Aileron and rudder trim

[Nightmare1964]

How is it that I can fly my real world plane straight and level no probs only adjusting elevator trim, let go of the stick and it stays straight and level in good conditions, but in XP, as soon as I do this, it banks to the left or the right requiring aileron trimming and or rudder trimming?.... This is very unrealistic.

[Conure]

Originally posted by Nightmare:

How is it that I can fly my real world plane straight and level no probs only adjusting elevator trim, let go of the stick and it stays straight and level in good conditions, but in XP, as soon as I do this, it banks to the left or the right requiring aileron trimming and or rudder trimming?.... This is very unrealistic.

Have to say I've noticed this too - I've only flown a Cherokee and 152 in the real world but I did notice they don't roll like they do in XP10.

[Nightmare1964]

Yes, very annoying. In the real world, the aircraft engineers adjust trim tabs on the ailerons and rudder, they are small sections of thin metal bent to a precise angle to ensure the proper airflow to ensure stable flight. XP does not seem to do this. I wonder whether there is a way to rectify this.

[Beda]

Hi,

so you answered your question by yourself ;) You could try to create a default offset of your control surfaces using the trim functions in planemaker. It may not be the same, but with some testing you could achieve stable flying characterisitics at your desired cruise speed.

Out of curiosity: What plane do you fly in real life and X-Plane?

Greetings Peter

[Nightmare1964]

I'm not the Planemaker tinkering type, I would've thought the designers would have built that in as default. To me, I think they are selling an unfinished job, leaving the planes unstable like that. Also I'm not convinced that planemaker would fix the prob. When you have it all trimmed up correctly, and it's a job to do that, if you raise or lower the power setting or increase or decrease the altitude, it goes out again. That simply does not happen in real aircraft

I fly a Lightwing GR912, and I have flown a Tecnam P92 Eaglet, but I'm not type certified on the Tecnam.... yet :) . In XP I tend to fly the Piper Sports Cruz by Alebeo, but this aileron/rudder prob is very annoying.... on long navs it is very difficult to hold a heading

[Beda]

Yes, you are right that it wouldn't be a ultimate solution but - as mentioned - it could result in a stable plane at or around a desired cruise speed. But then again it's probably anyway much easier to trim by hand ;) I suspect that X-Plane handles the trimming kind of wrong by default. It looks like you always define an angle of your control surface when you use the trim (which is correct for some planes). But I think that when you have a "trim-tab-equipped" plane, the deflection should be dependend on your aircrafts speed.

I tried the free trainer Mustang in DCS once and trimming felt completely different compared to X-Plane.

Greetings Peter

[bujablaster]

Depends on airplane you are using and XP version you are using. There was improper P-factor modelling until XP 10.45 came out. So every airplane was adjusted to feel "right" by developer. But after 10.45 a lot of aircrafts were left unadjusted to new P-factor modelling so a lot of airplanes can feel weird.

It can be adjusted by importing aircraft into Plane Maker and re-export it, but developer of certain aircraft should do it because end user can ruin some custom data by doing this. Afaik most of payware aicraft were adjusted to new P-factor modelling.

[Nightmare1964]

Originally posted by Beda:

..... But I think that when you have a "trim-tab-equipped" plane, the deflection should be dependend on your aircrafts speed. ....
Greetings Peter

I'm not quite sure what you mean here, all aircraft have Trim Tabs, all have pilot adjustable elevator trim tabs, but most aircraft have non-pilot adjustable trim tabs on the ailerons and rudder, Well the planes I fly are configured in this way

Originally posted by bujablaster:

Depends on airplane you are using and XP version you are using. There was improper P-factor modelling until XP 10.45 came out. So every airplane was adjusted to feel "right" by developer. But after 10.45 a lot of aircrafts were left unadjusted to new P-factor modelling so a lot of airplanes can feel weird.

It can be adjusted by importing aircraft into Plane Maker and re-export it, but developer of certain aircraft should do it because end user can ruin some custom data by doing this. Afaik most of payware aicraft were adjusted to new P-factor modelling.

So what do you think could be a solution to this problem bujablaster?

[Nightmare1964]

Originally posted by bujablaster:

Depends on airplane you are using and XP version you are using. There was improper P-factor modelling until XP 10.45 came out. So every airplane was adjusted to feel "right" by developer. But after 10.45 a lot of aircrafts were left unadjusted to new P-factor modelling so a lot of airplanes can feel weird.

It can be adjusted by importing aircraft into Plane Maker and re-export it, but developer of certain aircraft should do it because end user can ruin some custom data by doing this. Afaik most of payware aicraft were adjusted to new P-factor modelling.

I redownloaded a more up to date version of one of my planes (Alebeo Piper Sports) was v3.0, downloaded v3.2. It seems to be a whole lot more stable.... this may be the answer, will test it a bit more to confirm.

[bujablaster]

Originally posted by Nightmare:

I redownloaded a more up to date version of one of my planes (Alebeo Piper Sports) was v3.0, downloaded v3.2. It seems to be a whole lot more stable.... this may be the answer, will test it a bit more to confirm.

Sounds good, let us know your feelings then (my only RL experience is one hour with C172 ;)) so i can't really compare much :/).

[Nightmare1964]

Originally posted by bujablaster:

Originally posted by Nightmare:

I redownloaded a more up to date version of one of my planes (Alebeo Piper Sports) was v3.0, downloaded v3.2. It seems to be a whole lot more stable.... this may be the answer, will test it a bit more to confirm.

Sounds good, let us know your feelings then (my only RL experience is one hour with C172 ;)) so i can't really compare much :/).

Do you mean compare sim flying versus real flying? There really is no comparison. In saying this, The sim really helped me recently with an up coming RL flight.

I was on the sim to practice some nav techniques that I was facing on my next flight, Like refining my time keeping, GS calculations, pinpointing and 1-in-60 skills.