Gun balance

[Gorion's Ward]

I feel like a majority of the guns in this game are weak as ♥♥♥♥. They arent all that special and sometimes the standard gun is your best bet. Still enjoy the game, but there are way to many gun drops and not enough passives.

Just my thoughts.

[PiemanFiddy]

Yeah there definitely need to be a lot more passive items besides just health upgrades and guon stones I feel. The elemental damage modifiers you can put on your bullets is nice, but we need some passives that just give straight damage or accuracy.

[Fusha]

Sorry but your thoughts are wrong

Only very few guns are worse than your standard gun. The real problem with gun balance is that there are some guns that are just too overpowered and make the run trivial and boring

[Tax Man]

I don't think he's totally wrong. While I don't have a huge amount of play time yet I do feel like some guns really do just feel like ass, can't name one off the top of my head as im super tired but there have been times i've used my standard gun over the one I picked up. I think its a mix of what both of you are saying. Some guns being too appealing and others being not appealing enough. While everything doesn't have to be balanced there should at least be a reason to use everything.

[UBE Chief]

I may have only beat the Dragun once (still gotta beat a past, but regardless), but having guns that progressively do less and less damage against common enemies (and yet are beast against the new ones), is kinda wierd. It's like you have to exclusively save an Active slot for a damage boost when you need it, instead of having it all the time (if I was to use a BoI reference here, think Tammy's Head VS Brimstone - one is for extra damage when it's charged, the other is a constant damage upgrade).

[Hassohappa]

Originally posted by PiemanFiddy:

Yeah there definitely need to be a lot more passive items besides just health upgrades and guon stones I feel. The elemental damage modifiers you can put on your bullets is nice, but we need some passives that just give straight damage or accuracy.

What are you talking about?

+1 bullets
Heavy Bullets
Explosive Rounds
Alpha Bullets
Omega Bullets
Angry Bullets
Shadow Bullets
Eyepatch
Unity
Broccoli
Cog of Battle
Metronome

Scope
Laser Scope

I'm sure I'm missing some.

As far as weak guns are concerned I pretty much agree. Getting something like a Lower Case R, Machine Pistol, Flame Hand, or Phoenix as your only drop from the first floor feels pretty bad.

[Milk]

Originally posted by Hassohappa:

Originally posted by PiemanFiddy:

Yeah there definitely need to be a lot more passive items besides just health upgrades and guon stones I feel. The elemental damage modifiers you can put on your bullets is nice, but we need some passives that just give straight damage or accuracy.

What are you talking about?

+1 bullets
Heavy Bullets
Explosive Rounds
Alpha Bullets
Omega Bullets
Angry Bullets
Shadow Bullets
Eyepatch
Unity
Broccoli
Cog of Battle
Metronome

Scope
Laser Scope

I'm sure I'm missing some.

As far as weak guns are concerned I pretty much agree. Getting something like a Lower Case R, Machine Pistol, Flame Hand, or Phoenix as your only drop from the first floor feels pretty bad.

The flame hand is the only bad weapon you listed.

[Hassohappa]

Originally posted by Tacobandit:

The flame hand is the only bad weapon you listed.

Yeah, well, you know that's just like uh... your opinion man.

[TakingDOOMP]

Originally posted by Fusha:

Sorry but your thoughts are wrong

Only very few guns are worse than your standard gun. The real problem with gun balance is that there are some guns that are just too overpowered and make the run trivial and boring

I wish I could find those. All of the gun/item combos I've found and I've gotten wrecked by Dragun the two times I've managed to reach him.

[Toran]

I would definitely argue there is some manner of balancing issues within the game, especially since most of my runs are typically populated by one or two guns while the other 3-5 tend to get ignored by sheer usability and effectiveness. It really is sad to see a game that's all about the guns also teaches you to ignore most of the guns.

Though I would argue where the source of the issue isn't with the guns itself, its still with the gradual HP gain of enemies on every floor. The fact that even Bullet Kin, the dopey little nerds, grow from 3 shots with the starting pistol all the way to 7 on the Forge. And considering a hefty number of the guns either match your starting pistol or are only very slight upgrades it makes even the most common of enemies way too much of a bullet sponge (puns aside). The solution really could be as easy as dialing back the HP gain, not completely removing it, just so that common guns still feel viable.

[Milk]

Originally posted by Hassohappa:

Originally posted by Tacobandit:

The flame hand is the only bad weapon you listed.

Yeah, well, you know that's just like uh... your opinion man.

Ditto.

[Carrier Pidgeons]

Even the bad ones have valuable uses, and none of these are really that bad.

[Supernatural Cookie]

As some other people have said, the problem isn't the guns, but rather the fact that enemy health scales per floor, but gun damage/RNG does not. So not only do guns feel weaker as you progress, but there is no garentee you'll be getting better guns as you progress either.

[Milk]

Originally posted by Supernatural Cookie:

As some other people have said, the problem isn't the guns, but rather the fact that enemy health scales per floor, but gun damage/RNG does not. So not only do guns feel weaker as you progress, but there is no garentee you'll be getting better guns as you progress either.

So what? Not every run needs to be equally balanced.

[Carrier Pidgeons]

Just beat the Lich (and all of Bullet Hell) with the Unicorn Horn, Triple Crossbow, sparing usage of the Tangler, the AKEY-47, and the Mahoguny. These are not amazing guns, but they are good enough.

PS: Mahoguny #1. Also, the ammo buff REALLY SHOWS! Felt very comfortable using the Mahoguny and Hip Holster most of the time, and actually had an ammo surplus from Bullet Hell.

[Pantera]

you know somone is a noob when he calls the flame hand a bad weapon.