i have been running servers my self for many years. i have seen all sorts of setup for server while that doesn't make me qualified to talk about how to implement a server I have also done quite a bit of work on the programming side for some homebrew/private servers for setups that didn't have a dedicated or publicly available server files.

while Kankaku is 100% correct that they have other fish to fry in fixing interaction bugs and connection issues that are already in the client. once that is done all that is needed is a constraint that allows the launching of the client bypassing above mentioned elements, you know with out ripping them out because its not needed to remove.

but something like './file' or 'file.exe' -Dedi "world" "link to settings.ini for perimeters"

would be enough and yes this would need the devs to put forth some time as unless this was already planned from the start it would need to be implemented. investment time would be directly related to how the system initiates. Again this would be using a client as a dedicated host not a dedicated server. But if using something like a virtual frame buffer, we do not really care that its doing beeps n bloops as long as its hosting as those beeps and bloops are being directed into the void while it does take extra processing power to handle those this is the trade off of a dedicated host.

[Noita]

Originally posted by YouTube.com/StoneLegion:

I just want to say headless mode not as easy as one thinks... Mostly because this is their own custom engine. This not Unity, etc where they have things already split up and can pretty much click a button and fix a few bugs or issues during compiling of the game.

A lot more work would be needed.

Bingo again. I'll add that in many cases, engines that have networking built in still don't have the capacity to "up and support" games out of the box at the flip of the switch. If the games application structure does not support the structure required for the various methods of dedicated server architecture, the effort required is often less worth than focusing on features that provide more draw to the game.