Nainstalovat Steam
přihlásit se
|
jazyk
简体中文 (Zjednodušená čínština)
繁體中文 (Tradiční čínština)
日本語 (Japonština)
한국어 (Korejština)
ไทย (Thajština)
български (Bulharština)
Dansk (Dánština)
Deutsch (Němčina)
English (Angličtina)
Español-España (Evropská španělština)
Español-Latinoamérica (Latin. španělština)
Ελληνικά (Řečtina)
Français (Francouzština)
Italiano (Italština)
Bahasa Indonesia (Indonéština)
Magyar (Maďarština)
Nederlands (Nizozemština)
Norsk (Norština)
Polski (Polština)
Português (Evropská portugalština)
Português-Brasil (Brazilská portugalština)
Română (Rumunština)
Русский (Ruština)
Suomi (Finština)
Svenska (Švédština)
Türkçe (Turečtina)
Tiếng Việt (Vietnamština)
Українська (Ukrajinština)
Nahlásit problém s překladem
Pravidla a pokyny k diskuzím
Nahlásit tento příspěvek
As for combos, that is an issue that still needs to be dealt with. I do not want to micromanage my deck. I got worn out from the stacking and creating combos, and I have yet to find using the number keys useful as short cuts. I'm certain things will evolve as time goes on. I cannot be the only one who is worn out from this. They have changed it somewhat since last release after we gave our feedback though, but they still need to do something else.
They could either make some kind of auto stack feature, or just give us the combo glyphs in our deck, or maybe they have some idea that I haven't thought of, but at least they did hear us and changed things affter we gave feedback.
Can you please tell me what armor you use? cloth?leather?plate? and is it the augemented sets.
The idea behind Combo's is fun however..
BUT.. the current system where i need to watch my fkn bar and micromanage my spells, is kinda disgusting, maybe a too strong of a word, but im not sure how else to express my feeling toward how the combo's currently work, and how not fun it is, to the point i need to force myself to play it.. OVER AND OVER AND OVER.. just so i get used to it.. like an aquired taste.. where the fun doesn't just happen and then i can build on that.. instead i gota work on enjoying it first.
I know there are people out there who are 100% into this current system.. and they are like the 1% -ers.. you always get them in games.. and they always provide horrible feedback that gives the DEVs the idea that they are on the right track and to ignore the 99% of everything else..
Diablo3 is prime example of that, with DEVs that kept trying to move forward with their plans, instead of seeing what the community was saying until it was too late.
Then again that game was released way too early.. so much so that they had to nerf the AttackSpeed mechanic while the RMA was still active.. so you can see there was no real testing done behind the scenes other than "if it worked or not" not in an actual playing the game environment.
D3 is actually still guilty of still doing this.. if you have seen the changes to bloodshards and how they are not increasing the bloodshard limit.
I highly doubt a DEV will reply to this thread, mostly because of the holidays right now.
Normally they pick random threads per day to reply to with mostly vaguely info, probably because they don't even know what's happening.
Combo's - You can just click and drag one onto the other (no specific order) to combine them.
Also you can drag like gylphs onto each other to increase the effect and lower the focus cost (over using 2 seperate ones.) I did not discover the 2nd part until much later. I find it difficult to find my R key hold it down and click numbers (others may find it to be easier) but clicking and dragging one onto the other is fine for me personally.
It resets the timer so you have another 10 seconds (or so depending on if you have spent skill points into making them last longer) and the improved one can still be used in combos.
When you have combined 2 like glyphs a number in the lower right will show you how many you have combined, I have had as many as 4 combined before having to use it or lose it as it were.
The system increased in interest to me with the added ability to combine multiples of glyphs so they are A) not wasted if 2 or more are on my bar at the time B) create room for another glyph to come up C) refresh the timer so I have it avialable longer - such as for buffs that I do not at the moment need to recast. Last creating a stronger version of a spell or effect with combined multiples of it and the increased power of any combo I then combine makes it more dynamic and make the (deck building) considerations even more varied.
Yes you do need to pay attention to the bar still but dragging one to another and it then restarts the timer gives you more breaks if you will to pay attention to the action rather than the bar in my opinion.
The combos, ability to combine like glyphs and then the slugs make balancing a deck more interesting and to some extent skillful. Too few cards (minimum) mean higher percentage of slugs (assuming 4 or greater) do you keep your favorite spell or ability down to 3 to have a good rate of availability and combo chance or do you increase it to facilitate build up of 4 to 5 stack and 4 or 5 of its combo to make really big impact. It also means timing the start of your combat can be a factor, waiting for the right build up to use.
It is different than having everything / all the strongest versions of the spell or ability available but I think it is a very interesting mechanic and makes combat more interesting.
