60 fps for fatalities and x-rays

[CrIsCo TeH KlOwN]

I've seen this a lot as a request, but has never been addressed by WB. Please WB make this happen. We had the same situation for MK9, but with MK9 on PC, fatalities and x-rays where changed to 60 fps, so why not do it again for MKX??

[Zaxx]

Because it would be hard to do technically. It would be nice but it's not happening.

[CrIsCo TeH KlOwN]

It's not hard to do, if they were able to accomplish this for MK9 Komplete Edition. Also, what facts can you give that makes you so certain that it's that hard? I'm talking actual sited facts, not BS other people posted, or vague BS that developer spew out so that they can get away with not doing stuff like this to begin with.

[Zaxx]

Originally posted by CrIsCo TeH KlOwN:

It's not hard to do, if they were able to accomplish this for MK9 Komplete Edition. Also, what facts can you give that makes you so certain that it's that hard? I'm talking actual sited facts, not BS other people posted, or vague BS that developer spew out so that they can get away with not doing stuff like this to begin with.

- The main reason is a BS one: WB wanted all platforms to have technical parity to each other and that includes the fps hard lock.

- It can very well be an artistic choice on the developer's part: the engine uses pretty high quality motion blur and the x-rays and fatalities are usually cut differently than what we've seen in MK9. NRS is a console developer and console developers usually treat 30 fps as a "cinematic element" when it comes to cutscenes... with motion blur it works too.

- The game's speed is tied to the framerate so if you'd remove the 30 fps lock from xray and fatalities they would run at twice the speed they do now. You can of course fix this but that depends on how the animations were actually recorded when NRS did the motions capture stuff. If they were produced at 30 fps and they don't have higher framerate versions of them then even with a fix they'd look something like the physics effects in the original Bioshock: the game ran at a smooth 60+ on PC but the physics were always capped at 25.

- These sections can be very demanding: xray's and fatalities use much higher quality models than what you see in regular gameplay, post-processing is kinda crazy, they use skeleton riggig, muscle deformation etc. so a PC that can just hold a steady 60 fps during normal gameplay would not be able to produce that during these parts. The fighting game community is already rather small on PC so I don't think it would be a good idea to make it even smaller by higher system requirements.

- We don't know exactly how the netcode works so removing the 30 fps lock could mess up parts of it, adding a fair amount to the development time.

[CrIsCo TeH KlOwN]

Originally posted by Zaxx:

Originally posted by CrIsCo TeH KlOwN:

It's not hard to do, if they were able to accomplish this for MK9 Komplete Edition. Also, what facts can you give that makes you so certain that it's that hard? I'm talking actual sited facts, not BS other people posted, or vague BS that developer spew out so that they can get away with not doing stuff like this to begin with.

- The main reason is a BS one: WB wanted all platforms to have technical parity to each other and that includes the fps hard lock.

- It can very well be an artistic choice on the developer's part: the engine uses pretty high quality motion blur and the x-rays and fatalities are usually cut differently than what we've seen in MK9. NRS is a console developer and console developers usually treat 30 fps as a "cinematic element" when it comes to cutscenes... with motion blur it works too.

- The game's speed is tied to the framerate so if you'd remove the 30 fps lock from xray and fatalities they would run at twice the speed they do now. You can of course fix this but that depends on how the animations were actually recorded when NRS did the motions capture stuff. If they were produced at 30 fps and they don't have higher framerate versions of them then even with a fix they'd look something like the physics effects in the original Bioshock: the game ran at a smooth 60+ on PC but the physics were always capped at 25.

- These sections can be very demanding: xray's and fatalities use much higher quality models than what you see in regular gameplay, post-processing is kinda crazy, they use skeleton riggig, muscle deformation etc. so a PC that can just hold a steady 60 fps during normal gameplay would not be able to produce that during these parts. The fighting game community is already rather small on PC so I don't think it would be a good idea to make it even smaller by higher system requirements.

- We don't know exactly how the netcode works so removing the 30 fps lock could mess up parts of it, adding a fair amount to the development time.

There's that BS I was talking about, and it's probably when the game was first released too. Again, they were able to accomplish it without an issue in MK9.

[Zaxx]

Originally posted by CrIsCo TeH KlOwN:

Originally posted by Zaxx:

- The main reason is a BS one: WB wanted all platforms to have technical parity to each other and that includes the fps hard lock.

- It can very well be an artistic choice on the developer's part: the engine uses pretty high quality motion blur and the x-rays and fatalities are usually cut differently than what we've seen in MK9. NRS is a console developer and console developers usually treat 30 fps as a "cinematic element" when it comes to cutscenes... with motion blur it works too.

- The game's speed is tied to the framerate so if you'd remove the 30 fps lock from xray and fatalities they would run at twice the speed they do now. You can of course fix this but that depends on how the animations were actually recorded when NRS did the motions capture stuff. If they were produced at 30 fps and they don't have higher framerate versions of them then even with a fix they'd look something like the physics effects in the original Bioshock: the game ran at a smooth 60+ on PC but the physics were always capped at 25.

