Shadowrun: Dragonfall - Director's Cut

Shadowrun: Dragonfall - Director's Cut

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Does Shadowrun actually belong to Microsoft?
Is Shadowrun actually owned by Microsoft?

How did they trademark something in 2004 that already existed in 1989?

"© 2014 Harebrained Holdings, Inc. All Rights Reserved. Shadowrun is a trademark of Microsoft."
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Hoi Chummers!


As I understand it...

FASA Corporation originally created and owned the rights to Shadowrun, and other games.

FASA Corporation spawned FASA Interactive Technologies Inc (later known as FASA Studios)

FASA Interactive Technologies Inc (FASA Studios) was granted the Video Game rights to the Shadowrun IP and a few other FASA games.

At that point in time (many years ago), there were two FASA companies, contractually holding different pieces of the Intellectual Property rights to FASA games. Mostly split between tabletop/book publishing and Video Game/interactive media rights.

A lot of drek happened. FASA Corporation shut down operations and became a holding company. It retained certain full IP rights for different games, certain partial rights for other games mostly focused on tabletop/book publishing property rights (like Earthdawn) and some of its property rights (IP's) were sold off, changing hands a few times after this, which is what happened to the Shadowrun tabletop/book publishing rights.

FASA Interactive Technologies Inc was sold away too, along with the Video Game licensing rights it held, including Shadowrun.

Today:

Microsoft had bought FASA Interactive Technologies Inc...aka: FASA Studios, which were shut down a few years ago, with Microsoft retaining the rights to the games it held. Microsoft now limittedly licenses Shadowrun IP Video Game rights to Harebrained Holdings, and Cliffhanger Productions. There are restrictions by Microsoft in the contracts with each company. We know only a few details e.g., no retail merchandising, no console game development, Cliffhanger's game can only be an "online" game...etc. Those licensing details can change with renegotiation, so we don't know if and when they change unless someone involved within these companies makes a statement about it. They're based on private contracts between companies.

Topps, Inc. ended up with the Shadowrun tabletop/book publishing rights, which they license to In Media Res, which uses the company, "Catalyst Game Labs" as the imprint for publishing Shadowrun tabletop/novels.

Lots of stuff happened between all this. Other companies controlled the Shadowrun tabletop/book publishing rights for a while, before Topps, Inc acquired it.


HBS has a good relationship with Microsoft, as Jordan Weisman went along with FASA Interactive Technologies Inc when Microsoft bought it, and worked for Microsoft on developing the creative side of Xbox. Despite some DRM related licensing contract hiccups during the Shadowrun Returns Kickstarter, Harebrained Schemes has commented that the folks at Microsoft have working with them in a very positive manner (keeping their hands off) HBS's development of Shadowrun Returns/Dragonfall/Hong Kong.

Shadowrun.com is under (licensed/contractual) control of Cliffhanger Productions, who are developing Shadowrun Online aka: Shadowrun Cronicles. In a friendly gesture, they offered to share Shadowrun.com with both Harebrained Schemes and Catalyst Game Labs.

All three companies are on friendly terms, which is pretty fraggin amazing, and reflective of the kind of community that exists amongst the Shadowrun fans and the developers who are also fans.

I'm just a fan who's kept up with some of this, and I've left a lot out, but these are the pertinent details. Does this help clear things up, Chummers? ^_^

Now...about copyrights.

Many of the previous Shadowrun products retain varying copyrights by their creators. So just because Microsoft now has the Shadowrun IP Video Game rights, does NOT necessarily mean they control the rights to the content or art of the SNES or Sega Genesis 16-bit video games. And Microsoft has no claim on the Shadowrun related works of Topps/InMediaRes/Catalyst Game Labs tabletop or novel authors or artists

For many reasons, the IP rights to Shadowrun are something of a mess, with many different contracts conveying various rights the public has never seen or heard of between companies, authors, artists and more, that make it difficult for the current IP holders to move forward in all the ways they'd wish to.

Just having registered trademarks or copyright isn't all there is to having a say in who can make claim on various content that's existed over the years, which is why people say Intellectual Property is complicated, and the Shadowrun IP is highly complicated due to having passed hands numerous times and having had a wide variety of contributors from different authors, artists, and developers with varying copyright and contractual claims on their individual contributions to the Shadowrun IP universe.

And there are no (US) laws requiring companies to reveal private contracts of this nature until a *valid* claimant brings a case to court and a judge issues an order, or some other legal process is employed.

Finally, as an aside that does NOT affect the Shadowrun Video Game issues, FASA Corporation - the holding company, has resurfaced by licensing certain FASA IP game rights (Earthdawn) to a NEW company called "FASA Games" which has no claim on the Shadowrun IP, and does not develop or publish any Shadowrun products or content.
Ostatnio edytowany przez: RClovesShadowrun; 20 marca 2015 o 3:50
Początkowo opublikowane przez Philip Marlowe:
Cookiez, can you indulge me one question - please? :)

With respect to indie HBS and the devs therein, what fears do we have?

