Explaining Our Policy on VRM and MOD Support

[matsui]

(This document was originally written in Japanese and translated using AI. We apologize if any parts are difficult to read.)

From the Development Leader, Matsui (Founder of Infiniteloop)
Many users have requested the ability to freely load VRM models or enable MOD support. As the representative of the development team, I would like to share our official stance on this matter.

At this time, we have no plans to implement a feature that allows loading VRM models. Below, I will explain our reasoning.


(1) Our Goal is to Create High-Quality, Official Desktop Mascots
This project was founded on the idea of creating high-quality desktop mascots, both in terms of 3D models and motion, that will satisfy core fans while securing official approval and collaboration with IP holders.

Although it has not been widely discussed, there are already numerous 3D desktop mascot applications available. However, none of them met our quality expectations. Through our research, we learned that creating a product that satisfies core fans requires a significant investment in development.

From the very beginning, we never intended to create an application where free or low-cost models (such as $1 models) could be easily displayed—many such apps already exist.

Furthermore, even for works that may not have the same popularity as Hatsune Miku but still have a dedicated fanbase, maintaining a sustainable development process requires setting an appropriate price per model. We ask for your understanding in this regard.


(2) Obtaining Authorization from IP Holders
Many IP holders strongly dislike unauthorized, pirated 3D models. Applications that allow the use of such models are unlikely to receive licensing approval for official character usage.

(As many of you know, Crypton Future Media, the company behind Hatsune Miku, has a notably open-minded approach and is an exception to this. However, most Japanese companies tend to be much stricter in this regard.)

Applications that support MODs or allow unrestricted loading of 3D models are generally not considered for official collaborations. This is not about anyone being right or wrong—it is simply a cultural difference.


Previously, I served as the CEO of VirtualCast, a company that created, developed, and promoted the VRM format you are all familiar with. Even at my current company, Infiniteloop, we have released VRM-compatible mobile applications. Because of this background, I believe I understand the philosophy and benefits of VRM better than most.
However, I do not believe that VRM is well-suited for Desktop Mate, nor is it aligned with my vision for this project.

If Desktop Mate becomes more well-known and gains a stronger position, or if we complete collaborations with the IP holders I admire, there might be a possibility of introducing a VRM loading feature. However, that possibility is low, and it is still a long way off.

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VRMとMODに関する説明

本プロダクトの責任者で、インフィニットループ代表取締役会長の松井です。
VRMを自由に読み込めるようにしてほしい／MODを解放してほしい、という声が多いため、開発チームを代表して考えを書かせていただきます。

現在のところVRMを読み込む機能を実装するつもりはありません。その理由を説明していきます。


(1) 我々の作りたいものは、IPホルダー公認の高クオリティのデスクトップマスコットである

このプロジェクトは、IPホルダーの許諾を取り、正式なコラボができるような、本当にコアなファンが満足する3Dモデル・モーションともに高クオリティなデスクトップマスコットを作ろう、という考えからはじまっています。

これまであまり話題になっていませんでしたが、3Dのデスクトップマスコットアプリというのは多数存在します。しかしどれもクオリティ面で満足できませんでした。この調査の過程でコアなファンが満足する良いものを作るにはしっかりお金をかけて制作しなければならないということを学びました。

私たちは、無料モデルや1ドルで買えるモデルが手軽に表示されるアプリを作るつもりは最初からありませんでした。それらは既に数多く存在しているからです。

またMikuほどは人気はないにしてもコアなファンがしっかりいる作品を3Dモデル化するには、単価を高く設定しなければ続けていくことも理解していただきたいです。


(2) IPホルダーの許諾を取得するため

多くのIPホルダーは、正規に作られていない海賊版の3Dモデルを嫌います。そのような3Dモデルを扱うアプリケーションには、キャラクターの使用権を許諾してくれません。
（皆さんもよく御存知の通り、初音ミクで知られるクリプトン・フューチャー・メディア社は非常にオープンな思想を持つ会社で、これにはあたりません。）
一般的な日本の会社はこの傾向が特に強いかもしれません。MODが使われているアプリや自由に3Dモデルを読み込めるアプリとはコラボすらしてくれないでしょう。誰が間違っているわけではなく文化の違いです。