- These sections can be very demanding: xray's and fatalities use much higher quality models than what you see in regular gameplay, post-processing is kinda crazy, they use skeleton riggig, muscle deformation etc. so a PC that can just hold a steady 60 fps during normal gameplay would not be able to produce that during these parts. The fighting game community is already rather small on PC so I don't think it would be a good idea to make it even smaller by higher system requirements.

- We don't know exactly how the netcode works so removing the 30 fps lock could mess up parts of it, adding a fair amount to the development time.

There's that BS I was talking about, and it's probably when the game was first released too. Again, they were able to accomplish it without an issue in MK9.

So uh, you know exactly how NRS's custom built version of UE3 works? MK9 used a vastly different version than what is running under MKX so things that worked before won't necessarily work now. For example in MK9 we had a number of AA options while MKX only supports fxaa. The reason is most likely deferred rendering so more intensive AA is kinda out of the question for this game.

Something similar may prevent QLOC from removing the fps lock, we simply have next to no idea how the engine works. Saying "hey, it worked in MK9 so it should work now" is a really bad argument that disregards 4 years of engine development on top of being stupid. Having 60 fps cutscenes and better AA would be great but honestly stuff like this is not what makes or breaks a fighting game.

[CrIsCo TeH KlOwN]

Originally posted by Zaxx:

Originally posted by CrIsCo TeH KlOwN:

There's that BS I was talking about, and it's probably when the game was first released too. Again, they were able to accomplish it without an issue in MK9.

So uh, you know exactly how NRS's custom built version of UE3 works? MK9 used a vastly different version than what is running under MKX so things that worked before won't necessarily work now. For example in MK9 we had a number of AA options while MKX only supports fxaa. The reason is most likely deferred rendering so more intensive AA is kinda out of the question for this game.

Something similar may prevent QLOC from removing the fps lock, we simply have next to no idea how the engine works. Saying "hey, it worked in MK9 so it should work now" is a really bad argument that disregards 4 years of engine development on top of being stupid. Having 60 fps cutscenes and better AA would be great but honestly stuff like this is not what makes or breaks a fighting game.

So you're saying you have no idea, then you go on to say that it can't be done. Essentially you have said nothing.

I didn't post this to find out what people think, I posted this in an attempt to get the attention of the publisher. I have seen plenty of people post about wanting this to happen, but the few loud mouths, like yourself, can't help but try to discourage people like me from asking. More specifically, those who made the game.

If you are fine with how things are with the game, good for you. Move on to another post, or get on with your life.

[Zaxx]

Originally posted by CrIsCo TeH KlOwN:

Originally posted by Zaxx:

So uh, you know exactly how NRS's custom built version of UE3 works? MK9 used a vastly different version than what is running under MKX so things that worked before won't necessarily work now. For example in MK9 we had a number of AA options while MKX only supports fxaa. The reason is most likely deferred rendering so more intensive AA is kinda out of the question for this game.

Something similar may prevent QLOC from removing the fps lock, we simply have next to no idea how the engine works. Saying "hey, it worked in MK9 so it should work now" is a really bad argument that disregards 4 years of engine development on top of being stupid. Having 60 fps cutscenes and better AA would be great but honestly stuff like this is not what makes or breaks a fighting game.

So you're saying you have no idea, then you go on to say that it can't be done. Essentially you have said nothing.

I didn't post this to find out what people think, I posted this in an attempt to get the attention of the publisher. I have seen plenty of people post about wanting this to happen, but the few loud mouths, like yourself, can't help but try to discourage people like me from asking. More specifically, those who made the game.

If you are fine with how things are with the game, good for you. Move on to another post, or get on with your life.

I'm not discouraging anyone, I'm just saying that based on what we know it's not something that should be realistically expected. It is certainly possible to remove the lock since it's still UE3 we're talking about but the thing is that if it didn't happen in 1 and a half years - even though yes, people are constantly asking for it - then there must be a strong reason behind that.

My somewhat educated guess is that it would simply mean a lot of work for a gain that is objectively speaking really not huge: the game is already doing a well enough job of "hiding" or "fancying up" the 30 fps with all the post-processing and motion blur so it's not a huge issue. Personally I think there are more important issues with the game, for example:

- the black crush issue of the pre-rendered cutscenes,
- the hitching that sometimes happens at the beginning of intros presumably because the game is still loading up some assets,
- stuttering during character endings
- the issues where DSR seems to negatively affect the motion blur effect's visibility (maybe it's the same with simply running the game at a higher resolution than 1080p too)
- the blood colour bug
- the buggy "finish him" logo when you go into the menu during it being displayed
- netcode improvements

I'd rather see this stuff fixed instead of having 60 fps fatalities because most people just don't care about that stuff, what they care about is the actual technical quality of the port and the gameplay.

