Makes no sense

[zz]

So The fact That Cent Has less health Than Orochi Nobushi Kensi and Ronan Is very ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ broken. First off NONE of them have acual Armor, Its all cloth yet he has the same HP as shinobi Which Is A skinny ass miget With even worse armor. Just makes zero sense to me

[Trippy Drug]

Początkowo opublikowane przez steal_TH-9:

Well, if you want “realistic,” then the Warden’s speed would still be the same, but his stamina would drain faster.
Knights can be VERY mobile with the armor on, but they can’t regulate their breathing and body temps fully, due to the closed space.
If you want more realism, the Samurais would be slower because wooden armor is weaker and heavier than metal armor.
I would have liked the Raider to wear a mail shirt, at least, but he’s basically a berserker with a giant axe. Meanwhile, with the right set, the Berserker has a mail shirt. Warlord, Highlander, and Valkyrie have the best armory (Real Scotsmen wear kilts to WAR).

Also samurais would probably need to look for new swords in the middle of the fight when against knights,because against such heavy armor I'd imagine katanas would get damaged after a couple of strikes

[Dephty]

Początkowo opublikowane przez CybermΩnk:

Początkowo opublikowane przez steal_TH-9:

Well, if you want “realistic,” then the Warden’s speed would still be the same, but his stamina would drain faster.
Knights can be VERY mobile with the armor on, but they can’t regulate their breathing and body temps fully, due to the closed space.
If you want more realism, the Samurais would be slower because wooden armor is weaker and heavier than metal armor.
I would have liked the Raider to wear a mail shirt, at least, but he’s basically a berserker with a giant axe. Meanwhile, with the right set, the Berserker has a mail shirt. Warlord, Highlander, and Valkyrie have the best armory (Real Scotsmen wear kilts to WAR).

Also samurais would probably need to look for new swords in the middle of the fight when against knights,because against such heavy armor I'd imagine katanas would get damaged after a couple of strikes

And half of them would probably do seppuku.

[zz]

IF the game was being realistic Then why dont the knights take the longest to kill??? They have Chain Mail and Fullplate armor yet a Dagger From Shaman Can Go through their armor. Also The samuri Should have the Least HP because What do they have as protection?? They dont have armor... They dont have a shield... so How come They have the same If not more HP as the other Factions.

[Matiati]

Początkowo opublikowane przez steal_TH-9:

Well, if you want “realistic,” then the Warden’s speed would still be the same, but his stamina would drain faster.
Knights can be VERY mobile with the armor on, but they can’t regulate their breathing and body temps fully, due to the closed space.
If you want more realism, the Samurais would be slower because wooden armor is weaker and heavier than metal armor.
I would have liked the Raider to wear a mail shirt, at least, but he’s basically a berserker with a giant axe. Meanwhile, with the right set, the Berserker has a mail shirt. Warlord, Highlander, and Valkyrie have the best armory (Real Scotsmen wear kilts to WAR).

First of all Samurai never wore wooden armor (i.e. Kensei). This is another thing the Ubisoft completely misunderstood. Samurai armor is made of lamellar (mostly hardened leather) and banded iron in some sections. It should also be noted that none of the heroes in the game appear to wear a full Samurai set (while the knights do).

In terms of weight you are right. Samurai armor is comparable to plate armor having similar weight (20-30 kg). It has less protection but sections can bend much easier than the plate armor giving much more mobility. Also the head-piece provides a greater field of view (compared to most european pieces). The Samurai can use bows while riding horses. This is something a knight can almost never perform.

The side effect is that the Samurai armor is harder to maintain as it requires repair even after a single blow.

The main reason of the Samurai's speed is his weapon. Katana is a single edged sword that is very well balanced having its center of gravity just ahead of the tsuba (the blocker). And the sword has an average length of 108 cm. It weights around 800 gr - 1.5 kg.

Warden uses a two-edged european style two handed sword which is both longer (120-140 cm), thicker and heavier than a katana (2.2 kg - 3 kg). The sword is much more durable compared to a katana and can deal blunt damage (causing the armor to crush through the flesh) as well as slash damage. This sword can never achieve the speed of a katana. But when it hits it is much deadlier than a katana (especially against medium to heavy armored opponents). The sword is made for european (middle-ages) style (against heavily armored opponents) combat. And it is mostly useless in close quarters combat due to limited space.

[Crowii]

>Balanced competitive gameplay
>Historical accuracy

Pick one

[Trippy Drug]

In the end actual realism cannot be achieved,what can be achieved is layers of realism.Right now For honor is one step away from adding dragons and magic.And now that I think about it it already did with the halloween and christmas events,kinda.

The way I think it it goes something like this

-No realism

-For honor

-Stats and speed better represent each hero,although they are not super realistic either

-No unrealistiic moves such as shugoki breaking his opponents back only for him to stand up ok seconds later,while shugoki is magically healed.

-No unrealistic moves,and each faction is more like how it actually was in history-Slow moving knights heavily armored,more light armored samurais,no such fancy cosmetics

-Truly realistic combat where you can easily kill your opponent with one heavy attack at some cases,katana wielders attack faster and stronger and have to go find new swords because knights,knights break bones because heavy swords,,most heavy attacks if they don't kill you basically have you bleeding until you die,etc.

