My Experience with BoS – No Bull****

[Chuck_Owl]

Greetings everyone,

I read a couple of topics in this forum and I decided to give you an account of my experience with Battle of Stalingrad. I will be as blunt, direct and no-nonsense as I can be.
I started flying flight sims since the early days of Il-2 1946. I fly FSX, every Il-2 title (1946 including all expansions, Cliffs of Dover and BoS), War Thunder and every module in DCS. I have flown these titles quite extensively, so I think I have a pretty good picture of what you’re signing up for.

I won’t try to convince you to buy BoS. I’m not a salesman, I suck at arguing and I honestly do not care whether you think 777 Studios are a buncha’ thieves or what not. I do not care about rumours; I care about facts. And here are the facts.

People are ♥♥♥♥ed at 1C because of the disastrous Cliffs of Dover release? I was too when this came out. But, believe it or not, a team of dedicated modders completely brought it back from the dead and it is not an uncommon sight to see 100 people flying simultaneously on the ATAG server. Overall, CloD is FPS-friendly, fun and gorgeous to look at. For me, the CloD debacle is a thing of the past. Mistakes were made and a different studio is at the helm for Battle of Stalingrad. 777 Studios is behind a WWI sim called “Rise of Flight”. You may or may not have heard of them, but their title showed that they are competent enough to create a good game that will not make your computer melt while having pretty neat graphics and decent flight models. 777 Studios repeatedly told the community that they had learned from Cliffs of Dover’s mistakes and that they intend not to make these same mistakes. I have backed BoS from Day 1, and I can say in all honesty that they are open to criticism (as long as it is constructive and not utterly clueless) and that they have been doing a surprisingly good job at keeping us (the community) in the loop regarding the development of the game.
Now, about the game itself. BoS is a flight simulator based during the Battle of Stalingrad (d’uh). The map is huge (much bigger than War Thunder maps). It’s not only the city of Stalingrad, but the whole area of operations along the Volga river. On the Russian side, you can fly the LaGG-3, the Yak-1, the Pe-2 Peshka bomber, the Il-2 Sturmovik and the La-5 (for premium edition). On the German side, you can fly the Bf.109F-4, the Bf.109G-2, the Ju-87 Stuka, the He-111 bomber and the FW.190A-3 (for premium edition). The basic game comes with 8 planes, while the 2 other extra planes can be bought separately. It is a matter of whether you really like these planes or not. They do not make matches unbalanced (they are not the Yak-9Ts of War Thunder, don’t worry). Their price is a hefty sum, so I would advise you to watch some videos of these planes in action. If it’s love at first sight, then throw your money at the screen. If it’s rather a “meh”, well just keep your money and shoot them down in flames online. People often tell me that BoS is *****ing expensive. Yes, it is. However, I suggest that you be open-minded about it. One flight sim will bring you hundreds of hours of enjoyment. You do not simply get “bored” of flight sims (unless it’s really not your cup of tea, which is always a possibility). It’s basically one giant sandbox that allows you to do anything you want. Each engagement is different. Every mission is different. Learning in flight sims has never been so rewarding. Why? Because these planes are easy to get into, but very hard to master. And in my experience, there’s always a sense of childish amazement when I learn to do stuff I had no idea I could do. You’ll find people from all walks of life, and flight sim communities are very different from traditional gaming communities. People welcome newcomers and will often help them and teach them without asking for anything in return. But enough sentimentality. Moving on.

Balance is a thing that does not exist in BoS. Aircraft are modelled after real-life design requirements and performance test data. You’re not flying on rails; you’re flying real-world physics and models. If you think you’re a great pilot in War Thunder, BoS is a very nice challenge that can humble even the greatest War Thunder pilots. You do not fly with a mouse in BoS; you use a joystick ,a TrackIR (if you have one… or you can get free headtracking options like FaceTrackNoIR), and rudder pedals (if you have some). You do not “throttle up” like in War Thunder. You actually manage your engine by controlling your oil radiator, water radiator, flaps, propeller pitch (which modifies engine RPM), your mixture and your boost pressure (which is basically controlled by your throttle). Of course, there is an easy-mode for those who do not want to bother with all that technical stuff called “Normal”. Some people are not necessarily into that kind of stuff, but learning how to fly a plane is just like learning how to drive a new car. Most of the things are similar, but there are some differences nonetheless that make each aircraft special and unique. In the complexity department, BoS allows some depth in gameplay while not making it too complicated for those who do not have time to read a 150-page-long manual a la DCS. In my opinion, BoS is a happy medium between accessibility and complexity, which is what makes a game entertaining yet keeps you coming back for more. Regarding flight models, I was not quite convinced during the early physics models with some fishy stuff going on. However, I must inform you that recent patches have fixed MOST of these issues. The result is a flight model that feels great, is historically accurate and that brings the level of immersion to a level that War Thunder will simply never reach despite all its bells and whistles. Aircraft do not spin on a dime anymore and do stall and spin quite violently if you make manoeuvers at high AoAs (Angle of Attack).

