If Sigma dies ...

[Demitro]

wouldnt be a paradox? pls can someone try to explain within the series logic?

[Oddley]

İlk olarak Santa tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Quercus tarafından gönderildi:

I still think it's gonna have some odd effect on the world. Else Dio wouldn't make any sense, and Clover and Alice wont be having a physical way to return in time.

Dio just wouldn't exist in the timeline that doesn't lead to VLR, and the Left clones still exist anyway. Clover and Alice are ALREADY in the pods, so they can still go back into the past.

Alice and Clover can't shoot their concience through time. And sorry, I was talking about Dio's mision.

[Battler Ushiromiya]

But at the end of VLR, they said that Akane mentioned a way for them to go back in time physically using Schrodinger's Cat. And remember, Dio doesn't exist yet, assuming that clones age the same as humans. Neither Dio nor his mission exists yet. Dio's mission ONLY comes about in the VLR timeline, where Sigma fails to stop Radical-6, thus creating a need for the Ambidex Game.

[HowlingLotus]

Some spoilers for those who haven't played 999/VLR (the previous games).


I'm not a big multiverse expert by any means, but this is what I thought after VLR in regards to Alice and Clover.

We know that Sigma and Phi can move their conscious through time AND universes, while Akane can essentially see all of the universes and what happens in them. Alice and Clover don't come anywhere remotely close to this power, but therefore they only know the original timeline they are from. Assuming that the true ending is them stopping the escape of Radical 6, I would like to think that would be the "original" timeline where it all branched off from. If this is true, Alice and Clover would never be frozen for decades as ZTD takes place before the final bits of the true VLR ending. With the outbreak prevented everyone would finally get their happy ending... (probably not though, let's be honest).

In regards to Sigma and the others dying..... they were dying in VLR. In Sigma and Phi's case, their conscious would get rejected back into the "original" universe. Long story short, there are a lot of dead Sigma's and the others in alternatve universes. It's different from 999 as we were essentially viewing all the outcomes from Akane's power.

I am curious about what happens in the ending where they prevent the outbreak in terms of the mind swap. I'm actually down for all endings to be dark and sad considering the tone of the series. I think it would be interesting for them to legitmately fail over and over as the good guys can't always win. I doubt that will happen, but I'm curious if it will be something ala Days Of Future Past. Upon saving the world Sigma instantly "wakes up" in the future. I'm sure Akane, Phi, and the others could pinpoint an approximate date. Then would come the harsh task of explaining what has happened over the past decades Sigma's mind was in "limbo". Think of it as the "price/punishment" paid for cheating the rules of the universe. That or everything after they are successful ceases to exist in the current timeline and any future events stay in an alternate universe.

Either way I'm pumped to find out what happens to everyone - especially if we get to see what became/becomes of all 999/VLR/ZTD casts.

[HowlingLotus]

The thing is that if they succeed, NONE of the happens from Clover and Alice's perspective (in the "original" universe, at least). Only Sigma, Phi, and Akane would remember the future. Clover and Alice would remember getting kidnapped before raiding the Free The Soul hideout and wake up with Sigma, Phi, and Akane and be confused AF (there could be other universes where they are stuck in the future, but in this 'original' timeline they never went to the future).

That's my point of view. As I said I'm not an expert on multi-universe theory, etc.

[Lambda]

İlk olarak HowlingLotus tarafından gönderildi:

The thing is that if they succeed, NONE of the happens from Clover and Alice's perspective (in the "original" universe, at least). Only Sigma, Phi, and Akane would remember the future. Clover and Alice would remember getting kidnapped before raiding the Free The Soul hideout and wake up with Sigma, Phi, and Akane and be confused AF (there could be other universes where they are stuck in the future, but in this 'original' timeline they never went to the future).

That's my point of view. As I said I'm not an expert on multi-universe theory, etc.

That's about right, but the Clover and Alice who ended up on the Moon in 2074 would certainly continue to exist in that ruined future (as would Tenmyouji, Quark and the others - even Akane and the body of Dr. Sigma Klim, carrying the consciousness of a young Sigma), short of actual time/inter-timeline travel.

[Clivelaw]

Well, VLR's logic wants that the endings from ZTD already happened in VLR, creating multiple timelines. Akane and old Sigma were just making sure the mars test site mission would be a success, like when she saw the future in 2029 she made sure that VLR happened.
Akane explains that Dr Klim's ability to jump has been reduced by his age. In VLR it is young Sigma that jumps and pushes back Dr Klim's mind (from after the mars test site) to his body at the end of the nonary game.

Some facts :

VLR is forced to happen somehow, so Sigma can gain enough mind power to jump through time and space.
The VLR loop must be maintained in the timeline where the world is destroyed.
The new timeline cannot interact with VLR's one without breaking the circle.

Then, what can happen when Dr Klim saves the world, thus creating a new timeline ?

