Schedule 1's endgame is unreasonable

[「AMOEBA」]

As I finally achieve my first million in this game, I think I've reached a valid point in this game where I can say from experience that Schedule 1's endgame is atrocious. I get that Tyler probably wasn't expecting this game to get nearly as big as it has, but considering the achievements he willingly put into the game, he clearly expected his players to play this game for some amount of time which is why I feel somewhat justified in making this post.

Now this isn't a "waah I can't get my achievement" post, but I think the fact that a 10 million net worth achievement exists shines a big light on how poorly thought out this game's endgame is and I'd like to highlight some of the biggest issues I've faced and hopefully offer some solutions on how they can be resolved. In my opinion these are in order of importance so if Tyler graces this thread, he can have some idea on what to improve upon or put in his development cycle. I'd like to offer both an easy to implement solution as well as a harder, more long term solution to each problem so this doesn't seem like a long rant and again produce some direction to Tyler who I'm sure has ideas on how to move forward already.

Overall we all want the same things, we want this game to be better and I don't want Tyler to feel like he did a bad job, he didn't. I would just like this game to have a fulfilling progression from beginning to end and here are my suggestions on how to do so. The following suggestions in my opinion are in order of importance:

1. Schedule 1's endgame is a delivery simulator - Once you're able to justify building and producing enough product to support 3-6 dealers as well as your own personal clients, you quickly start to realize that maintaining this level of production is not fun in the slightest. Rather than exploring and making deals, you're constantly ordering deliveries or doing them yourself and driving them to where they need to go. This is extremely time-consuming, monotonous, and overall a stark contrast to the enjoyment Schedule 1's early game offers.

Solution: Improve the delivery app - this is one of the easiest things to do and it's so essential I would recommend anybody who hates this portion of the game to download any of the delivery mods available. I promise it is gamechanging. I'm talking about saving favorite deliveries so you don't have to reenter the same order, over and over again, setting up recurring deliveries. Another change I'd recommend is:

Add an unloader/delivery worker - Even though the delivery system is now improved, you still have to be physically be there to unload the product and organize it for your employees to use. Hire someone to do it for you! That's what I'm paying them for after all. Heck you can ever tack it onto the cleaner worker's duties, hardly anybody uses them anyway so now they'll have more of a use in the game.


2. Schedule 1's endgame has next to no scaling - What do I mean by this? Let's say you're at coke, you're making good money but you realize there's nothing left to go for. You say okay, and experiment or look up to eventually find the most optimal $735 mixture to maximize your profits. Now what? Well... nothing. There's nothing left. You've unlocked all the dealers, you've maximized all of your locations productions. There's nothing left. You want to keep playing the game, so you look up the achievements and you see 2 standouts. Achieve $1 million networth and Achieve $10 million networth. How the hell are you supposed to do that in any reasonable amount of time?

Solution, there's a few: Give customers more money to spend - It's dumb, but realistically this is the easiest thing to do. You can even add a condition so that for example once you unlock the last couple of areas, everybody starts getting more money to spend so it doesn't ruin earlier portions of the game.

Let the player list products for more than $999 - Same as the previous, it's dumb, but come on I know these guys have more money, let me get it.

Add a better money-sink than the Casino - The Casino's purpose, outside of giving fun minigames, is to be a money-sink. The problem is it does a bad job of it once you're at even a medium networth. You can only bet $500 which will hardly make any sort of a dent in your cashflow when you're selling coke for upwards of $1500 a pop to your highspending customers. Adding a higher limit to the casino, adding new games like horse racing, or even adding a stock market option could alleviate some of the woes players are feeling at this stage of the game

Add another product beyond coke - It sounds simple, I get it though, this one is hard. I'm not expecting it any time soon tbh.

3. Schedule 1's endgame doesn't have anything to do - It seems like Tyler already has plans for this like Police Raids being the most up to date example which is why this problem is at the bottom of the list. Even if the endgame is fixed, you're still doing the same thing over and over again, it gets boring ya know?

Solution: Make the police stronger - Right now the police have checkpoints setup but nothing feels like it's justifying it. Maybe make it so the more outrageous your products' effects are, the more police walk around? Maybe the more you get caught out of curfew, more checkpoints pop up or police are on patrol making deals harder? Maybe even your suppliers refuse to show up if there's too much heat?

