Just for Fun: How would you Rank Obduction among the Myst Series?

[wander]

Since I love FMV & Good Stories, here's how I'd rank them:

1. Myst: Exile--man trapped for years, alone. Help him or kill him?
2. Myst (original)--two brothers, one choice.
3. Riven--the princess is in another castle
4. Obduction--Wild West in Space
5. Myst IV: Revelation--yep, Sirrus is still Evil
6. Myst V: End of Ages-freeing the slaves
7. Uru (come on, we all know it was the worst) --a history lesson *zzzz*

[BogusMeatFactory]

Originally posted by CobraA1:

Outside of the player models, I never understood the distaste for the graphics. They still look good today.

Looking at screenshots online (I don't have it installed anymore): Low-poly models, low-res textures, textures streched too much on surfaces, poor texture filtering, using single quads with transparency in a lot of places, lack of bump or normal mapping in places that needed it, poor/unrealiatic lighting.

It was pretty mediocre back then, and by today's standards I'd rate it as terrible. Especially after playing Obduction, which clearly blows it out of the water.

Game released in 2001 versus game made in 2016

[CobraA1]

Originally posted by BogusMeatFactory:

Game released in 2001 versus game made in 2016

You made the claim that "they still look good today." Does it surprise you that if you are making the claim that they look good today, that I will compare it to a game being made today?

[Denis]

Well, technically outdated doesn't equal ugly. Of course the textures are blurry, the 3D models low-poly, the shadows not realistic compared with today's standard. But the art is still excellent within its limits. The design, the colours etc. are making it beautiful to look at in my opinion. Besides, it does look better in motion. Riven's low resolution is hopelessly outdated too, but there's still a lot of beauty in its art.

[BogusMeatFactory]

Originally posted by Denis:

Well, technically outdated doesn't equal ugly. Of course the textures are blurry, the 3D models low-poly, the shadows not realistic compared with today's standard. But the art is still excellent within its limits. The design, the colours etc. are making it beautiful to look at in my opinion. Besides, it does look better in motion. Riven's low resolution is hopelessly outdated too, but there's still a lot of beauty in its art.

Thank you! This guy gets it.

[wander]

Originally posted by Denis:

Well, technically outdated doesn't equal ugly. Of course the textures are blurry, the 3D models low-poly, the shadows not realistic compared with today's standard. But the art is still excellent within its limits. The design, the colours etc. are making it beautiful to look at in my opinion. Besides, it does look better in motion. Riven's low resolution is hopelessly outdated too, but there's still a lot of beauty in its art.

I did find Uru's setting quite lovely, as I recall. One of the things I noticed about Obduction was that the sky didn't change (am I crazy in remembering that in some of the other games the clouds would actually appear to drift across the sky, and the sun would rise and set?). If there was one weakness in Obduction's graphics, it was the realistic sense of passing time. Uru's story was just not that interesting to me (I'm not as interested in the history of the D'ni as some of you are). But it was quite beautiful for its day.

[AuldWolf]

Good grief. Uru's only the worst if you place gladhanding with D'ni figures presented through grainy FMV over the sheer awe and wonder of the incredibly envisioned ages of Uru. I really do think that Ye Olde Pure Adventure Game elitism can go way too far. Which likely had a lot to do with why the genre died off for a while.

My list would go something like this:

1. Uru: Complete Chronicles / MYST Online
2. Riven: The Sequel to MYST
3. Myst V: End of Ages
4: Obduction
5. MYST
6. The Ubisoft Games

[CobraA1]

URU just seemed to take forever. It was pretty obviously designed to be a pseudo-MMO. Maybe I will try again sometime.

Is there still puzzles with crappy physics? If I have to solve that kick-around-the-stone (stones? been a while) puzzle again . . .

I also wasn't impressed by looking for all of the hands. Let me look everywhere again to try to find the one that I missed on this really large cleft area that I swear I've combed completely. How many places can you hide things in a large empty area? Apparently, the URU team was especially sneaky. Sigh.