So it's not like we really want full realism in the game,but making it slightly less unrealistic isn't a bad idea for me.

[Dephty]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Crowii:

>Balanced competitive gameplay
>Historical accuracy

Pick one

Well we have neither atm.... So I'll go with boneless fixed game.

[Matiati]

Początkowo opublikowane przez CybermΩnk:

Also samurais would probably need to look for new swords in the middle of the fight when against knights,because against such heavy armor I'd imagine katanas would get damaged after a couple of strikes

That is mostly true. Samurai weapons are made to fight against the Samurai and Knight weapons were made to fight against the Knights. These groups have never met each other until 16th century. And by that time guns were already invented so nobody really cared to use heavy body armor any more (as it was pointless). Both fighting techniques vanished afterwards. Japanese had kept their Katanas as ceremonial swords. And European swordsmanship evolved into something that is similar to Escrima (that involved lighter weight thrusting swords such as rapiers and estoc).

[Matiati]

Początkowo opublikowane przez CybermΩnk:

In the end actual realism cannot be achieved,what can be achieved is layers of realism.Right now For honor is one step away from adding dragons and magic.And now that I think about it it already did with the halloween and christmas events,kinda.

The way I think it it goes something like this

-No realism

-For honor

-Stats and speed better represent each hero,although they are not super realistic either

-No unrealistiic moves such as shugoki breaking his opponents back only for him to stand up ok seconds later,while shugoki is magically healed.

-No unrealistic moves,and each faction is more like how it actually was in history-Slow moving knights heavily armored,more light armored samurais,no such fancy cosmetics

-Truly realistic combat where you can easily kill your opponent with one heavy attack at some cases,katana wielders attack faster and stronger and have to go find new swords because knights,knights break bones because heavy swords,,most heavy attacks if they don't kill you basically have you bleeding until you die,etc.

So it's not like we really want full realism in the game,but making it slightly less unrealistic isn't a bad idea for me.

Making it slightly unrealistic is great and a must for a game.

Making it more unrealistic than that destroys the game.

One step forward than the "For Honor" realism, would be to have warden cloak & sneak behind the enemy (with absolutely no noise) and stab him in the back with his giant two-hander... just like a classical rpg rogue.

[Trippy Drug]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Matiati:

Początkowo opublikowane przez CybermΩnk:

In the end actual realism cannot be achieved,what can be achieved is layers of realism.Right now For honor is one step away from adding dragons and magic.And now that I think about it it already did with the halloween and christmas events,kinda.

The way I think it it goes something like this

-No realism

-For honor

-Stats and speed better represent each hero,although they are not super realistic either

-No unrealistiic moves such as shugoki breaking his opponents back only for him to stand up ok seconds later,while shugoki is magically healed.

-No unrealistic moves,and each faction is more like how it actually was in history-Slow moving knights heavily armored,more light armored samurais,no such fancy cosmetics

-Truly realistic combat where you can easily kill your opponent with one heavy attack at some cases,katana wielders attack faster and stronger and have to go find new swords because knights,knights break bones because heavy swords,,most heavy attacks if they don't kill you basically have you bleeding until you die,etc.

So it's not like we really want full realism in the game,but making it slightly less unrealistic isn't a bad idea for me.

Making it slightly unrealistic is great and a must for a game.

Making it more unrealistic than that destroys the game.

One step forward than the "For Honor" realism, would be to have warden cloak & sneak behind the enemy (with absolutely no noise) and stab him in the back with his giant two-hander... just like a classical rpg rogue.

I do have to agree tbh.I always found it ridiculous how warden can swing a longsword,even a bastard longsword supposively,at such speed and with one hand(his zone attack).Knights should have slower and more damaging attacks overall.I understand that to make the game balanced realism should be limited,but if the developers were actually competent they could have made it so there was more realism in the game to an extent,without breaking balance.

Now we have a completely unrealistic game which is also broken.

[Malakith`4f]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Matiati:

well if you are expecting some form realism or immersiveness from this game then you are completely wrong.

My main is an orochi. Orochi is a Samurai with a single Katana right? As a practitioner of Kendo (which is why I choose Orochi) I can say that a well trained Japanese Swordsman can easily execute an attack in less than 300 milliseconds of time with a Katana weighting 800 gr - 1.2 kg. For throat thrusts (Suki) the time will be half of this. You can check this video from All Japan 2007 Kendo Championship.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4SHWXQBVL4

Of course the bamboo swords have around 500-600 gr weight and with a katana the time will be more. And against well armored opponents and in a real fight broader swings will be necessary to penetrate the armor and cut into the flesh (for of course non-thrust attacks).

Plus in Japanese Swordsmanship the attack is done in a way that it becomes very difficult for you opponent to read your attack's direction. İ.e. most attacks begin like suki (throat thrust) and changes its form to something other during the end phase of the attack. The human eye cannot realize the depth for perfectly aligned forward motion (i.e. if your sword appears as a single point from the view point of your opponent as it closes him/her). From this perspective, the Nobushi in the game is much better at hiding her attack with her attack animations. The same should actually go for any samurai classes as it is a Budo philosophy.