Add cartel/gang wars - There's the mysterious cartel that we hear about in the beginning of the game that never once comes up again. Maybe in the future Tyler can take some time to expand on this? Maybe make a territory system where some customers won't buy from you if the cartel have control over a certain area?

Just some thoughts, I really enjoy this game and honestly Tyler don't let the pressure get to you, if you need help from other developers or have to take a break, by all means do it. It's just a game after all and you've made your well deserved bag.

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Publicado originalmente por This PC:

Publicado originalmente por REDACTED:

Not someone to come in and say I didnt read your post, the games not done yet, you got value, like you did lmao. Pretty sure OP knows the game isnt done yet homie.

As much as you're offended you think I didn't read OP's post, you can sorta path out why tyler wouldn't consider feedback like this when OP hasn't read the trello board/roadmap.
Weird how you have different standards for me than for OP.

You said you didnt read the post and the fact you think a customer is required to read some Trello board before giving feedback is absurd.

[This PC]

Publicado originalmente por REDACTED:

You said you didnt read the post and the fact you think a customer is required to read some Trello board before giving feedback is absurd.

I don't think someone should read trello board before giving feedback, but...

Publicado originalmente por Scarsick:

This PC is right though. Feedback is about people giving their thoughts on what works, and what doesn't for them. Did you ever seen an ea game implementing random suggestions from players?

There are reasons for that.

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Publicado originalmente por This PC:

Publicado originalmente por REDACTED:

Not someone to come in and say I didnt read your post, the games not done yet, you got value, like you did lmao. Pretty sure OP knows the game isnt done yet homie.

As much as you're offended you think I didn't read OP's post, you can sorta path out why tyler wouldn't consider feedback like this when OP hasn't read the trello board/roadmap.
Weird how you have different standards for me than for OP. I already read more of this post than OP read of the roadmap before I even posted first comment.

You sound like your in love with this guy Tyler who doesnt even know you exist. I'm sure he's way more busy trying to keep cooperate lawyers off his back right now than to read this in the general section of steam lmao. This whole conversation is absurd which is kinda my original point.

[This PC]

Publicado originalmente por REDACTED:

You sound like your in love with this guy Tyler who doesnt even know you exist. I'm sure he's way more busy trying to keep cooperate lawyers off his back right now than to read this in the general section of steam lmao. This whole conversation is absurd which is kinda my original point.

I don't care at all about Tyler, I care about his game. I also don't care about your ad hominems, cause I recognize what they are, you're out of arguments, and you don't like what I say, so you try to harm my credibility to maintain face.

Concerning the second part of your post, this is one of the reasons I reacted like this. He has no time to read a 5000 words dissertation on what you think he should do with the game. He has a game to develop, ideas for it, and he has way better things to do.

That's why I said he needs efficient feedback about what's actually in the game right now, what works, and what doesn't, not what you want it to be.

Like, really, it's nice that you people are creative and have a lot of ideas. I do too actually! But instead of putting them down here and burdening people with what I think this game should be, I went out and started a similar project to play them out. :P

[dtrain77scots]

CAN WE GET A FLOATING WORKER THAT KINDA KEEPS DOING WHATEVER NEEDS TO BE DONE HE KNOWS TASK ASSIGNED TO OTHER WORKERS AND HELPS WITH UNLOADING AND ALSO DRIVES FROM LOCATION TO LOCATION

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Publicado originalmente por This PC:

Publicado originalmente por REDACTED:

You sound like your in love with this guy Tyler who doesnt even know you exist. I'm sure he's way more busy trying to keep cooperate lawyers off his back right now than to read this in the general section of steam lmao. This whole conversation is absurd which is kinda my original point.

I don't care at all about Tyler, I care about his game. I also don't care about your ad hominems, cause I recognize what they are, you're out of arguments, and you don't like what I say, so you try to harm my credibility to maintain face.

Concerning the second part of your post, this is one of the reasons I reacted like this. He has no time to read a 5000 words dissertation on what you think he should do with the game. He has a game to develop, ideas for it, and he has way better things to do.