Dr Klim inhabits Sigma's body but without young Sigma's mind jumping around, and each body already filled with a consciousness in the VLR timeline, Dr Klim continues to be Sigma in the new timeline.
However, I am pretty sure this will not happen, because mind travel, scientific theories and all.

As for Clover and Alice, if Akane says she's got a time machine, I assume it is another crazy mind bending plan. But the mention of Schrödinger's cat could mean that she can "merge" their minds from 2074 with their minds from the saved world, so each of those would be present at the same time.
But this last statement is just pure speculation.

Thinking this through again and again made me forget what I wanted to say in the first place, damn.

TL:DR Speculation that will surely be proven false in less than week.

[Battler Ushiromiya]

İlk olarak HowlingLotus tarafından gönderildi:

Some spoilers for those who haven't played 999/VLR (the previous games).

In regards to Sigma and the others dying..... they were dying in VLR. In Sigma and Phi's case, their conscious would get rejected back into the "original" universe. Long story short, there are a lot of dead Sigma's and the others in alternatve universes. It's different from 999 as we were essentially viewing all the outcomes from Akane's power.

However, all those outcomes seen by Akane still happened, just as much as the bad endings in VLR.

[Lambda]

İlk olarak Santa tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak HowlingLotus tarafından gönderildi:

Some spoilers for those who haven't played 999/VLR (the previous games).

In regards to Sigma and the others dying..... they were dying in VLR. In Sigma and Phi's case, their conscious would get rejected back into the "original" universe. Long story short, there are a lot of dead Sigma's and the others in alternatve universes. It's different from 999 as we were essentially viewing all the outcomes from Akane's power.

However, all those outcomes seen by Akane still happened, just as much as the bad endings in VLR.

And indeed, all of the endings we saw in 999.

[Oddley]

But if old-Sigma-young-body saves the world from Radical 6, and end up in that time line. Then young-Sigma-old-body wont be able to switch minds afer the AB game.

Because old-Sigma-young-body isn't in the same timeline anymore. And if they do switch in some way, then young-Sigma-old-body wont be able to start the AB project. Because the world didn't end, and he might still have intact arms and both eyes, and so cannot send his old mind to a young body anymore.

[Clivelaw]

İlk olarak Quercus tarafından gönderildi:

But if old-Sigma-young-body saves the world from Radical 6, and end up in that time line. Then young-Sigma-old-body wont be able to switch minds afer the AB game.

Because old-Sigma-young-body isn't in the same timeline anymore. And if they do switch in some way, then young-Sigma-old-body wont be able to start the AB project. Because the world didn't end, and he might still have intact arms and both eyes, and so cannot send his old mind to a young body anymore.

This is not possible because if he does save the world, a new timeline is created, meaning that the old one, where he does not succeed, still exists.
He manages to save the world at the same time he fails. Both universes exists.

[Lambda]

İlk olarak Quercus tarafından gönderildi:

But if old-Sigma-young-body saves the world from Radical 6, and end up in that time line. Then young-Sigma-old-body wont be able to switch minds afer the AB game.

He doesn't need to switch back.

İlk olarak Quercus tarafından gönderildi:

Because old-Sigma-young-body isn't in the same timeline anymore. And if they do switch in some way, then young-Sigma-old-body wont be able to start the AB project. Because the world didn't end, and he might still have intact arms and both eyes, and so cannot send his old mind to a young body anymore.

He doesn't need to start the AB Project in the timeline where the world is saved.

[Oddley]

İlk olarak Laðy Laмвðaðelтa tarafından gönderildi:

He doesn't need to start the AB Project in the timeline where the world is saved.

If he does not, then the Sigma that he is now (old-Sigma-young-body), never came to exist. And wouldn't be able to save the world.

[Battler Ushiromiya]

İlk olarak Quercus tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Laðy Laмвðaðelтa tarafından gönderildi:

He doesn't need to start the AB Project in the timeline where the world is saved.

If he does not, then the Sigma that he is now (old-Sigma-young-body), never came to exist. And wouldn't be able to save the world.

What are you not understanding about this? The Sigma in the successful timeline will have no need to create the AB Game, but the Sigma that got the VLR timeline WILL STILL HAVE THE NEED TO CREATE THE AB GAME, AND THE EVENTS OF VLR WILL OCCUR! Multiverse theory! Every decision made creates a new universe! That VLR universe exists!

[Lambda]

İlk olarak Quercus tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Laðy Laмвðaðelтa tarafından gönderildi:

He doesn't need to start the AB Project in the timeline where the world is saved.

If he does not, then the Sigma that he is now (old-Sigma-young-body), never came to exist. And wouldn't be able to save the world.

He would still come to exist - from the timeline in which the world is not saved. When old Sigma travels back in time and creates a new timeline from his decisions, that has the net effect of moving Sigma's mind from one timeline into another.

Basically, what Santa said. The actions of the Sigma from one timeline can very definitely influence the events of other timelines (even create them).

[Αη Ιnτellecτual Tsiραr]

move this to the spoiler discussion.