But in "For Honor" it appears that (except the top lights) orochi has very slow and telegraphed attacks. His whole stance is completely wrong. I.e. your sword must always point to you opponent's throat in chudan-no-kamae (the default) stance.

So that you can both protect yourself and execute fast thrusts to the most deadly and soft part of the human body (the throat). Orochi's sword's tip points to the sky. In a real samurai fight orochi would be a complete noob who would die in seconds.

Now compare Warden with the Orochi.

Warden's top and zone attacks are the fastest in the game. And the guy appears to be a two-handed sword wielding fully plate armored knight. Now his armor is around 27-30 kg and his sword weights around 3 kg (at least 2.2-2.3 times more than the katana).

Now this guys executes a zone attack with only a single hand that is much faster than any attacks of the orochi. Plus his top light is again faster than all of the orochi's attacks.

And they call this realism :D.

A real katana is around the same weight if not a bit heavier depending on the type of longsword you're wielding, at about 1.5kg, I own both. So saying a longsword is almost 2.5 times heavier is nonsense.

Mail also isn't all that heavy when you wear it, just like plate isn't all that heavy if it fits the person wearing it well. A full suit of plate armor is around 20-25kg and the weight is spread over the entire body. Modern military equipment is heavier than the plate armor used in the late 1400's. The plated armor samurai used is also about the same weight. Considering the samurai in For Honor wear wooden armor, it needs to be some form of hardwood to be of any protection, which would actually still make it really heavy. But yea, the wooden armor is complete bs lol

Penetrating plate or mail armor with a cut from a sword is also next to impossible, that's why you learn to target spots without or with little armor when using a sword against plate/ mail like the opening in the helmet, the armpits etc. This is one of the reasons why they used the mordhau strike and used halfswording in Europe, and later on made weapons to combat armor like maces, different types of polearms etc.

And I agree, most attacks in For Honor are pretty dumb and ineffective if you look at how it was done in real history.

And knights weren't slow.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hlIUrd7d1Q
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q-bnM5SuQkI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UntxiF3qtbg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eY8oMD0KCE4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aeEVSYZbnO4

[Matiati]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Malakith`af:

A real katana is around the same weight if not a bit heavier depending on the type of longsword you're wielding, at about 1.5kg, I own both. So saying a longsword is almost 2.5 times heavier is nonsense.

You might be right if the Warden wields a long sword. He does not. You can confirm this by looking at the warden's picture.

Warden's sword[i.ytimg.com]

A longsword is a sword that is between 110 cm to 130 cm hilt and blade included.

If you look at the above picture the warden's sword extend to the same level as his neck. Assuming an average guy is 175 cm and head height is around 23 cm that means his sword's length is around 152 cm. That is much longer than a longsword. And it fits into the greatsword/zweihander category. Such has a weight around 2 kg to 3.2 kg. A katana is inbetween 800gr - 1.5kg so a greatsword is around 2.1 to 2.5 times heavier than a katana.

You can never swing faster than a katana with a sword with that weight and length.

[Malakith`4f]

Początkowo opublikowane przez Matiati:

Początkowo opublikowane przez Malakith`af:

A real katana is around the same weight if not a bit heavier depending on the type of longsword you're wielding, at about 1.5kg, I own both. So saying a longsword is almost 2.5 times heavier is nonsense.

You might be right if the Warden wields a long sword. He does not. You can confirm this by looking at the warden's picture.

Warden's sword[i.ytimg.com]

A longsword is a sword that is between 110 cm to 130 cm hilt and blade included.

If you look at the above picture the warden's sword extend to the same level as his neck. Assuming an average guy is 175 cm and head height is around 23 cm that means his sword's length is around 152 cm. That is much longer than a longsword. And it fits into the greatsword/zweihander category. Such has a weight around 2 kg to 3.2 kg. A katana is inbetween 800gr - 1.5kg so a greatsword is around 2.1 to 2.5 times heavier than a katana.

You can never swing faster than a katana with a sword with that weight and length.

Exept that ubisoft says he wields a longsword, so it's a longsword no matter how bad they are at actually making it look like one.

https://imgur.com/a/hxx0D

Looking at how thick most blades are in for honor they might as well be hitting eachother with iron bars.

Also, the Elizabethan longsword had a blade of about 1.2m and was at the time and still is concidered a longsword. The classification of one extends beyond just the lenght of one. The size of them varied heavily and they deffinately got longer than 130cm. Longsword is an umbrella term after all. (B) astard swords and warswords are also seen as sub-classifications of longswords. Historically it was a mere description and never really used to define a certain type of sword like we do now.

Anyway, I don't think it even matters as Ubisoft describes it as a longsword, and as it's their game thats what it is. But you're right when you say that sword doesn't look like a longsword, It looks more like a hammer to me if you look at the guard!

(The B thing is because of profinity filter lol)