Health and Mana regen

[Leo]

This game would definitely be much more enjoyable if the regeneration of mana and health was increased by just 30%. Fighting a mob for 1 minute and then having to wait another to get back in the fight as a caster, (looking at you cleric players), just feels bad and slows down the game play unnecessarily. Thoughts?

[Sairek Ceareste]

Първоначално публикувано от Tanist:

Първоначално публикувано от Sairek Ceareste:

No, that's not what I am saying. I believe you're thinking of the curve backwards.


Pictures speak a thousand words, so using my non-existent art skills in MS Paint, the way resting works is the red line. My suggestion is the blue line: https://i.imgur.com/phhaCUW.png

Just as a disclaimer, I've exaggerated both of the lines for the sake of showing the differences between the two methods just to show the example with no care of the actual accuracy to the game's genuine values.


The idea is that you accelerate upwards at the beginning faster when you begin resting, and then as you get more "stacks" of the rest buff, you get those resting stacks slower and slower.
It basically "soft caps" the resting rate as it gets closer to the maximum speed, but ideally, it would be balanced to go from 0% of a resource bar to 100% in roughly the same amount of time as we do now, but it would make resting with 75% of a bar to get to 100% much faster, because recovering 25% of a mana bar shouldn't take nearly as long as 100% anyway.

Not a big fan of that personally, I would prefer a standard across the board with the only thing influencing that being whether you are sitting/standing or using other external aids.

Me too, to be honest. Sometimes the simple solutions really are the best ones, lol.

[Mindzen]

When i started grouping, i had no clue what i was doing as a cleric. Luckily, its kinda easy, but i was spamming spells and always running out of mana. The leader wasnt waiting on me, and i was in a tight spot a bunch of times.

I then figured out that i needed to startegize how and when to use spells, when to sit, when i could let their health go a little lower and get one more tik, do i really need to cast shield on the ranger when he starts to get hit when in fact he is going to retreat and use his bow and be fine. I also learned to cast my mana spell when my mana was barely low enough to benefit from it, so the cooldown will be done by the end in case i needed it again.

Regen is fine.

[Tanist]

Първоначално публикувано от Mindzen:

When i started grouping, i had no clue what i was doing as a cleric. Luckily, its kinda easy, but i was spamming spells and always running out of mana. The leader wasnt waiting on me, and i was in a tight spot a bunch of times.

I then figured out that i needed to startegize how and when to use spells, when to sit, when i could let their health go a little lower and get one more tik, do i really need to cast shield on the ranger when he starts to get hit when in fact he is going to retreat and use his bow and be fine. I also learned to cast my mana spell when my mana was barely low enough to benefit from it, so the cooldown will be done by the end in case i needed it again.

Regen is fine.

Eventually you will master to a level where you start initiating people into the "purple club" (where they die, see the purple bar, but then the heal hits and they stand back up).

Not sure if that is possible in this game to be honest, but there were some healers I have ran with in past games that had this down to a science and it would freak people out. lol

[elrosx]

Its not an action RPG

[Veeshan]

Първоначално публикувано от elrosx:

Its not an action RPG

It's significantly closer than EQ, though.

For about half of any given fight you're pushing keys at an APM equivalent to Classic World of Warcraft.

But yeah, the other half the TTK is long enough, and your ability cooldowns long enough, that you effectively have nothing to do except examine the battlefield.

Ultimately it's a little too high for my comfort but both Pantheon and Classic WoW are able to flex enough to accommodate the old and decrepit. Without us dragging down too much the group.

[Vanguard]

No no no you cant change that because "it was like that back in the day"

[Enferno]

I believe this was the game that has been mentioned for a very long time and it was from old school EQ players, no? They were trying to bring back that style of game play and let me tell you, if you think that fighting a mob for 1 minute and sitting for 30-90 seconds is painful, when EQ came out we had to fight for 2+ minutes and sit for 5+ minutes each fight.

So, this is the type of game style this game is built around.

[Wasted]

At higher levels when in a group there is pretty much 0 downtime for medding except when things go wrong. Just the way I like it.

[Tanist]

Първоначално публикувано от privateprofile81:

the most recent update actually feels much better in this regard. the only real downtime now is when things go horribly wrong, which is what i like to see. when things are running smoothly, it should be bing bang boom pull after pull, but when things get dicey you need a few minutes to recoup.

Първоначално публикувано от Wasted:

At higher levels when in a group there is pretty much 0 downtime for medding except when things go wrong. Just the way I like it.

Kind of my concern. If the cycle is too fast, the concept of downtime as a play mechanic becomes non-existent.

[Seath]

Първоначално публикувано от privateprofile81:

Първоначално публикувано от Tanist:

Kind of my concern. If the cycle is too fast, the concept of downtime as a play mechanic becomes non-existent.

what is it you actually want? a game that punishes success?

He wants you to not change "his" game.

[Tanist]

Първоначално публикувано от privateprofile81:

Първоначално публикувано от Tanist:

Kind of my concern. If the cycle is too fast, the concept of downtime as a play mechanic becomes non-existent.

what is it you actually want? a game that punishes success?

A game of resource management that is more than just "in fight" management which is basically what all modern MMOs are.

If you can go constant fight to fight and only a "minute" amount of downtime on extremely difficult long fights, then there is no management to consider between fights.

So mob spawn times (ie breaking a room and trying to hold it) becomes a non-issue, not to mention the risk of pathers, or fights taking too long where re-pops become an issue concerning your med time.

Also, this causes management within the fight (ie people simply dumping all of their resources every fight because the recovery phase after the fight is minimal).

It is an interesting game play dynamic that really only existed in older MMOs that had this camping game dynamic.

[Tanist]

Първоначално публикувано от Seath:

Първоначално публикувано от privateprofile81:

what is it you actually want? a game that punishes success?

He wants you to not change "his" game.

I want to not eliminate game play.

[Veeshan]

Първоначално публикувано от Seath:

He wants you to not change "his" game.

"Our" game.

[Seath]

Първоначално публикувано от Tanist:

Първоначално публикувано от Seath:

He wants you to not change "his" game.

I want to not eliminate game play.

While restricting it to the gameplay you want. We know

[Veeshan]

Първоначално публикувано от privateprofile81:

properly managing your resources such that good gameplay is rewarded with ongoing fun and action and bad gameplay is penalized with lots of downtime seems like a way to achieve balance, whereas penalizing good gameplay with downtime and further penalizing bad gameplay with even more downtime doesn't seem balanced.

This makes perfect sense... if you view down time as a penalty.

We've always viewed down time as just another mechanic. I have no issues maintaining my enjoyment level during downtime.

Today I got in a few sessions with my favorite economic simulator. Guess what my APM worked out to be?

Guess what I did when classic World of Warcraft sped up the combat, removed resource regeneration relevance between combats, and shortened the cool downs on all your abilities?