Veni, Vidi, De-Wishlist-i

[Frequens]

Hey devs, what's up, how's it going? What's the matter with you all? You guys like sawing through your own branch or something?!

Anyway, lemme give it to you short and sweet: Denuvo detected = product from wishlist ejected. Bye bye

[DankWestern]

Self reporting as a thief I see, they're technically losing nothing if you were crying about not being able to pirate it in the first place. I'll never understand why armies of you cry about this kind of thing openly when your motivations are so transparent.

[Enano]

Originally posted by DankWestern:

Self reporting as a thief I see, they're technically losing nothing if you were crying about not being able to pirate it in the first place. I'll never understand why armies of you cry about this kind of thing openly when your motivations are so transparent.

Self reporting as a corporate ♥♥♥♥♥ or a terrible troll? for so many years has been shown that Denuvo ♥♥♥♥♥ up pc performance, and there are morons like you still liking the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ boots. ill just go back to emulate this game or play it on my ps2

[Nightmare]

I don't think everyone who has a problem with Denuvo is automatically a thief or a warez kiddy.

Denuvo will not improve the game itself, it can only lead to problems.
I, personally, don't see much sense because it will be cracked few days after its release anyway.
Furthermore, if someone really wants to play this game, they can still get the Ps2 version and emulate it

Cheers!

[Frequens]

Originally posted by DankWestern:

Self reporting as a thief I see, they're technically losing nothing if you were crying about not being able to pirate it in the first place. I'll never understand why armies of you cry about this kind of thing openly when your motivations are so transparent.

Self-reporting as an avid gamer and faithful customer who is simply opposed to having malicious rootkits running on his expensive rig. I want to enjoy my games free of bloat and don't want them run in a virtual machine. There, corrected it for you.

Anyone with a more-or-less functioning mind should know by now that malware denuvo was never about 'thieves' but is there to protect anti-consumer practices. But this clearly sailed over your head.

[Sarge the doggo]

Originally posted by Frequens:

but is there to protect anti-consumer practices.

Such as? I have lots of games with denuvo nothings ever ever happened ever.

Nothing burger.

[neon.wir]

Originally posted by Sarge the doggo:

Originally posted by Frequens:

but is there to protect anti-consumer practices.

Such as? I have lots of games with denuvo nothings ever ever happened ever.

Nothing burger.

A consumer who paid for a game may reasonably expect that game to work, or at the least retain access to it, without limit once that transaction has been finalized.

Anti-consumer practices are when a business may be unfairly favored over the consumers that they reach. As far as entertainment goes, games are unusually tied to various permissions of access. Things such as requiring initial online authentication, periodic online check-ins, the continued upkeep of outside servers, and the simple decision of someone at some company at some undisclosed and unknowable date and time deciding if a game that has been paid in full by the consumer will remain accessible are all things that can seen as anti-consumer in various contexts. And many times (pretty much all the time) these games have terms of service that attempt to diminish the consumer's ability to act through the reach of the law, making it even more difficult for the consumer to do anything in response. This is all about companies being in control of their product in an innumerable number of ways. Arguably far more control than is reasonable.

If you want a recent example of a game having its support ended and no longer legitimately playable by those who paid for it, you can look up The Crew that was published by Ubisoft. That case in particular sparked a lot of controversy and has led to an active movement known as "Stop Killing Games" spearheaded by Ross Scott.

One thing Denuvo does is allow developers to implement a piece of software that will periodically ping an outside server. When this happens it can go "Hey, this checks out. Continue playing." If this check fails due to servers being down or otherwise inaccessible, then the next time it needs to ping that server it won't be able to and will render the game unplayable for the person trying to play it. This software is no way vital to the game itself, but has become a dependency for the game to continue functioning all the same. The person who bought the game has absolutely no control over this requirement whatsoever, leaving the lifespan of the game not to "if it ends" but "when it ends." It may be tomorrow, the next day, or 20 years from now. It's impossible to say. But at some point that service will cease to be.

I know those games you bought with Denuvo are very fun and I'm glad they haven't given you any trouble as of yet. However, the fact remains that as long as those games are reliant on Denuvo, your continued ability to play them is also reliant on it. Denuvo not being there would only allow you more freedom as a consumer to protect and preserve that game you paid for should you choose to do so. And even if you are totally fine with the idea of the game you paid for arbitrarily being taken away from you later,I don't think it's a stretch to see why many other people are not fine with it. It’s uncomfortable with that shadow looming over the art and entertainment that we all pay for and enjoy every day.