私は以前VirtualCastという会社の社長を勤めていました。皆さんが使ってくれているVRMという規格を作り、育て、世に広めようとしている会社です。現在の所属先であるインフィニットループでもVRM対応のスマホアプリをリリースしています。そのためVRMの思想やその有用性は誰よりも理解しているつもりです。しかしながらDesktop MateはVRMには不向きだと考えていますし、私の作りたいものとは異なります。

Desktop Mateがもっと知れ渡って立場が強くなったり、IPホルダー様との連携が一通り終われば、もしかしたらVRM読み込み機能がリリースされる可能性はゼロではないかもしれません。しかしそれはまだ先の話となります。

[ansair]

Thank you for taking the time to address our concerns and explain your philosophy and your point of view. Like you said, I do believe this is mostly a cultural difference, and also a problem born from expectations - we saw your program and formed certain expectations of how it would work ("This program will work like Wallpaper Engine"), and when you patched out mods, you broke those expectations, and people are angry. It will take some time, but eventually, these angry people will lose interest in the program and leave, and the only people that remain will be the "core, dedicated fanbase" that you mentioned. I wish you the best of luck building a successful software application that those fans can enjoy. I'm not one of those fans, so I will be deleting this software from my library. Have a nice day.

[Poteti Online]

日本語の声明は出さないのでしょうか？
友達に見せようと思ったのですが、翻訳に翻訳を重ねることになると思うので、原文があればうれしいと思いました。

[Isuzuyori]

やはり、他の日本企業との法的問題が原因で、改造対策が実施されたという私の指摘は正しかったのですね。ご説明いただき、心より感謝いたします。

さて、それとは別に、アプリにSteam Workshop機能を導入することはご検討いただけないでしょうか？現在、改造（モッディング）が可能かどうかという点には触れませんが、Steam Workshopを統合することで、ユーザーが公式にDesktop Mateをカスタマイズできるようになり、よりスムーズで安全な環境が提供されると思います。これにより、コミュニティが自由にコンテンツを作成・共有しやすくなるだけでなく、開発者の皆様が追加されるコンテンツの品質や適切性を管理しやすくなるというメリットもあるのではないでしょうか。

さらに、最新のアップデートに不満を抱いているユーザーに対する良い対応策にもなり、より多くのパーソナライズオプションを提供することで、エンゲージメントの向上や長期的なユーザー満足度の向上にもつながると思います。貴社が高品質なアプリや3Dモデルを提供し続ける姿勢を十分に理解しておりますが、適切に管理すれば、この機能を導入することでアプリの価値を損なうことなく、むしろさらに魅力を高めることができるのではないでしょうか。

もちろん、アップロードされるコンテンツの監視など、開発者の皆様にとって追加の負担が発生することも理解しております。ただ、もし可能であれば、将来的にご検討いただけますと幸いです。

お時間をいただき、ありがとうございました。

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So, I was correct in pointing out that modding countermeasures were implemented due to legal issues with other Japanese companies. I truly appreciate the explanation.

That being said, could the Steam Workshop feature be considered for implementation in the app? Without getting into whether modding is still possible or not, integrating Steam Workshop would offer an official and streamlined way for users to customize their Desktop Mate. This would not only empower the community to create and share content more easily but also provide you, the developers, with greater control over the quality and appropriateness of modifications.

Moreover, this could serve as a positive response to users who were dissatisfied with the latest update by giving them more personalization options, ultimately enhancing engagement and long-term user satisfaction. I completely understand your dedication to maintaining a high-quality app and 3D models, and I believe that introducing this feature—if managed properly—would only add value to the app rather than detract from it.