Writing helps. Even "wild" things. Admittedly... We need each others' reflections, to see our deepest confessions.

All have stories. ~\l/~


UVY)(

Haha... I like this one.... I want to see your reflections too, to see your deepest confessions too....
Be ready Cookiez, that the Fear?





:)



Refection: You lack answer. Avoidance.


Ostatnio edytowany przez: Philip Marlowe; 20 marca 2015 o 9:33
Początkowo opublikowane przez Philip Marlowe:
Be ready Cookiez, that the Fear?





:)



Refection: You lack answer. Avoidance.

Ironically, isn't that what you are doing? I think the one who avoids giving more answers than me has more to fear. Especially, if the crowd is big. I can see the F.E.A.R. for sure.
Philip Marlowe 20 marca 2015 o 19:12 
Elaborate. Specifics - about me.

Then address your accusations. Specific.

So shall I.

Address. Never confront me with less. Lest you wish to look like just another troll.
Just another troll, with just another Death Drive - repressed, à la Freudian Psychoanalytic Theory.
Ostatnio edytowany przez: Philip Marlowe; 21 marca 2015 o 19:05
Początkowo opublikowane przez Philip Marlowe:
Elaborate. Specifics - about me.

Then address your accusations. Specific.

So shall I.

Address. Come to me with nothing less. Lest you wish to look like just another troll.
Just another troll, with just another Death Drive - repressed, à la Freudian Psychoanalytic Theory.

Ditto.
Philip Marlowe 21 marca 2015 o 10:03 
Reflection: Ditto.

*nods*

And somewhat wrong and somewhat right. Since history is our teacher.

Our only audience is the consciousness, and I am just another ignorantly-arrogant persona on that Theater.
Ostatnio edytowany przez: Philip Marlowe; 28 marca 2015 o 0:03
Wolfgang421 21 marca 2015 o 15:24 
Początkowo opublikowane przez RClovesShadowrun:
Hoi Chummers!
snip

Thanks for that, RC. I seem to recall reading bits and pieces of that in different places before, and it helps to have it in one place. The clarity is appreciated.

Początkowo opublikowane przez RClovesShadowrun:
Hoi Chummers!


As I understand it...

FASA Corporation originally created and owned the rights to Shadowrun, and other games.

FASA Corporation spawned FASA Interactive Technologies Inc (later known as FASA Studios)

FASA Interactive Technologies Inc (FASA Studios) was granted the Video Game rights to the Shadowrun IP and a few other FASA games.

At that point in time (many years ago), there were two FASA companies, contractually holding different pieces of the Intellectual Property rights to FASA games. Mostly split between tabletop/book publishing and Video Game/interactive media rights.

A lot of drek happened. FASA Corporation shut down operations and became a holding company. It retained certain full IP rights for different games, certain partial rights for other games mostly focused on tabletop/book publishing property rights (like Earthdawn) and some of its property rights (IP's) were sold off, changing hands a few times after this, which is what happened to the Shadowrun tabletop/book publishing rights.

FASA Interactive Technologies Inc was sold away too, along with the Video Game licensing rights it held, including Shadowrun.

Today:

Microsoft had bought FASA Interactive Technologies Inc...aka: FASA Studios, which were shut down a few years ago, with Microsoft retaining the rights to the games it held. Microsoft now limittedly licenses Shadowrun IP Video Game rights to Harebrained Holdings, and Cliffhanger Productions. There are restrictions by Microsoft in the contracts with each company. We know only a few details e.g., no retail merchandising, no console game development, Cliffhanger's game can only be an "online" game...etc. Those licensing details can change with renegotiation, so we don't know if and when they change unless someone involved within these companies makes a statement about it. They're based on private contracts between companies.

Topps, Inc. ended up with the Shadowrun tabletop/book publishing rights, which they license to In Media Res, which uses the company, "Catalyst Game Labs" as the imprint for publishing Shadowrun tabletop/novels.

Lots of stuff happened between all this. Other companies controlled the Shadowrun tabletop/book publishing rights for a while, before Topps, Inc acquired it.


HBS has a good relationship with Microsoft, as Jordan Weisman went along with FASA Interactive Technologies Inc when Microsoft bought it, and worked for Microsoft on developing the creative side of Xbox. Despite some DRM related licensing contract hiccups during the Shadowrun Returns Kickstarter, Harebrained Schemes has commented that the folks at Microsoft have working with them in a very positive manner (keeping their hands off) HBS's development of Shadowrun Returns/Dragonfall/Hong Kong.

Shadowrun.com is under (licensed/contractual) control of Cliffhanger Productions, who are developing Shadowrun Online aka: Shadowrun Cronicles. In a friendly gesture, they offered to share Shadowrun.com with both Harebrained Schemes and Catalyst Game Labs.