[Sarge the doggo]

Originally posted by neon.wir:

And even if you are totally fine with the idea of the game you paid for arbitrarily being taken away from you later

I have almost 6000 games on steam and I never been able to not play any of them besides live service games that have had their servers shut down.

What game has been taken away by denuvo? Name one

[neon.wir]

Originally posted by Sarge the doggo:

Originally posted by neon.wir:

And even if you are totally fine with the idea of the game you paid for arbitrarily being taken away from you later

I have almost 6000 games on steam and I never been able to not play any of them besides live service games that have had their servers shut down.

What game has been taken away by denuvo? Name one

Again, it's about control. It is totally outside of the consumer ability to do anything about it.
And while I am not sure if this has happened with any games using Denuvo (so far), this HAS happened before with its predecessors like SecuROM and StarForce. People have seen this before, and they'd rather not see it again. And it will eventually happen again, which is the problem.

[Sarge the doggo]

Originally posted by neon.wir:

And while I am not sure if this has happened with any games using Denuvo (so far), this HAS happened before with its predecessors like SecuROM and StarForce.

Because it hasn't happened. You talk about SecuROM too? I'm on Flock right now which has SecuROM activation on it.

Capcom will be discontinuing digital sales of "Flock!" on Steam Store on May 8th 5:30PM PDT. Customers who have purchased the title prior to its delisting date may still be able to enjoy the game into the future depending on their PC operating system's ability to continue running the game.


Can you name one Capcom game people paid for and can't play?

[neon.wir]

Your initial post was asking about how these things are used to empower companies with the ability to employ anti-consumer practices and the concerns that come with that. The point of my response, which I've already reiterated, was to illustrate that companies demand a level of control over their products that leaves the legitimate consumer in a situation where they are unable to do anything about it should it occur. Many people are uncomfortable with companies having that kind of unquestionable control in the first place. Hence the apprehension to things like Denuvo. Regardless of what has or hasn't happened isn't the root of the issue, it's the level of control that one side has versus the other to do those things at all.

[Sarge the doggo]

Originally posted by neon.wir:

companies demand a level of control over their products that leaves the legitimate consumer in a situation where they are unable to do anything about it should it occur.

So name one instance, one game I cannot play today, from capcom or denuvo ill give you both chances

[neon.wir]

Originally posted by Sarge the doggo:

Originally posted by neon.wir:

companies demand a level of control over their products that leaves the legitimate consumer in a situation where they are unable to do anything about it should it occur.

So name one instance.

should it occur

[Sarge the doggo]

Originally posted by neon.wir:

should it occur

Yeah WW3 could break out, I could walk across the street and get hit by a car. I'm not gonna live my life in fear of "could occur" when you can't even give me one example.

I'll keep buying games with denuvo and enjoy them because its does nothing to affect me at all.

[neon.wir]

Originally posted by Sarge the doggo:

Originally posted by neon.wir:

should it occur

Yeah WW3 could break out, I could walk across the street and get hit by a car. I'm not gonna live my life in fear of "could occur" when you can't even give me one example.

I'll keep buying games with denuvo and enjoy them because its does nothing to affect me at all.

I was honestly not trying to tell you to do anything at all. I was only answering what I saw you pose as a legitimate question about anti-consumer practices and the concerns that surround them.

[Sarge the doggo]

Originally posted by neon.wir:

I was honestly not trying to tell you to do anything at all. I was only answering what I saw you pose as a legitimate question about anti-consumer practices and the concerns that surround them.

Originally posted by neon.wir:

However, the fact remains that as long as those games are reliant on Denuvo, your continued ability to play them is also reliant on it.

Originally posted by neon.wir:

And while I am not sure if this has happened with any games using Denuvo (so far), this HAS happened before with its predecessors like SecuROM and StarForce. People have seen this before, and they'd rather not see it again. And it will eventually happen again, which is the problem.

You sprinkled some fear-mongering in there tho, and I know better, but most people don't.

"A purchase of a digital product grants a license for the product on Steam." which you see everytime at checkout is by far more anti-consumer as its literally telling you don't own the game anyway. So what's a little more DRM ontop of DRM. Denuvos hardly a thing to be worried about.