I also recognize that implementing this would require additional effort on your part to oversee the content being uploaded. However, I hope you might consider it at some point in the future.

Thank you for your time.

[Isuzuyori]

Originally posted by RedAISkye:

This is like if Wallpaper Engine banned loading of UGC and removed workshop, just so they can restrict the tool down to their small selection of paid wallpapers of popular characters.

The only reason Wallpaper Engine is amazing is because it allows users to load their own wallpapers, regardless of the copyright content that's shared on workshop. Because it's not the dev's responsibility for what a user creates and shares.

Removing ability for people to load their own models, just because you want to monetize it like a mobile app, defeats the purpose of this tool. :Kagamisan:

Wallpaper Engine Team is German and subject to German laws and regulations. Infiniteloop is Japanese and subject to Japanese laws and regulations. Moreover, Infiniteloop must also consider the norms and business practices in Japan, where companies tend to be more restrictive regarding certain types of content. A well-known example is Nintendo, which has taken strict measures concerning the use of its IPs, to the point of being unreasonable in many cases.

Regarding Steam Workshop, since it is a moderated platform, developers may be held responsible for the content they host or allow, depending on their country's laws and Steam’s policies. Additionally, in certain regions, cultural sensitivities may influence what type of content is considered acceptable or problematic. That said, Steam Workshop would have been a good alternative for allowing custom content in this case, precisely because it can be moderated. However, it was not implemented and later removed, and what was actually restricted was the ability to modify the app without limitations. In that sense, your example doesn't seem comparable at all.

It is also important to note that allowing unrestricted content could make it more difficult to obtain certain IP licenses, especially in markets with stricter regulations or where companies are more protective of their brands. This was specifically addressed here in the OP.

I'm not saying this is better or worse; I'm simply explaining the reality. This is especially relevant considering your recent criticism towards users, which also seems to stem from a difference in the understanding of these factors.

If you'd like to use other types of content (mods), you may need to find ways to work around the app’s current implementation. I’d also recommend suggesting your preferred content for official inclusion or requesting any other changes you'd like to see. Additionally, keep advocating for Steam Workshop support, as the developers have left the door open for the possibility of implementing it or something similar to it in the future. Something that, as seen in the post above, I would like to see happening too.

[CringePotato]

You can still have product placement deals and have mod support. Add workshop support, it will reverse most of the negative reviews and get more sales of this product, trust me.

[Isuzuyori]

Originally posted by RedAISkye:

Originally posted by Isuzuyori:

It is also important to note that allowing unrestricted content could make it more difficult to obtain certain IP licenses, especially in markets with stricter regulations or where companies are more protective of their brands. This was specifically addressed here in the OP.

Nothing you stated is relevant here because no one asked them to chase after IPs and there are tons of Japanese made game/tools that are very much mod friendly without any issues.

So, both my comparison with WE is completely valid and my point still stands about the purpose of the tool being rendered useless because of dev's vision of monetizing it like a predatory mobile app. And also that you continue to shill for and lick the boots of the devs that engage in anti-consumer practices, so I will be adding you to my block list and moving on. :karrynWarden:

No one? You might want to check what people have been asking for in the forums in general, and here in particular.

Your comparison is flawed from the start. You're equating Steam Workshop with unrestricted modding, which makes no sense. Steam Workshop is moderated, meaning it allows user-generated content while still letting developers comply with legal and business constraints. What was restricted here wasn't Workshop support, since it never existed in the first place (though I hope it does in the future). What was made harder was modifying the app without restrictions, which is a completely different situation. Your analogy simply doesn't hold up.

And no, what I said is absolutely relevant, whether you like it or not. Companies operate under different legal frameworks, cultural norms, and business strategies. Ignoring that reality doesn't make it disappear. And just because some Japanese developers allow modding doesn't change the fact that many Japanese companies are notoriously restrictive with user-generated content, often due to legal concerns, licensing agreements, or risk aversion. If you don’t believe that, I suggest looking into cases like Nintendo, Square Enix, or even Atlus. How many of those Japanese games and tools that allow unrestricted modding are working with other IP holders also based in their country?