I enjoy it currently but again not everyone will and thats fine there are games around for everyone.
It is true that another down side of a fixed / locked hotkey is it can not be used to combo or stack.
Perhaps a way could be found to facilitate a locked combo glyph but with a random timer or other mechanic to simulate it being available if it were in a built deck. Or perhaps you could build a deck and it runs separately and the combo is then lit up and available when it would be in the deck draw. This would have the advantage of a locked bar for those overwhelmed or dislike the normal deck use but still in a seperate or unseen window go through the same mechanics of a normal deck.
Hopefully the dragging mechanic will prove easier enough for you to make it a better experience for you.
PS - in case others have not explored the various focus / tactics options - you can invest skill points
- to cycle / draw glyphs from your deck more quickly - shorter delay
- stay active longer before going away
Those are the ones most helpful to management of the deck mechanic that I noticed.
Also to make your own custom decks rather than fixed or auto (uses every glyph you have) you must spend to get a skill level in Edetic Memory I think it is - though it only mentions some other ability as the gain I think.
FYI I do use combos. Although at this point in their development I find it a bit hectic. Also I really want to play a mage but at this point it is easier to play a melee fighter. Although one thing I do expect is change. Change for the better. For me it is still a bit stressful to try to create combos and stack glyphs, but hopefully they come up with a way to accomplish this without the hassel. Apart from stacking things I think the deck system is already suprior as I said earlier.
People try to make it seem like it's all this skill and potential.
But it's a laggy glitchy mess of button mashing and praying it worked..
The skill to use combo's.. is basically.. the ability to pull out 1 eyeball and put it on your action bar at all times, then look for green highlighted spells, you can combine those into combos.. which you either drag and drop onto each other, or press R and then press the numbers for those button to combine them, after that you need to press the combined ability to cast it..
So about 3 -4 actions just to cast a combo.. meanwhile lag.. gfx glitching, and even pressing R locking up, will just make it a further nuisance
Meanwhile right clicking all the slugs to remove them from your deck.
Meranwhile actually watching the fight.
Meanwhile not just running around like a headless chicken waiting for spells.
Most of the time you will be watching your bar rather than fighting.
And if you are watching the fighting.. chances are you are running around in circles waiting for your spells to pop up.
It is not a fun mechanic.
It is interesting.
The design vs having it play out in a game, are 2 different things, the fun vs not-fun is very much leaning into the not-fun.
Seems like there is potential to make it fun.
But in it's current state.. it's just a stupid mechanic that only the 1% use, and then a few others who use it because of the focus reduction and don't even use it for combo's.
The only part that gets in my way is the creation of combos and stacking glyphs. Other than that it is already working great for me. My suggestion to you is that you give feedback on the sota forums about this and keep in mind this is not set in stone yet. It is still prealpha and this is not its final form.
As for skill I'm able to do quite well with it and I can tell the difference between good opponants and a bad opponant in PvP. So there is skill at work here. This system is NOT random if you are doing it right.
Not sure we can have a discussion when you don't realize you're playing a game.
Sorry.
Completely agree with you here. Combat has to be fun. In fact, the devs have said if the deck system isn't fun, they will fix or change it or even drop it completely. I highly doubt the last option will occur so they will take whatever constructive feedback we can give them.
Regarding combos, you are right on the money with this. They absolutely need to fix the usability issue with this. While the design requires some amount of "plate spinning", there are players (including myself) that are spending the vast majority of the time staring at the hotbar vs. paying attention to the onscreen action.
And combos makes this even worse. There are a lot of threads on the official forums with feedback on how to make it better / more fun. I hope the devs have read those. Everything from auto-stacking, chained combos, and even simple requests like allowing the mouse left-click to make combos and not just the number keys. It's very apparent there are a ton of usability problems with combos so we still have a long ways to go before combat, especially the deck system, is truly "fun" for the majority.
I think you miss the obvious conclusion I am drawing. Let me explain then why I don't care if the combat system is fun or anything else for that matter...
The combat system should not be a minigame that occupies our time. It doesn't need to be fun or intriguing. It needs to be out of our way and help facilitate combat (which is fun). The system itself should feel second nature and be transparent.
So you saying the deck system needs to be fun is really not something I value in a combat system. Give me a combat system that feels so second nature that I don't even notice the game mechanic after a while.
That being said I think they have accomplished it in some parts, but in other areas (like combos and stacking) I think they have some ways to go before it is more of a transparent system that facilitates combat effeciently.
Regardless I stand by what I said, "If you are doing it right then the deck system is far better than a standard deck".
Im starting to see a real divide in people's feedback for the deck system.
Some people can't even explain themself properly, i would hate to be a DEV handling this.