Meh. URU wasn't #1. Aesthetics were good, but held back by the engine. Puzzle design wasn't great. Getting anything done took forever. I gave up. GameTap closed up. Only game I didn't finish. Well, looking through old walkthroughs, maybe I finished what was intended to be the single player? But I seem to recall there was something I didn't finish. Perhaps I didn't unlock everything for my island. That was the unfinished part.

In any case, I was never wholly satisfied with URU.

Mtst, Riven, and Obduction are probably the top for me. In fact, put Revelation up there as well, even though it wasn't Cyan.

Myst and Revelation had a particularly strong emotional impact for me - Myst, probably because it was one of the first games I played with a big choice at the end (although - it was fairly obvious to go with Artus' book). Revelation because of the abduction of Yeesha.

I do think that the conflict between the brothers and the father is a strong point for the Myst series.

[Jiggaman2000]

My list:

1. Riven: The Sequel to MYST
2. Myst III: Exile
3. Myst IV: Revelation
4: Obduction
5. MYST

Haven't played URU or Myst V: End of Ages.

[ShadowNate]

1. Riven. By far. No other game in the series, let alone other adventure has managed to be such a masterpiece in my eyes. Great puzzles, great OST.
2. Myst original or one of the thousand freaking iterations of it. Good puzzles, great OST.
3. Myst III. Some bad navigational issues, but otherwise a great addition to the Myst series, even though not made by Cyan. Brad Dourif was an excellent cast choice. Very good OST.
4. URU. Too many flaws because of the MMO design direction that imploded, but some great looking Ages, some clever puzzles (albeit amidst some absolut terrible ones), and much fan service. Very good OST.
5. Obduction. A new Myst, but not really that new. Great visuals. Good OST.
6. Myst V: End of Ages. Or URU: What was left out. Gets points for fan service and the "descent" part. Loses points for the terrible stone plate mechanics, the boring speeches by both charcaters you get to meet, the meh "good" finale, and the crime they did for the bad finale (the Myst island prison. Hey, you got your wish to revisit Myst! But it's no longer fun! It's your nightmare.). Decent to meh OST.
7. Myst IV: Revelation. Retcons ahoy. "Dream" puzzle. The game punishing you for trivial actions/ curiosity. Bad actors. Annoying main theme and meh OST overall. The worst in the seires for me. The. worst.

[Denis]

My completely subjective list. Can't decide on a definite ranking, so I'll divide the games into three groups. There's not a single bad game among them though.


The Great

Riven - Excellent in all areas, and really (almost too) hard. Can be frustrating at the beginning, but very rewarding once you start to figure things out. Riven is simply a masterpiece in world building. History, geography, puzzles and story blend seamlessly and form one the most believable worlds you can find in a video game. They've cut no corners and made no compromises with this game.

Obduction - Excellent in all areas. Captures the feeling of the original Myst really well, being put into a strange world with no clue what's going on. Easier than Riven, doesn't quite have the same depth, but exploring and puzzle solving it is just as satisfying. It has a great story, very interesting worlds to explore and good puzzles that are well integrated into the environment and the story. The difficulty level was just about right for me. The visuals and the overall design work is stunning. Obduction turned out to be the game I was hoping for.


The Good

Myst - Visuals were groundbreaking at the time, but haven't aged very well. Lots of nice puzzles and interesting environments though. It delivers the original feeling of being alone in a strange world without prior knowlegde, trying to make sense of it all, and the difficulty level is pretty much spot-on. The story is a little thin and some elements feel contrived. Still a very good game, but Riven is better in almost every way.

RealMyst: The same as Myst, but looks prettier and is nicer to play, being able to move freely.

Myst III: Exile - The easiest of the bunch. Lots of nice ideas and rewarding puzzles, but the ages don't feel quite as natural. Does many things right though.

Myst IV: Revelation - Great visuals and atmosphere, decent acting, some of the most beautiful ages in the whole series... this could have been a masterpiece, but some of the puzzles almost ruin the experience.