Now, about this whole "predatory monetization" claim. Come on. Predatory mobile games exploit psychological tricks to manipulate users into spending large sums of money, often using artificial time-gating, loot boxes, or pay-to-win mechanics. If this app followed that model, we'd be seeing energy meters, daily login rewards, FOMO-laced gacha mechanics, and content deliberately locked behind paywalls to frustrate users into spending. None of that is happening here. Overpriced DLCs? Sure, I've always agreed on that, and I advocate for either a reduction of the price or an increase on what's being offered. But charging a high price for content is not predatory by itself, unless you're seriously arguing that every expensive piece of software is a scam.

Lastly, I’d love for you to provide a single quote where I’ve been "licking the boots of the devs." Some of you seem to confuse being critical with acting like an entitled prick. There's a massive difference between blindly defending a company and understanding the legal, cultural, and business factors behind their decisions while still wanting changes. If you can't tell the difference, that's on you.

But hey, after throwing out an ad hominem attack, you're now running off to block me instead of actually engaging with arguments. How convenient

[PsyChuan]

damn, guess i won't be bothering with this any more then. i'll be waiting for the inevitable free open-source clone.

what a headass decision.

[Akakun]

We finally have an official statement, at least.

Originally posted by matsui:

If Desktop Mate becomes more well-known and gains a stronger position, or if we complete collaborations with the IP holders I admire, there might be a possibility of introducing a VRM loading feature. However, that possibility is low, and it is still a long way off.

Yeah, not going to happen.

Does Infiniteloop think we are stupid? Mods made posible to hit that 1M of downloads milestone they like so much to brag about it. But hey, not a single word about modding before that.

Then, the screenshot purges started. I don't know if they are aware, but for every picture deleted Steam applies to the author a 24h of user generated content ban on the ENTIRE platform. And yes, these suspensions does stack. So basically, the moment they hit the milestone decided to flip the finger on their userbase and punish them.

And finally, the anti-mod protection arrived. Infiniteloop punished their fans, threw them under the bus and decides to brag on another milestone (1.2M) while promoting their two overpriced muted Mikus.

And the moment their Steam page start reaching the "mixed reviews" area this post finally appears, with that final statement? Yeah, kick your users asses and then ask them for support when things start not looking good. At least you're being honest with the low posibility part. I respect that.

[Nezono]

i mean i loved using the models that i personally made and enjoyed seeing my work come to life on my screen, kinda devastated

[SeriesE233]

I think it’s not so much a cultural difference as a gap between the developers and the users.
-devs want to create (and promote) their own high-quality mascots
-players want to install their favorite characters (“like Wallpaper Engine”)

“If Desktop Mate becomes more well-known and gains a stronger position, or if we complete collaborations with the IP holders I admire, there might be a possibility of introducing a VRM loading feature.”
It’s kind of the opposite. If the software satisfies players’ needs, it will get more popular and IP holders will come in. Even though Desktop Mate reached 1.2M downloads, it’s far from becoming popular because the number of players online is decreased by 80% already.

Thanks for the official statement, though. It was extra helpful.

[Freedom Jizzn't Free]

1. The cultural difference is a lie. Many Japanese companies small and big allow mods and are still collaborating with IPs often. Developers who've done collabs with Miku allow mods on their games without facing cultural stigmas.

2. Does Crypton Future Media even care? Their own games are modifiable and they don't bother going after mods. Why? because people buy the game to use mods.

3. What's special about your Miku model? There's plenty of VRMs of Miku out there that play just as well with all your animations. What special about this app? It's an empty statement to say your app is much more above others when all you have is a model that's head follows a pointer and an alarm. It's not the most complicated features to program.

-It's sad that the devs made a awesome app but it seems like the CEO has a lack of vision for monetizing their devs' work. They clearly failed to understand the appeal and uses of VRM in their previous position.

