Warlock too powerful?

[Vausver]

I am loving the new Warlock class. I do think though that its drawbacks are not significant enough. The only real negative he has is starting at 40 HP and that is mitigated by immortality. The immortality from the demons can be regained quickly should it need to be used. Maybe for the immortality perk it could be changed to requiring at least two full demon pets. What does everyone else think?

[Ori-Baba]

yeah he's immortal waaaay to quick

[Schneekanonenschütze]

How does this immortality thing work exactly? When I tried the Warlock, I had three fully upgraded demon pets and was still dying like normal.

On a whole, I found the Warlock quite boring to play. He's basically a low HP Adventurer who forgoes familiars in favour of his trio of mostly useless pets. Now, if the demons could actually be used for some cool special abilities, like sending them out as suicide bombs or sacrificing them to buff yourself, that'd spice things up somewhat.

Battlemage is where the magic's at, but that doesn't mean he's not in need of some additional tweaking, especially in the damage department.

[Vausver]

If you die as the warlock and have at least one fully upgraded demon, you respawn as if you died and your minions disappear. From what I understand the first time you die regardless of demons, one life is taken naturally. After that it will keep respawning you as long as a demon is fully upgraded.

I tried battlemage a bit. I need to play it more to get a better feel but for my personal preferences I like the warlock. I generally play him as a barbarian running into the middle of fights where you can do the most melee damage and the demons have a greater chance of hitting with most of their projectiles. As long as you dodge appropriately you should be rarely hit.

[Ori-Baba]

Originally posted by Schneekanonenschütze:

How does this immortality thing work exactly? When I tried the Warlock, I had three fully upgraded demon pets and was still dying like normal.

On a whole, I found the Warlock quite boring to play. He's basically a low HP Adventurer who forgoes familiars in favour of his trio of mostly useless pets. Now, if the demons could actually be used for some cool special abilities, like sending them out as suicide bombs or sacrificing them to buff yourself, that'd spice things up somewhat.

Battlemage is where the magic's at, but that doesn't mean he's not in need of some additional tweaking, especially in the damage department.

I agree the warlock is pretty boring, his minions look and act too similar

[Syntas]

The warlock is fine. He is fun to play with and gets the job done. No nerfs please!

[Schneekanonenschütze]

Here's my proposal for a Warlock with a more interesting playstyle:

This Warlock uses his summoned demon pets to cast powerful magic attacks, similar to the Battlemage, but sacrificing one demon each, with the power/duration of the spell depending on the demon's level. Demons are used up from oldest to most recently summoned.

Evade+Attack : Sends out a demon as a suicide bomb, dealing AoE damage with knockback.
Evade+Jump : Sacrifices a demon for a short, temporary burst of invincibility.
Evade+Magic : Sacrifices a demon for a powerful buff, similar to the War Horn's. At level 6, it will also provide a "Divine" Shield for one room.
Evade+Pick up : Transfers the lifeforce of a demon to the Warlock, healing him. At level 5, it also cures diseases; at level 6, it removes a random curse.

What do you think?

[undead]

I'm surprised people find warlock boring, it's our "gradius" class :D! I agree it's probably too OP right now. We will try some adjustments in next updates. Maybe lowering the HP even more to make dying more taxing and comeback more stressful. Or maybe making the extra life available only after you max all the demons. i don't know yet, but I'm open to suggestions.

Battlemage's damage is upgraded by spell damage stat (btw so is the damage from warlock's demons). We just don't have enough ways to pump spell damage up yet. There are like 2 or 3 items in the whole game to buff it. But we plan to fix that soon.

[Schneekanonenschütze]

Well, it's not the concept of a "Gradius" or pet-oriented class itself that's boring, rather the fact that the Warlock doesn't play all that differently from any other class right now (except Assassin and Battlemage). He's a regular melee fighter, albeit with lower HP and automated fire support. That's why I'm proposing some more interaction between him and his pets.

Even when boosting spell damage with buffs and items, I still think the Battlemage's projectile and Fire Stomp spell could use some more base damage, especially the stomp, since it has the longest cooldown of all the spells. That, or have it set enemies on fire.

The fact that the Battlemage can't easily cancel his attacks and roll out of harms way, having to rely on clever use of the Teleport spell instead, is what makes him such a fun class to play.

[Ori-Baba]

Originally posted by undead:

I'm surprised people find warlock boring, it's our "gradius" class :D! I agree it's probably too OP right now. We will try some adjustments in next updates. Maybe lowering the HP even more to make dying more taxing and comeback more stressful. Or maybe making the extra life available only after you max all the demons. i don't know yet, but I'm open to suggestions.

Battlemage's damage is upgraded by spell damage stat (btw so is the damage from warlock's demons). We just don't have enough ways to pump spell damage up yet. There are like 2 or 3 items in the whole game to buff it. But we plan to fix that soon.

Sorry man but all the Warlock does is spam projectiles. I rather play with any other class and get normal familiars.

Originally posted by Schneekanonenschütze:

Well, it's not the concept of a "Gradius" or pet-oriented class itself that's boring, rather the fact that the Warlock doesn't play all that differently from any other class right now (except Assassin and Battlemage). He's a regular melee fighter, albeit with lower HP and automated fire support. That's why I'm proposing some more interaction between him and his pets.

Even when boosting spell damage with buffs and items, I still think the Battlemage's projectile and Fire Stomp spell could use some more base damage, especially the stomp, since it has the longest cooldown of all the spells. That, or have it set enemies on fire.

The fact that the Battlemage can't easily cancel his attacks and roll out of harms way, having to rely on clever use of the Teleport spell instead, is what makes him such a fun class to play.

They if they increase damage on the battle mage's fireball they'd have to increase the cooldown time as well, it's very easy to spam.

[DINGO The Dwagon]

I should made fat art of this :D

[Schneekanonenschütze]

Originally posted by OleBone:

They if they increase damage on the battle mage's fireball they'd have to increase the cooldown time as well, it's very easy to spam.

It's still slower than any thrown weapons or the Flame Orb's fireballs.

[boovie]

Originally posted by Schneekanonenschütze:

Here's my proposal for a Warlock with a more interesting playstyle:

This Warlock uses his summoned demon pets to cast powerful magic attacks, similar to the Battlemage, but sacrificing one demon each, with the power/duration of the spell depending on the demon's level. Demons are used up from oldest to most recently summoned.

That's really nice idea, I like it. What I'm not sure about is the roll. Having casting spells on evade+button and simultaneously having roll on evade+direction means than it would require to fully stop moving before casting a spell, otherwise the roll would be triggered. I think it wouldn't feel "right" if a player would be required to stop moving before casting. That's also one of the reason why battlemage doesn't have roll, to prevent accidentally rolling when player really wants to start casting spell while moving. Warlock is low-hp class, so roll is really important.

[Schneekanonenschütze]

I'm pretty positive the Warlock will work just as well without the ability to either roll or cast spells on the move, it just requires a different playstyle. Being less agile than the other classes fits him just fine, as he's a much more focused on his magic.

[АнтониоЧереварто]

I don't think that warlock is too powerful, he has only 40 HP so he can die from 1 hit from the mighty leg

[Woocash]

Oy honestly I don't think he's overpowered. He's a momentum-based character, so in the hands of a player he can do great until he crashes, but I think this is something that makes him different from everyone else. He can have more nuance or special abilities, but based on my experience I wouldn't say he's OP.