All three companies are on friendly terms, which is pretty fraggin amazing, and reflective of the kind of community that exists amongst the Shadowrun fans and the developers who are also fans.

I'm just a fan who's kept up with some of this, and I've left a lot out, but these are the pertinent details. Does this help clear things up, Chummers? ^_^

Now...about copyrights.

Many of the previous Shadowrun products retain varying copyrights by their creators. So just because Microsoft now has the Shadowrun IP Video Game rights, does NOT necessarily mean they control the rights to the content or art of the SNES or Sega Genesis 16-bit video games. And Microsoft has no claim on the Shadowrun related works of Topps/InMediaRes/Catalyst Game Labs tabletop or novel authors or artists

For many reasons, the IP rights to Shadowrun are something of a mess, with many different contracts conveying various rights the public has never seen or heard of between companies, authors, artists and more, that make it difficult for the current IP holders to move forward in all the ways they'd wish to.

Just having registered trademarks or copyright isn't all there is to having a say in who can make claim on various content that's existed over the years, which is why people say Intellectual Property is complicated, and the Shadowrun IP is highly complicated due to having passed hands numerous times and having had a wide variety of contributors from different authors, artists, and developers with varying copyright and contractual claims on their individual contributions to the Shadowrun IP universe.

And there are no (US) laws requiring companies to reveal private contracts of this nature until a *valid* claimant brings a case to court and a judge issues an order, or some other legal process is employed.

Finally, as an aside that does NOT affect the Shadowrun Video Game issues, FASA Corporation - the holding company, has resurfaced by licensing certain FASA IP game rights (Earthdawn) to a NEW company called "FASA Games" which has no claim on the Shadowrun IP, and does not develop or publish any Shadowrun products or content.

Thanks. This actually clarifies a lot, although without details. It's interesting to note how even an ex-Disney CEO is involved in Shadowrun.
Null Sweat, Chummer!

@Cookiez, more than one former Disney notable is involved with Shadowrun on the business side of things at this point in time. ~_^
Ostatnio edytowany przez: RClovesShadowrun; 23 marca 2015 o 23:54
Początkowo opublikowane przez RClovesShadowrun:
Null Sweat, Chummer!

@Cookiez, more than one former Disney notable is involved with Shadowrun on the business side of things at this point in time. ~_^

Ohh.... Even more interesting...
Zamio 28 marca 2015 o 14:31 
Początkowo opublikowane przez jgmaurer:
Not exactly. If I recall correctly, Harebrained has the right to make any Shadowrun Game for PC and Mobile devices (with no input or financial concerns from Microsoft). So no, they don't work for MS.

MS however retains rights for any and all future Shadowrun CONSOLE games. As such, any Shadowrun game that HBS makes will never be on consoles.

Kinda, sorta. Harebrained has a license from MS to make Shadowrun games, but they don't own the right to make them. Big difference.
Philip Marlowe 3 kwietnia 2015 o 11:18 
I see that I went too far. I'm sorry. I assure you, I'm still learning this whole time.

Know most of the time* I play as that pretentious GM, that implied author.

My thin skin, pessimistic presumptions, and pride predict my hypocrisy.

* 80 - 95% ≈ ish
Ostatnio edytowany przez: Philip Marlowe; 3 kwietnia 2015 o 17:38
Microsoft owned the rights to quite a few FASA games. How did you guys enjoy Mech Commander 2? How about Mechwarrior 4?

FASA had Shadowrun Games, Battletech Games, and other IPs Microsoft has and it made a mess of gaming in these genres for awhile.

Lately seems they got more laxed on things. We got Mechwarrior Online, Mechwarrior Tactics, a slew of Shadowrun games, and more to come!

FASA closed because they saw a sharp decline in tabletop gaming coming in the future and "Got out while they were ahead."

I don't think they foresaw the gaming industry picking up and running with these games really.

Dav 26 maja 2015 o 15:17 
Początkowo opublikowane przez The God Ghetto Holy:
Microsoft owned the rights to quite a few FASA games. How did you guys enjoy Mech Commander 2? How about Mechwarrior 4?

FASA had Shadowrun Games, Battletech Games, and other IPs Microsoft has and it made a mess of gaming in these genres for awhile.

Lately seems they got more laxed on things. We got Mechwarrior Online, Mechwarrior Tactics, a slew of Shadowrun games, and more to come!

FASA closed because they saw a sharp decline in tabletop gaming coming in the future and "Got out while they were ahead."

I don't think they foresaw the gaming industry picking up and running with these games really.
which is a shame, because under FASA, battletech/mechwarrior, and shadowrun, ect were outstanding properties. theyre only now starting to recover from some previous poor digital treatment
Ostatnio edytowany przez: Dav; 26 maja 2015 o 15:19
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