Being Mean to Victoria (SPOILERS)

[Zeno]

I tried an experiment on a second play-through: What would happen if I took every opportunity to be mean to Victoria, including not warning her about Nathan or the Dark Room at the party in Episode 4?

Well, as it turns out, it just might save her life: Victoria is not bound on the floor of the Dark Room when Max wakes up there at the beginning of Episode 5. I haven't played through the whole chapter yet, to know whether Jefferson makes any reference to killing her.

Has anyone else tried that?

[Firing Line]

yeah but she should've died so who cares.

[Palatine Katinka]

She only ends up there if you warn her and she believes you. If you are mean, she doesn't believe you even if you try to warn her. She only gets capture by Jefferson because she turns to him for help because she believes Max about Nathan. It's one of the few choices where they deliberately threw us a curveball.

[TangledSkies]

Huh, that's pretty interesting. :) but yeah I have tried that. It didn't go well for me though.

[Inspector]

Originally posted by Palatine Katinka:

She only ends up there if you warn her and she believes you. If you are mean, she doesn't believe you even if you try to warn her. She only gets capture by Jefferson because she turns to him for help because she believes Max about Nathan. It's one of the few choices where they deliberately threw us a curveball.

Oh dang I thought it happens no matter what. :o

[Jeckenn]

Originally posted by Palatine Katinka:

She only ends up there if you warn her and she believes you. If you are mean, she doesn't believe you even if you try to warn her. She only gets capture by Jefferson because she turns to him for help because she believes Max about Nathan. It's one of the few choices where they deliberately threw us a curveball.

Which makes the whole thing about Jefferson being this mastermind psychopath that knows exactly how to blame everyone but himself for all his murders and abductions even more ludicrous. He did not need to do anything with Victoria in fact by kidnapping and killing her he is basically signing his own confession because someone would have known she went to him for help and so even if he got away with murdering Max he would have been a suspect for the disappearance of Victoria 100%. So if he was supposed to be this mastermind that had got away with these abduction/murders for years he must have really started to slip up by the time Max and her friends became his victims.

Jefferson as the bad guy is the really weak part of this story in fact I don't see how Dontnod wrote the rest of the story and then came up with that lame assed bad guy named Mark Jefferson.

[Aymerick L'Mao]

I like to see Max angry and mean against Victoria, it gives both of the characters more consistency

[Flinz]

Originally posted by Jeckenn:

Which makes the whole thing about Jefferson being this mastermind psychopath that knows exactly how to blame everyone but himself for all his murders and abductions even more ludicrous. He did not need to do anything with Victoria in fact by kidnapping and killing her he is basically signing his own confession because someone would have known she went to him for help and so even if he got away with murdering Max he would have been a suspect for the disappearance of Victoria 100%. So if he was supposed to be this mastermind that had got away with these abduction/murders for years he must have really started to slip up by the time Max and her friends became his victims.

Jefferson as the bad guy is the really weak part of this story in fact I don't see how Dontnod wrote the rest of the story and then came up with that lame assed bad guy named Mark Jefferson.

I guess he is bad guy of season 1 but it's just dramatic for Blackwell. Overall Jefferson was probably small player in town and he was able to do his stuff since town/school is what it is, in corrupt state. Jefferson wasn't murderer so likely he doesn't know much about it. He didn't kill victims, just drug them and while they have no memory of it they couldn't know he was snatching few people per year to do some of his art stuff. Basicly when Rachel died it was his downfall and bodies just start piling up on his doorstep. He was done.

Game mainly focused for Blackwell issues so that's where we get bad guys from. But there to be that much problems town must be in terrible hands. There you would likely find real bad guys. But then again we shouldn't expect any real super villains since usually good detective stories have clever plot with normal people. Everyone have their darker side and usually unrevealing them you will find the one who went overboard. If something LiS felt good build up for greater story and it would be nice to see more of it.

[Inspector]

Originally posted by Jeckenn:

Originally posted by Palatine Katinka:

She only ends up there if you warn her and she believes you. If you are mean, she doesn't believe you even if you try to warn her. She only gets capture by Jefferson because she turns to him for help because she believes Max about Nathan. It's one of the few choices where they deliberately threw us a curveball.

Which makes the whole thing about Jefferson being this mastermind psychopath that knows exactly how to blame everyone but himself for all his murders and abductions even more ludicrous. He did not need to do anything with Victoria in fact by kidnapping and killing her he is basically signing his own confession because someone would have known she went to him for help and so even if he got away with murdering Max he would have been a suspect for the disappearance of Victoria 100%. So if he was supposed to be this mastermind that had got away with these abduction/murders for years he must have really started to slip up by the time Max and her friends became his victims.

Jefferson as the bad guy is the really weak part of this story in fact I don't see how Dontnod wrote the rest of the story and then came up with that lame assed bad guy named Mark Jefferson.

I don't think Jefferson was the weak part of the story, because I did not expect it to be him really. I didn't pay attention to all the little details showed to us throughout the game.

[Palatine Katinka]

Originally posted by Max:

I don't think Jefferson was the weak part of the story, because I did not expect it to be him really. I didn't pay attention to all the little details showed to us throughout the game.

He's not a weak part of the story due to being expected. He's weak due to the reveal of his story in episode 5. He only works as a repeat abductor if he manages to covers his tracks and from Kate being alive, Rachel being blamed on Nathan's mistake and the newspapers saying there was no sign of sexual activity we can conclude that Jefferson leaves his victims back in their lives after he has his photos suffering nomore than memory loss that some (not Kate) will pass off as just having had a wild night with too much drink (or other recreational mind altering substances). Thus line of thought falls apart however when Jefferson is then revealed to be on a killing spree of Nathan, Chloe, Victoria and Max. He goes from someone who is careful, has managed to capture multiple women with out being discovered and is disappointed by the accidental death of a victim to someone who will kill three people within twelve hours and intends to kill a fourth.

[x[pricefield]]

It's almost like he knew a storm was coming and there would be a lot of dead bodies... *dramatic music*

[Zeno]

Originally posted by Palatine Katinka:

Thus line of thought falls apart however when Jefferson is then revealed to be on a killing spree of Nathan, Chloe, Victoria and Max. He goes from someone who is careful, has managed to capture multiple women with out being discovered and is disappointed by the accidental death of a victim to someone who will kill three people within twelve hours and intends to kill a fourth.

This is straying pretty far from the point of the OP, but what the heck?

My own read of Jefferson's downfall - based on what he himself says in Episode 5 and on what we can infer from other events and conversations - is that he's less a criminal mastermind than a narcissistic artist type with a bondage-and-loss-of-innocence aesthetic going on, which leads him to abuct, drug, photograph and deceive a series of young women.

He's just clever enough to get away with this, as the young women can generally be convinced they just got carried away at a party. And he's pompous enough to believe he's invulnerable.

But his is an expensive hobby, so he needs access to a source of money. Lots of money. That's where Nathan comes in: Jefferson uses Nathan to get money from the Prescotts to fund the Dark Room, but has to let Nathan into the game just enough to keep him happy and quiet about it.

But, as Jefferson says, this leads to his "vision" being intruded upon by "amateurs": Nathan is clueless and reckless, and kills Rachel in his attempt to imitate the self-proclaimed master.

Jefferson is not clever enough to cover his tracks in the wake of that killing without himself killing anyone who knows of his hobby or is in a position to figure it out; apparently, he has no suspicion at all that David is on his trail, too.

Of course, he's too much of a narcissistic artist type not to try to make killing Max into some kind of noble quest for peak aesthetic experience . . . which makes him scarier, in his way, than any supervillain or criminal mastermind.