That's why I said he needs efficient feedback about what's actually in the game right now, what works, and what doesn't, not what you want it to be.

Like, really, it's nice that you people are creative and have a lot of ideas. I do too actually! But instead of putting them down here and burdening people with what I think this game should be, I went out and started a similar project to play them out. :P

Totally agree. Getting bombarded with 1000s of ideas a day, most of which are useless is beyond frustrating and not helpful. Just deving a FiveM server with hundreds of players, getting hundreds of requests a week is stressful enough. i couldnt imagine millions of players...

Thats why this post was put into the general section on steam. For general chat lol. Nothing wrong with this post at all is all im saying. This single dev is NOT getting his feedback from General on steam. Right now im sure hes bogged down with hiring staff, lawyers, dealing with lawyers. I'm shocked a single person made this game, it sold so well and he was even able to push any sort of update out like he has. Major props to Tyler.

I'm just saying you're acting like a real a$$ to someone who wrote a detailed post with feedback and suggestions in a general chat on steam. He's not making support tickets or blowing up the suggestions forum. Its General....

[Maligner]

Publicado originalmente por Scarsick:

Publicado originalmente por 「AMOEBA」:

Last time, never said Tyler has to do any of my suggestions. That’s why they’re suggestions. Please actually read the content if you’re going to comment on it. Thank you :squirtyay:

This PC is right though. Feedback is about people giving their thoughts on what works, and what doesn't for them. Did you ever seen an ea game implementing random suggestions from players? I've seen mods been incorporated, but that's about it. I can only imagine the sorry state good games that were crowdfunded would be if they incorporated all the random crap people suggest.

And again, your suggestions revolve around endgame, something that does not exist yet. You're confusing the current gameplay loop with endgame.

Also, there's a roadmap and some of the stuff you suggested is already there, like drug wars.

Actually, if you look at the roadmap there are things on there I have indeed read as suggestions on this forum.

[Smurph]

I don't think there's any reason to believe that the endgame is actually in the game yet.

You've noticed that there's a giant garage door to the Warehouse shop that leads to the water, right? It's pretty clear that there's plans for boats in some form or another, and it really seems like there's plans to buy boats.

Now, it's purely up to speculation what we'll do with those boats (travel to other, new areas? Sell drugs in larger quantities via water? something else?). But either way, those boats will likely significantly add to our net worth.

I don't think that the tools that will practically get us to 10m are in the game at all yet. You're welcome to still try to grind that out now, but I'm sure that will become a lot easier in future updates.

I'm 100 hours in and just about to the point of putting this game down for a bit. But make no mistake, I'll be back in a few months to see what's new.

[BigChinJinn]

Tell me you dont understand Early Access without telling me you dont

[kir-kanos]

So no endgame in a game that is not done you say?, OO the horror.

[This PC]

Publicado originalmente por REDACTED:

I'm just saying you're acting like a real a$$ to someone who wrote a detailed post with feedback and suggestions in a general chat on steam. He's not making support tickets or blowing up the suggestions forum. Its General....

I won't deny am absolutely an ass. Very blunt and very little filter. :D

[This PC]

Publicado originalmente por Maligner:

Actually, if you look at the roadmap there are things on there I have indeed read as suggestions on this forum.

what if they were always there ?
then it sounds more like "people are suggesting stuff that are already on the trello board, wasting everybody's time". :P

[8drunkNgods]

What, no planes dropping pallets??? I'm out.

[Cavalier_Sabre]

Guys listen. Am I unreasonable in my opinion that this game is way too early in development to be having an argument about the endgame with a 14 paragraph original post?

The game is early access, and we have access to half (or less) of the planned drugs. There really isn't an endgame right now. There isn't meant to be. I think what we already have access to this early in development for just $20 is more than satisfactory.

[This PC]

Publicado originalmente por Cavalier_Sabre:

Guys listen. Am I unreasonable in my opinion that this game is way too early in development to be having an argument about the endgame with a 14 paragraph original post?

The game is early access, and we have access to half (or less) of the planned drugs. There really isn't an endgame right now. There isn't meant to be. I think what we already have access to this early in development for just $20 is more than satisfactory.

From my perspective, you're a voice of reason ^^