Swordsman/Assassin (Pistoleer or Spy?)

[Professor Von-Wulfen ]

Hi all.
My Swordsman/Assassin now has access to the 3rd job.
What are the benefits or disadvantages of adding either Pistoleer or Spy as the 3rd profession?

[Grigsey]

Pistoleer: some initiative buffs and general good buffs that don't require that many levels to get, most pistol skill (assuming pistol/sword combo is what you are looking for), more evasion.

Spy: some stealth synergies, ability to steal intel upon boarding, more stealth dodge to the build, some random points in electronics for your ship.

other ideas to consider: zealot or military officer (if you can put at least 11 levels into each) both classes can get you good on initiative roll buffs that yield +initiative.

[Professor Von-Wulfen ]

Originally posted by Grigsey:

Pistoleer: some initiative buffs and general good buffs that don't require that many levels to get, most pistol skill (assuming pistol/sword combo is what you are looking for), more evasion.

Spy: some stealth synergies, ability to steal intel upon boarding, more stealth dodge to the build, some random points in electronics for your ship.

other ideas to consider: zealot or military officer (if you can put at least 11 levels into each) both classes can get you good on initiative roll buffs that yield +initiative.

Many thanks.
I like the idea of stealing intel, but in terms of pure combat would the pistoleer top spy?

[Grigsey]

Originally posted by Baron Von-Wulfen:

Originally posted by Grigsey:

Pistoleer: some initiative buffs and general good buffs that don't require that many levels to get, most pistol skill (assuming pistol/sword combo is what you are looking for), more evasion.

Spy: some stealth synergies, ability to steal intel upon boarding, more stealth dodge to the build, some random points in electronics for your ship.

other ideas to consider: zealot or military officer (if you can put at least 11 levels into each) both classes can get you good on initiative roll buffs that yield +initiative.

Many thanks.
I like the idea of stealing intel, but in terms of pure combat would the pistoleer top spy?

Kinda depends on difficulty I'd assume, and a slight amount of subjectivity. Spy would help a lot if you plan on pumping a decent amount of levels, specially if they use the armor w/ the stealth defense. Increases crit chance w/ talents. Downside, not nearly as much pistol as one would like for harder settings.

Pistoleer gets you the talents you want out of it faster, gives enough pistol, and evasion, but kinda caps out at a certain point. Minimal investment needed. Tho not nearly as many other game aspect synergies (like the extra stealth skill which is helpful in a few non-combat things). Except the evasion synergy, which is pretty nice.

Either one is a fine choice for playing at least upto hard difficulty.

I'd be curious the opinion of people who play on impossible.

[Seswatha]

Assassin until you have 14 stealth, min 5/Spy 1 (for vanishing act)/Swordsman rest for a melee dodge build

Assassin 2-5/Zealot 1/Swordsman rest for an armored melee build.

I'm not sure why you think pistoleer would be good. A pistoleer could use swordsman for some extra evasion and parry but the build would be like Spy 2-11 (depending on the talents you want)/Swordsman 2/Pistoleer rest.

I play on impossible :P.

[Grigsey]

Originally posted by Seswatha:

I'm not sure why you think pistoleer would be good. A pistoleer could use swordsman for some extra evasion and parry but the build would be like Spy 2-11 (depending on the talents you want)/Swordsman 2/Pistoleer rest.

low level investment buffs and evasion boost. have worked it into a few combat classes, works fine for hard and less.

[219A730]

For pistoleer, there're some talents that benefit both sword and pistol. Raining steel for +3 init and +15% critical. Aimed focus for +25% all damage, +10% critical, restore morale (10 + evasion). Dueler's Stance for +20% deflection, +25% parry, +25 dodge, +50 resist debuff, and remove debuffs. I didn't list everything to keep things brief. You get most of the important stuff with 5 job ranks of pistoleer for the sword. After that, the talents aren't as useful for a blade focused combatant.

[Seswatha]

I'd rather pick bravery line for a swordsman and I'm not really sold on multiple on init skills.

Swordsman also has enough moves to use for self buffing like slashing retreat etc.

You're never gonna be good at both shooting and melee and offhand blades are weak for attacking and more of a +parry trinket.

I do use pistoleer in rifle builds as aimed focus/raining steel are actually much better when +ranged damage/accuracy works, but I don't see the appeal for a melee sword build.