The Missed Opportunities

Uru: The Complete Chronicles & Uru Live - Fantastic worlds with clever designs. Lots of brilliant puzzles, but also some of the most tedious and annoying parts in the whole series. Way too much repetitive stuff in some places. Visuals are beautiful and have aged surprisingly well. The concept behind the online version is great in theory, but it was never fleshed out well enough. It's more of a "what could have been" thing. The story is... very vague. There's obviously a rich backstory, and reading about the history of D'ni was great, but the actual game story didn't do much for me. In the end of "Uru: Ages Beyond Myst" Yeesha says something like: "You don't need to understand what this means" - yeah, thank you. So I just played it for the sake of exploring the ages and reading stuff, but that alone was worth it. It has lots of brilliant moments, but it's also flawed in many ways.

Myst V: End of Ages - Feels (and probably is) unfinished. Some story elements seemed to come out of nowhere if you haven't played Uru before (which I only did after playing Myst V). Graphics are a step up from Uru, and the game still looks really beautiful. The tablet mechanic is a great idea, but it's too buggy. Again, similar to Uru, the story feels very vague and didn't do much for me. Too many bland character monologues interrupt the exploration. The good ending is kind of awkward, and some animations in that ending are surprisingly bad. I actually prefer the alternate bad endings, and that says a lot. I still liked this game, because exploring the beautiful and interesting ages made up for its flaws.

[wander]

Hmmmm....you downgraded Myst V for being incomplete, but isn't Obduction? What about the melted planet (I can never remember the silly names) at the end? I got the feeling there should have been some content there....but maybe I'm wrong.

[Denis]

I don't know if they originally intended more content for it, but to me it feels complete. I don't care if it was because of budget limitations or not, because the other worlds are large and full of puzzles and it makes perfect sense for the story that Soria is completely destroyed. Everything dead here, move along, no puzzles to solve.. Visiting this world was a special moment, because you finally get to see what this Mofang weapon could have done to the other worlds. It's an interesting fact that nothing but the tree has survived, and you can get a glimpse of earth outside of Soria. So this place ties some story elements together, and any real puzzles would feel out of place here. It's a depressing visit, but it serves its purpose.
In Myst V however, some of the ages feel quite small and don't even contribute anything substantial to the story. And it feels unfinished because of the lack of polish in the ending and the buggy tablet that has never been fixed.

[Calico]

It's been a long time since I played Myst V, but I seem to recall that there were a few story elements in the game that were directly related to things discussed in the novel trilogy, which may be why they seem to come out of nowhere or unfinished. I think this goes for Uru too.

Also Uru's story is vague mostly because I think it's a collection of vignettes structured like quests holding over from its MMO days. Like the age where the person used the books to make others think he could control time. That was a self contained story that didn't really tie in to anything else other than that age.

[Denis]

Yeah, this is why I categorized them as "missed opportunities". They are by no means bad games. But with Myst V (I'm currently playing it again) I get the impression that they wanted to do more, but ran out of time.
And Uru, I really like it. It's huge and parts of it are better than Myst III and IV. But it is caught somewhere between single and multiplayer. It's clear that, originally, it wasn't designed to be a single-player experience. On the other hand the multiplayer part never reached its full potential either. I can't really blame Cyan for any of this, and they still managed to deliver two pretty good games under these difficult circumstances.

[Esteri]

Revelation was by far my favorite game in the series. It was beautiful, the puzzles felt "organic" in a way that I hadn't felt nearly so much in the other games. The details of the environments were astounding and I loved walking the ages, going into the rooms and labs and tap-tap-tapping on every available object in sight, delighting when each responded aurally to my touch.

I played Myst and Riven when I was far too young to play them without a guide (which I did not have) and Riven especially frustrated the heck out of me. I still liked them for the most part, though - even if switching CDs got crazy old after a while.

Exile followed Revelations for me, with a good story and very good acting. I tried End of Ages and was hugely disappointed with how it looked and how clunky and finicky the tablet was; I never finished it. I don't think I even tried Uru beyond about 10 minutes - maybe one day I'd be able to give it another chance, but it never struck a chord with me at the time.

So far Obduction is giving me similar vibes to Revelation, except it's... easier? Aside from the fact I'm unable to keep a map in my head (it took me 20 minutes to find my way back from Hunrath to the forest planet) everything has been extremely easy (though I'm not sure how far I am right now). Of course, I'm sure when I have to go back to the machine planet (sorry, I forget their names) and deal with that complicated looking panel it won't yield so readily to me.