[CrIsCo TeH KlOwN]

Originally posted by Zaxx:

Originally posted by CrIsCo TeH KlOwN:

So you're saying you have no idea, then you go on to say that it can't be done. Essentially you have said nothing.

I didn't post this to find out what people think, I posted this in an attempt to get the attention of the publisher. I have seen plenty of people post about wanting this to happen, but the few loud mouths, like yourself, can't help but try to discourage people like me from asking. More specifically, those who made the game.

If you are fine with how things are with the game, good for you. Move on to another post, or get on with your life.

I'm not discouraging anyone, I'm just saying that based on what we know it's not something that should be realistically expected. It is certainly possible to remove the lock since it's still UE3 we're talking about but the thing is that if it didn't happen in 1 and a half years - even though yes, people are constantly asking for it - then there must be a strong reason behind that.

My somewhat educated guess is that it would simply mean a lot of work for a gain that is objectively speaking really not huge: the game is already doing a well enough job of "hiding" or "fancying up" the 30 fps with all the post-processing and motion blur so it's not a huge issue. Personally I think there are more important issues with the game, for example:

- the black crush issue of the pre-rendered cutscenes,
- the hitching that sometimes happens at the beginning of intros presumably because the game is still loading up some assets,
- stuttering during character endings
- the issues where DSR seems to negatively affect the motion blur effect's visibility (maybe it's the same with simply running the game at a higher resolution than 1080p too)
- the blood colour bug
- the buggy "finish him" logo when you go into the menu during it being displayed
- netcode improvements

I'd rather see this stuff fixed instead of having 60 fps fatalities because most people just don't care about that stuff, what they care about is the actual technical quality of the port and the gameplay.

If you can't see your reponses as an attempt to block people from asking, you are hopeless.

[Zaxx]

Originally posted by CrIsCo TeH KlOwN:

If you can't see your reponses as an attempt to block people from asking, you are hopeless.

Block people from asking!? :D Hey, all I wanted was just to start a mature conversation about the issue but I really hoped for too much if I only get "your're disagreeing with me therefore you're hurting the chance of this getting fixed!" instead of a legitimite counterargument. How about just contacting support instead of opening a thread on Steam (at least the 100th one that deals with this issue I might add) if you literally can't defend your main point?

You know what I've never seen answered in all the threads about this? Exactly why do you find 60 fps fatalities / x-rays that important? What about stuff that is locked too like the krypt or the character select screen where 60 fps would have more of a reason to exist because there is actual player interaction happening there? It basically always comes down to some stupid argument like "60 fps is a must on PC because that English guy says so!" even though even good ole' TotalBiscuit stated that he is perfectly fine with 30 fps intros in a fighting game... guess because he actually plays them and he knows that they don't matter ♥♥♥♥.

So basically sorry for "destroying" your thread - after 4 days of nobody giving a ♥♥♥♥ about it - but next time at least think about what you want and why you want it, please.

[CrIsCo TeH KlOwN]

Originally posted by Zaxx:

Originally posted by CrIsCo TeH KlOwN:

If you can't see your reponses as an attempt to block people from asking, you are hopeless.

Block people from asking!? :D Hey, all I wanted was just to start a mature conversation about the issue but I really hoped for too much if I only get "your're disagreeing with me therefore you're hurting the chance of this getting fixed!" instead of a legitimite counterargument. How about just contacting support instead of opening a thread on Steam (at least the 100th one that deals with this issue I might add) if you literally can't defend your main point?

You know what I've never seen answered in all the threads about this? Exactly why do you find 60 fps fatalities / x-rays that important? What about stuff that is locked too like the krypt or the character select screen where 60 fps would have more of a reason to exist because there is actual player interaction happening there? It basically always comes down to some stupid argument like "60 fps is a must on PC because that English guy says so!" even though even good ole' TotalBiscuit stated that he is perfectly fine with 30 fps intros in a fighting game... guess because he actually plays them and he knows that they don't matter ♥♥♥♥.

So basically sorry for "destroying" your thread - after 4 days of nobody giving a ♥♥♥♥ about it - but next time at least think about what you want and why you want it, please.

Move along.

[Zaxx]

Originally posted by CrIsCo TeH KlOwN:

Move along.

Sure, sure, I don't like talking to private profiles anyway... but why open public threads if you don't want people to read and comment on them? What is the point? You want to notifiy the publisher that almighty whateverclown has a request because his eyes bleed from 10 seconds of 30 fps footage every once in a while? This is where you should go, seriously:
http://support.wbgames.com/

Hell, you can even contact the developer if you want, they exist, they are real people you can get in contact with, WOW:
https://www.facebook.com/QLOC.studio

"Oh, I opened a thread on the Steam forums and THERE'S PEOPLE HERE... WITH OPINIONS! What the hell should I do, play the ignore card?"