[waterdragon]

松井さんのお考えを全面的に支持します。
最初からIPに無関係で自分でキャラクターを作成できるようなアプリであればＭＯＤも問題なかったと思いますが、現状IPとの契約がある状態や今後の展開を考えると、このDesktop mateをユーザーに自由にさせるのはリスクも大きく不可能に思います。
私はこのアプリをIP公式のキャラクターグッズのようなものだと理解しています。勝手に改造してしまえば海賊版グッズのようになってしまいます。

ちなみにその昔(25年前くらい？)、デスクトップのキャラクターアプリでペルソナウェアというのがありましたが、その機能やカスタマイズ性に不満を持ったユーザーが自分で伺か(偽春菜)という自由に使える高機能なプラットフォームを作ってしまったなんて事がありました。
現在でしたらツールも沢山ありますし、ハッカーのような技術力のある方は自分で別プラットフォームを作ってしまえば良いような気もします。機能的にも高機能とは言えない画面にキャラクターを表示させるだけのこのDesktop mateにこだわる必要は無いでしょう。

[Nubinator]

Its nice that you guys decided to reply to this, instead of throwing it under the rug. While i do understand your point of view on this. The simple fact is, most people who download(ed) and use(d) this app did it because of the ability to add their own VRM models. Removing this will no doubt impact the users using the app. There are many apps made in japan who allow modding. I do love Desktop Mate and its quality considering its very new, comparing to its counterparts it is quite lacking in features.

[Isuzuyori]

What I'm about to say will probably make certain people less than happy (again, heh), but I think that if people hadn't gone crazy posting left and right about mods, we wouldn't be facing this situation. I'm not saying that people deserve to be blocked, but they were openly saying that they were violating the ToS. I know that the vast majority of people don't read those walls of text in 'legalese,' but ignorance doesn't make you immune to consequences.

That being said, Infiniteloop’s handling of the situation has been terrible. Mods played a significant role in the game's popularity, yet they waited too long to crack down on them. Then came the mass screenshot removals, and whether they intended it or not, Steam’s automated system punished users in ways that seem completely disproportionate. If they had addressed this issue earlier, before mods became such a big part of the community, things might have played out differently.

Playing devil’s advocate, though, it’s possible that Infiniteloop didn’t anticipate how widespread modding would become, especially considering cultural differences in how rules are viewed. In Japan, there tends to be a stronger adherence to rules and regulations, whereas in other regions users may be more willing to bend or ignore them. I'm not saying one approach is better than the other, just that these differences might have influenced how Infiniteloop underestimated the extent to which modding would be embraced, and how openly it would be flaunted. A big mistake? Yes, because they failed to anticipate this while presenting the app to a global audience. But if that was the case, at least it wouldn't have been out of bad faith.

Anyway, a good middle ground could be to add a paid pro version of the app that, aside from being compatible with DLCs without forcing users to buy them again, would include Steam Workshop support. This would allow developers to stay financially alive (since some people might be only interested in mods) while also offering users a more official and controlled way to enjoy mods. Moreover, keeping the free and pro versions coexisting would help avoid potential legal and ethical issues that could arise if they were to just transition the app from free to paid.

Either way, it's clear that this has been a disaster for everyone involved. And hopefully, everyone learned something, and something positive comes out of this.

[Nubinator]

Originally posted by Isuzuyori:

Anyway, a good middle ground could be to add a paid pro version of the app that, aside from being compatible with DLCs without forcing users to buy them again, would include Steam Workshop support. This would allow developers to stay financially alive (since some people might be only interested in mods) while also offering users a more official and controlled way to enjoy mods. Moreover, keeping the free and pro versions coexisting would help avoid potential legal and ethical issues that could arise if they were to just transition the app from free to paid.

This is actually a good idea and something i could get behind, A pro version that has all the features and is mostly up-to-date with the normal release at any given time with the exception of being able to use custom VRM's and is not extremely overpriced could be a saving grace for this software.