Multiplayer and Singleplayer are other obvious questions. “What am I buying, Chuck?” About single-player stuff, you’ll have it in September once the game is released. It’s basically a campaign of the air battle of Stalingrad where you accomplish various tasks during various stages of the battle. In my opinion, multiplayer’s where the fun’s at. You guys are lucky; you’re coming at the exact time where people are starting custom servers. The debugging and has been reported and experienced by early backers. The version we have at the moment is stable, and the game's quite pretty if you ask me. Lighting will make you hate the sun and you'll find yourself gazing numbly at the huge smoke columns floating over the ruins of Stalingrad. In Multiplayer, we generally have a 35-player limit on servers, but some wise voodoo computer gurus are working on testing server capability for higher player-counts (around 50-60). Nothing is set in stone, but so far things are seemingly moving forward in that regard. Now, how could I describe multiplayer? Well, I could talk to you about it for hours, but I’m more of a “Show-don’t-tell” kind of guy. Here’s a couple of in-game videos to help you guys see what you’re signing up for.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ANG7ZUICgDU&index=7&list=PLMZJbpYtQsUaRZMhCQl0L0oe_Vj8Lv5FD

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vusvgo7f1hk&index=1&list=PLMZJbpYtQsUaRZMhCQl0L0oe_Vj8Lv5FD

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TOlnRYw9Dsw&index=2&list=PLMZJbpYtQsUaRZMhCQl0L0oe_Vj8Lv5FD

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OKcRp5IOUk&index=3&list=PLMZJbpYtQsUaRZMhCQl0L0oe_Vj8Lv5FD

https://vimeo.com/90474183

Multiplayer stability is surprisingly good for this stage of Beta. FPS is also consistent and smooth. As you can see, the map is beautiful and the snows of Russia make for some interesting variety in comparison to other flight sims.

So, in conclusion:
At this stage of the project, BoS is not final. Most aircraft are released and their flight models are much improved over Il-2 1946 and War Thunder. Single-Player will come in September. Multiplayer servers are just starting to get interesting and more and more people are jumping in the bandwagon, which makes for some interesting match-ups. BoS was created in the optic that players want accessibility, replayability and complexity at the same time. BoS developer 777 made many changes after community feedback. Current game engine is proven, stable and 777 made it quite clear that they want to keep the game supported.
If some of you want to give BoS a shot, you’re always welcome. If you’re still sceptical, I recommend you wait for the “official reviews’. If you just want to scream “F*** THIS GAYME!”, well there’s nothing I can do for you; this type of hobby is just not for you.

[SJWs R TRAITORS]

hmmmm watching that second video time and time again, I atill have some doubts that most aircraft would lose their wing half way up, as this is usually a strong point where the landing gear attaches to the wing (excluding the 109) ? I'm not an expert so could have it totally wrong.

[Leigh]

DM is an interesting subject. The devs say they examined as much WW2 footage as they could when considering the DM. They concluded it would only take one or two 20mm rounds to knock a wing off. Certainly BOM is more ruthless in this regard than other titles.

[Chuck_Owl]

Publicado originalmente por HuckleTheHutt5:

hmmmm watching that second video time and time again, I atill have some doubts that most aircraft would lose their wing half way up, as this is usually a strong point where the landing gear attaches to the wing (excluding the 109) ? I'm not an expert so could have it totally wrong.

We're not dealing with P-47s or B-17s that could take dozens of hits and still make it home in (relatively) one piece.

Russian and German aircraft were not as robust and sturdy as you might think. Cannon rounds are high-explosive charges that explode a fraction of second after impact, which means that it blows up inside the wing or fuselage structure it just struck. An internal explosion will lay waste to structural frames, stringers and wing spars and ribs without any problem. 20mm ShVAK and 20 mm MG FF/M are deadly and I think the damage model is fairly reasonable in that regard. You can take one or 2 hits, but not much more than that.

The Western front in its early stages was a bit different. Popular allied aircraft like the P-47, P-51, P-40 and early Mark Spitfires and Hurricanes used either .50 cal guns or .303 guns, which were of small caliber and required much more hits to do any damage to structural components. Most damage came from projectiles lodging themselves in functional components of the aircraft such as engine, radiators or control surfaces. Of course, late war brought Hispano cannons and bigger caliber which brought a similar result to what you'd see in BoS at this stage of the war.

[Elfgren]

Publicado originalmente por HuckleTheHutt5:

hmmmm watching that second video time and time again, I atill have some doubts that most aircraft would lose their wing half way up, as this is usually a strong point where the landing gear attaches to the wing (excluding the 109) ? I'm not an expert so could have it totally wrong.

