Why would I lose reputation when encountering a ship ?

[There is no Mango]

Hey,

I don't get this.
When I encounter a ship in space that I do not have a positive reputation with, I can bribe them not to report me.

Report me for what exactly ? Why would I suffer a reputation penalty just for encountering a ship in space ? How does that make any sense whatsoever ?

I don't understand the logic behingd this design at all.

[davea]

I agree that explaining this definitely needs to happen within the game itself. This is a very popular question. There are answers in a few places including the lore book, other threads here, and the wiki; but still many new players express frustration with this. I hope reading the other thread where you posted ("rep loss for everything") has given you the information you requested.

[Boardwalker]

Perhaps I'm an outlier, but I was never once frustrated by the reputation system. Kinda the opposite actually -- I was quite intrigued by it, and its challenge. I personally think it's a great "hook" into the game because it can provide long-term goals (getting positive rep with all factions, acquiring high-level permits, etc) and makes you consider your combat and non-combat decisions more carefully.

Why do you lose rep for people trying to kill you? Besides the typical faction reasons, there could be any number of other explanations. Maybe they think you might be a threat. Maybe they don't like the look of you, or your ship. Maybe you're carrying valuable cargo and they're not happy when you don't hand it over. Maybe they're bloodthirsty, jealous, naturally aggressive, inherently disagreeable, greedy, righteous, vengeful, territorial, crazy, suffering from space rage, etc. Maybe one of their crew has a grudge against one of your crew. Maybe one of your officers slept with their captain's wife. The list could go on.

[Trese Brothers]

@DumbCustomer - thanks for the feedback and for leaving the review! Sorry that you have had such a negative experience with the game.

To quote someone else describing it:

"Until you are known for your loyalty (positive reputation/rank/trade permit) you are always a possible threat as well as a possible agent of another faction. So you get controlled and bullied by basically everyone. Fleeing from those controls means you must have to hide something, so you lose rep. Surrendering comes with little consequences when your reputation is not negative, so it´s the way to go in early game. Bribing is pretty cheap too."

Another way to say it is that your support is proven, not assumed. While some modern legal systems like to vie for "innocent until proven guilty" the neo-feudal world of Star Traders takes the reverse view.

[There is no Mango]

You know, I have read the words written on the subject.
None of it makes any sense, however much a convoluted story is invented to justify it. Hell there are a ton of crappy books or movies. Does any of the Pacific Rim make any sense ? Nope. Do mysterious people become guard dogs of stuff on the Steam forums and justify anything just as a reaction to opposite harsh reactions ? Sure.

I can probably invent a story that would justify a FPS with every gun damaging the player for the same damage they inflict.
Doesn't make it a good game in the end regardless. Probably.

But anyway I wish you will get as much success as Pacific Rim to make another game regardless, of which I have no doubt of. Please don't follow the example of Pacific Rim 2 though, and actually capitalize on the oh so many people who tell you it doesn't make any sense to maybe try something that does on the next one though (so, NOT like Pacific Rim 2) !

[Trese Brothers]

Thanks for the feedback. I have not seen Pacific Rim, but we're always working hard to improve the game. Update #72 out yesterday.

[There is no Mango]

Do not, I repeat, DO NOT watch Pacific Rim.
It's a life paradigm changing experience, and not for the best, probably a project Ultra experiment revival about how to induce localized strokes in humanoids.

[Trese Brothers]

Originally posted by DumbCustomer:

Do not, I repeat, DO NOT watch Pacific Rim.
It's a life paradigm changing experience, and not for the best, probably a project Ultra experiment revival about how to induce localized strokes in humanoids.

Thanks for the advice. I will take it :D It sounds bad. I really dislike exactly what you are describing in movies.

[Frank "The Senate" Sheev]

Originally posted by Boardwalker:

Perhaps I'm an outlier, but I was never once frustrated by the reputation system. Kinda the opposite actually -- I was quite intrigued by it, and its challenge. I personally think it's a great "hook" into the game because it can provide long-term goals (getting positive rep with all factions, acquiring high-level permits, etc) and makes you consider your combat and non-combat decisions more carefully.

Why do you lose rep for people trying to kill you? Besides the typical faction reasons, there could be any number of other explanations. Maybe they think you might be a threat. Maybe they don't like the look of you, or your ship. Maybe you're carrying valuable cargo and they're not happy when you don't hand it over. Maybe they're bloodthirsty, jealous, naturally aggressive, inherently disagreeable, greedy, righteous, vengeful, territorial, crazy, suffering from space rage, etc. Maybe one of their crew has a grudge against one of your crew. Maybe one of your officers slept with their captain's wife. The list could go on.

I'm in the same boat actually. Maybe it's just the game's cheerful exterior that sends the wrong message to a lot of players but personally, I always felt like ST:F is about those ruthless interstellar politics and the rep system conveys the main idea of it quite well: you should trust no one.

[davea]

How can the game communicate this feeling better to new players? An officer dialog, like for your first desertion, upon your first negative rep gain? (Keep in mind most players' first trade in the game is a negative rep gain due to the enforced trade ban.)

[Trese Brothers]

Hopefully playing the Faen storyline will help drive that home :D

[davea]

I don't think the Faen storyline will help, at least not in time. The player needs to understand that you will have enemies from the start because you have to actively build trust first. You pretty much can't do anything about it, and it won't kill you.

[Trese Brothers]

Originally posted by dave:

I don't think the Faen storyline will help, at least not in time. The player needs to understand that you will have enemies from the start because you have to actively build trust first. You pretty much can't do anything about it, and it won't kill you.

Thanks for the feedback! We'll keep working to improve.

[Boardwalker]

Originally posted by Frank "The Senate" Sheev:

Originally posted by Boardwalker:

Perhaps I'm an outlier, but I was never once frustrated by the reputation system. Kinda the opposite actually -- I was quite intrigued by it, and its challenge. I personally think it's a great "hook" into the game because it can provide long-term goals (getting positive rep with all factions, acquiring high-level permits, etc) and makes you consider your combat and non-combat decisions more carefully.

Why do you lose rep for people trying to kill you? Besides the typical faction reasons, there could be any number of other explanations. Maybe they think you might be a threat. Maybe they don't like the look of you, or your ship. Maybe you're carrying valuable cargo and they're not happy when you don't hand it over. Maybe they're bloodthirsty, jealous, naturally aggressive, inherently disagreeable, greedy, righteous, vengeful, territorial, crazy, suffering from space rage, etc. Maybe one of their crew has a grudge against one of your crew. Maybe one of your officers slept with their captain's wife. The list could go on.

I'm in the same boat actually. Maybe it's just the game's cheerful exterior that sends the wrong message to a lot of players but personally, I always felt like ST:F is about those ruthless interstellar politics and the rep system conveys the main idea of it quite well: you should trust no one.

Ha, yep, agreed.

[['w']]

Guess you should start out with negative rep with factions, who want to be hostile towards you.

Like in wing commander privateer, where it was possible to achieve a positive rep with pirates, when you never attacked them at the beginning and helped them.

or communicate that you can patrol a world to raise rep.

different background or music regarding different rep could also help a little

[davea]

The first few events of the first plotline cause one faction to become hostile to you. Once somebody has played a few games they will probably have some games where they completely ignore this first plotline, and they can put effort to avoid or heal any negative rep. (Apparently few, but non-zero number of players try this.) Although I feel the rep system needs to be explained better in-game, I prefer seeing the negative rep develop organically due to events that I either caused, or at least saw happen.