Swordsman already has a huge number of talents that are more or less a must:

Sharp Counter
Slashing Retreat (if dodge build), replaced by Unstoppable force from Zealot if armored
Bravery Line
Balanced Blade (since it's basically free with Sharp Counter)
Strength Of Steel
Flash Fury
Rash Courage (to move back when knocked to p3)

I'm not sure you need much more.

[219A730]

I've done it before assassin existed, but now I haven't touch pistoleer for some time.

[Seswatha]

Assassin isn't great tbh, but it has the best stealth progression so it's more or less a must to get to 14 stealth and use the best stealth armor.

[JimmysTheBestCop]

Is it your Captain? What are his stats? What is his position in battle?

If my Captain is a Swordsman I usually have him at #1 spot. He doesn't ever really take a hit. I usually go Military Officer and Spy.

But I am using most of those job's talents on non combat. All I really need are swordsman talents. All of that stealth talent works if he isn't in spot #1 but most waste a turn. If I have a combat captain thats a non buffer/healer his primary job is damage dealing. I don't want to waste any initiative on not dealing damage.

Honestly I don't even like the "On Initiative" talents except maybe if your exploring for Xeno's. Boarding battles once you are past the 1st round all of my combat is only 1 turn on the average. Its not enough turns for those talents to even fire often.

All I really need for my Captain Swordsman is:
Balanced Blade, Sharp Counter, Strength of Steel, Flash Fury, Bladesman Rally

Out of them my most important ones are Balanced Blade and Flash Fury. So you can apply self buff and then use flash fury to swap enemy spots of 2 and 3 to get rid of the full auto talent. Or knock their swordsman into spot 3.

My captain at #1 almost never takes 2 hits in a battle and almost never gets knocked from spot 1. And most boarding battles take what like 5 to 8 boarding battles.

Assassin does have some good talents but after playing I just felt they aren't needed on the Captain swordsman if you build him to battle upon creation. I rather go with jobs that help other aspects of the game. Assassin just has Zero talents outside of combat and mostly all of their talents need stealth enabled. I've learned my captain doesn't even need stealth enabled its a waste of an attack in 90% of the battles.

Zealot at least has several crew combat talents and a lot of non crew combat talents that can help other areas.

[nephilimnexus]

Originally posted by Baron Von-Wulfen:

I like the idea of stealing intel, but in terms of pure combat would the pistoleer top spy?

Technically, yes, but in practice, no.

While adding pistoleer would open up even more combat talents to your fighter, a swordsman/assassin already has more combat talents availible than they'll ever need, so there's no real point to it.

Spy, on the other hand, will also unlock your pistol/blade combo weapon and add to your stealth rating. That's important because assassin also has stealth so put the two together, along with stealth armor, and you're basically untouchable, now.

[Professor Von-Wulfen ]

Originally posted by JimmysTheBestCop:

Is it your Captain? What are his stats? What is his position in battle?

If my Captain is a Swordsman I usually have him at #1 spot. He doesn't ever really take a hit. I usually go Military Officer and Spy.

But I am using most of those job's talents on non combat. All I really need are swordsman talents. All of that stealth talent works if he isn't in spot #1 but most waste a turn. If I have a combat captain thats a non buffer/healer his primary job is damage dealing. I don't want to waste any initiative on not dealing damage.

Honestly I don't even like the "On Initiative" talents except maybe if your exploring for Xeno's. Boarding battles once you are past the 1st round all of my combat is only 1 turn on the average. Its not enough turns for those talents to even fire often.

All I really need for my Captain Swordsman is:
Balanced Blade, Sharp Counter, Strength of Steel, Flash Fury, Bladesman Rally

Out of them my most important ones are Balanced Blade and Flash Fury. So you can apply self buff and then use flash fury to swap enemy spots of 2 and 3 to get rid of the full auto talent. Or knock their swordsman into spot 3.

My captain at #1 almost never takes 2 hits in a battle and almost never gets knocked from spot 1. And most boarding battles take what like 5 to 8 boarding battles.

Assassin does have some good talents but after playing I just felt they aren't needed on the Captain swordsman if you build him to battle upon creation. I rather go with jobs that help other aspects of the game. Assassin just has Zero talents outside of combat and mostly all of their talents need stealth enabled. I've learned my captain doesn't even need stealth enabled its a waste of an attack in 90% of the battles.

Zealot at least has several crew combat talents and a lot of non crew combat talents that can help other areas.

Cheers
Captain is in position 4. Swordsman position 1.

[Professor Von-Wulfen ]

Once again many thanks for all the feedback.
Ill give Spy a shot :)