You do have it totally wrong. Watch this video and repent....

This is an FW 190, which is represented in BoS.

http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65675034793_8th-Air-Force_FW-190-aircraft_aircraft-trying-evasive-action_plane-flying-over-clouds

[Yggdrasil]

Publicado originalmente por elf30:

Publicado originalmente por HuckleTheHutt5:

hmmmm watching that second video time and time again, I atill have some doubts that most aircraft would lose their wing half way up, as this is usually a strong point where the landing gear attaches to the wing (excluding the 109) ? I'm not an expert so could have it totally wrong.

You do have it totally wrong. Watch this video and repent....

This is an FW 190, which is represented in BoS.

http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65675034793_8th-Air-Force_FW-190-aircraft_aircraft-trying-evasive-action_plane-flying-over-clouds

Whoa, great one-shot kill! You think the FW pilot was whining about hacker insta-kills ;)?

[FlatSpinMan]

Good post.

[SJWs R TRAITORS]

Publicado originalmente por elf30:

Publicado originalmente por HuckleTheHutt5:

hmmmm watching that second video time and time again, I atill have some doubts that most aircraft would lose their wing half way up, as this is usually a strong point where the landing gear attaches to the wing (excluding the 109) ? I'm not an expert so could have it totally wrong.

You do have it totally wrong. Watch this video and repent....

This is an FW 190, which is represented in BoS.

http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65675034793_8th-Air-Force_FW-190-aircraft_aircraft-trying-evasive-action_plane-flying-over-clouds

That FW's wing exploded, not broken off. It probably exploded bcause the US fighter (thunderbolt ?) probably hit the FW cannon shells in the wing, with his 8 x 1/2" lead bullets.

But i take your point, wings can break off at the point where the landing gear attaches. You're right.

[Elfgren]

Publicado originalmente por HuckleTheHutt5:

Publicado originalmente por elf30:

You do have it totally wrong. Watch this video and repent....

This is an FW 190, which is represented in BoS.

http://www.criticalpast.com/video/65675034793_8th-Air-Force_FW-190-aircraft_aircraft-trying-evasive-action_plane-flying-over-clouds

That FW's wing exploded, not broken off. It probably exploded bcause the US fighter (thunderbolt ?) probably hit the FW cannon shells in the wing, with his 8 x 1/2" lead bullets.

But i take your point, wings can break off at the point where the landing gear attaches. You're right.

Yes, it is hard to say what caused the wing to be blown off, it could have been a number of factors. For me the big takeaway from that video is that the ammo was probably .50 cal, and in BoS we are dealing, on average with 20 and 23mm. In some cases 37mm! So yes you should, and I have seen wings blown off regularly. It's glorius and rewarding when it happens. I've also seen wings take structural damage and then fold under G forces. I've even had my own canopy blown off, but I managed to still finish the fight and then land successfully.

The variety of "death animations" possible in the current beta DM is staggering. And I think it is only getting better.

[Chuck_Owl]

Publicado originalmente por elf30:

The variety of "death animations" possible in the current beta DM is staggering. And I think it is only getting better.

Collisions are also pretty impressive at times. See at 3:25
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vusvgo7f1hk

[Yggdrasil]

Publicado originalmente por 71st_AH_Chuck:

Publicado originalmente por elf30:

The variety of "death animations" possible in the current beta DM is staggering. And I think it is only getting better.

Collisions are also pretty impressive at times. See at 3:25
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vusvgo7f1hk

What a beaut! Thanks!

[Chuck_Owl]

You're welcome, Rolfskaider. :)

[marklar]

Publicado originalmente por 71st_AH_Chuck:

You do not “throttle up” like in War Thunder. You actually manage your engine by controlling your oil radiator, water radiator, flaps, propeller pitch (which modifies engine RPM), your mixture and your boost pressure (which is basically controlled by your throttle).

Actually you do “throttle up”, in some planes at least. Take Bf109-G2 for example: auto radiator flaps, auto mixture, auto propeller pitch. You can push throttle all the way up and don't worry about it. Of course it does not make this game simpler. Your plane is not your worst enemy.

[Chuck_Owl]

By "you do not throttle up" I meant that engine management is not simply based off throttle input. 109s currently have automated RPM based on ATA input, but I do think that 109 pilots will eventually be able to control it manually with the upcoming advanced engine management updates.

Russian aircraft require Manifold Pressure and RPM limiter input.

[=V=Heromant]

109G2 have 30 min in the 1.3 ATA. 1.2 ATA - not limited.
Also you may use manual control of the propeller pitch.

Also and for F4 and Fw-190.

[Dux Corvan]

Oh, guys, I know some of you!