I doubt a DEV will reply to this thread, i would hope they say something, but im not holding my breath.
I don't understand.
I highlighted a bunch of stuff in your reply that just makes me shake my head.
We can start with this... (what you said as an explanation.. or so you thought.)
fun is really not something I value in a combat system.
What you seem like you're saying is.
"I will play this game regardless, my only gripe is i agree with everything you're saying, but i don't want to say so, and i will explain things backwards, because i don't like to enjoy myself when i play a game, i won't give feedback based on if the game made me smile, i don't play games to enjoy myself."
You can stand by what you said all you want, not sure what you mean by the "deck system is far better than a standard deck."
Im guessing you mean the locked vs unlocked.
Another quote of yours.
It doesn't need to be fun or intriguing. It needs to be out of our way and help facilitate combat (which is fun).
This is the only part the made sense.
That being said I think they have accomplished it in some parts, but in other areas (like combos and stacking) I think they have some ways to go before it is more of a transparent system that facilitates combat effeciently.
I'm not sure you know you're talking to another person.. I am not a member of parliament, im just a gamer.. looking to enjoy myself.. be entertained on a game.. you don't need to turn this into politics, it's just confusing, especially when we can't read your mind.
At this point i don't think you're even from earth.
He and others, myself included are not distracted by the deck system and in fact if you plan how you want to fight / cast and focus only on those glyphs that will do that rather than having jack of all trades decks then it is easier to not have to pay attention to the bar because the ones you need are coming up quickly enough you are not stressing over will the right card for a combo, or stack come up before the timer expires etc.
On the other hand you find the system as it currently stands at least to be a stress factor which is detracting from your fun. That is fair - there is no right or wrong opinion on the matter.
I enjoy the deck building concept. I am not the best at multi-tasking my attention and am horrible at those games that require it like say Company of Heroes and some other RTS. I point this out because to me this is not distracting from the combat. I am able to stack and combo and still pay attention to what is going on - onscreen.
Yay for me - not all will. So options that are not too penalizing need to be thought up to facilitate fun factor for various needs.
Having the combat system auto stack and auto build is not only a major AI / process engineering ask I would think but it takes away the skill and dynamics of the system. If you want simple button mashing and scriptable combat there are a host of other games on the market.
I can easily see making the deck / hotbar process a background process if you select a locked bar situation and have seperate glph for combos and or select a set stack # you want it to build automatically if available and then just have buttons with say Heal 2 and Combo X on them on your locked bar. Have the process go through in the background from a deck you build to go with it and the buttons turn green when they are castable and go grey again when the combo has faded from the behind the scenes deck process.
But perhaps you would rather have all combos and all stacks available all the time with only a global cooldown for casting.
I think that model puts us right back to the standard button mashing scripting models used by virtually all other mmorpgs. Not necessarily bad just - common.
Why is it better to use a combat system where i am not being able to use all my learned skills whenever i want?
How can a combat system be better and more player skill demanding if the game decide for me what skills i should use? [/quote]
the skill is in learning how to build a deck to maximize how often a skill is available. Having the available all the time requires no skill at all to use. They are always there and always able to go off when you want. My 9 year old can use that system. My 9 year old can also grab a 3rd party UI or macro template to accomplish artificially what a player could not in the same amount of time by pressing the buttons. You can be as skilled as they come at actually timing it in an all available all the time system. But your skills can be replicated, macroed and even automated. We both know that there are for many MMORPGs with PvP 3rd party mods / add ons that can automate healing and autocast / auto use skills. You can also craete skill chains and macro them. It has its attractions but that is not skill at using them, that is skill and the willingness to go outside the game to abuse the system to win.
I do not dispute that many like, prefer or even depend on those things to actually be good at PvP but to deny that carefully building your deck with just the right amount of glyphs to get your attacks done with regular frequency and the appropriate spending of skill points to also manipulate how often glyphs appear, disappear etc does not require some skill level is to deny the obvious. You may argue it requires some lesser skill or you may argue it just is not your cup of tea but it does require some thought and skill just as it does to decide what chains to put together before automating them.
I submit that it take more work to prepare and execute this combat system than the standard always on variety you are in favor of and will be harder to aide mechanically through automation.
It is new, it means I have to actually pay attention to what is going on and not rely on pre-set series of button pushes and macros to actually defeat my opponent. To me I would think those with the skills of mental quickness, ability to react under pressure and adapt which many pvp folks are would see this as a net gain. It means those who need macros and scripts or someone to tell them how to set it up and do it for the win, will be less likely to be able keep up with me since now they have to use those talents natively and on the fly.
But again it comes down to preferrences and opinons, the above is just my opinion.