Thoughts on Kobolds

[Trebor]

I love the little guys, but I don't think they do enough to really swarm your enemy.

The role of a Kobold is to take down rangers. Given fast movement; resistance to arrows and bonus damage, they can certainly get in and hurt.. But they dont hurt enough. It takes a long time to kill a ranger, since the damage per kobold ranges from 4-9 damage. The same damage can be achieved with a medium sword or mallet, but more reliably. Also, given a kobolds natually low hp, its very easy to lose one and they dont have the same utility as a heavy shield user with a medium weapon.

In other words, they're fun, but dont do their job well enough. Their entry implies swarming tactics, however, which brings me to my suggestion.

Kobolds hit 1-2 damage 2-3 times. This means that they hit a between 2-6 damage. Every hit does +1 bonus damage to rangers. You always get 2 kobolds per slot, so this becomes a max of 12 (18) per turn. The damage is nice, but unreliable, as this will only happen approximately 1/256 times (assuming all chances are 50%, (2^4)^2) if the enemy is alone. What I propose is instead of kobolds doing 1-2 damage, they always deal 1 damage.

Woah, woah! But that makes them worse! But this is where the swarming comes in. Every kobold that hits the same target as another kobold gains +2 damage per hit. Meaning that the first kobold will hit 1 damage 2-3 times, but the second hits for 1(+2) 2-3 times. On average, this means that kobolds will deal the same amount of maximum damage, (3+9), but it will focus much more on singling out opponents and swarming them down in mass numbers. Additionally, this damage could be further increased against archers to +3 or +4 bonus damage, to allow kobolds to really stick it to them in large numbers.

[hairy peak]

My thoughts on Kobolds: Get a bigger guy and smash these nasty rats quick.

[Machop]

Kobolds and Zombies are interesting because you get two of them, however both feel very underpowered due to how niche they are. I believe both should be evaluated as far as balance goes.

[K1]

i think the kobolds need some sort of a buff, those little daggers barely do any damage

[Khalgar]

Anyway, if we're talking about PVP, 90% of the archers ride spidaurs, so kobolds will remain useless no matter what you do sadly :'(

[Vileguy]

I haven't used Kobolds at all yet, but let me make some judgements nonetheless.

The bonus damage vs Archers mechanic is very good. This lets them have a high power against what they're supposed to counter without simply being strong univeral damage. I don't think increasing their bonus or base damage is the best way to buff them.

So what do you do with Kobolds? You run at the archer and stab them. Now anyone can do this, but Kobolds do more damage against them. That could be enough to make them anti-archer, but I doubt it.

What's the most annoying thing to archers? Melee combat. It's hard for me to say exactly how the mechanics work, but these are my observations:

End movement (or don't move) in melee and they get 1 shot
Move your archer and they get 2 shots
Don't move them while not in melee and they get 4 shots

I haven't seen this be consistent, but at least that's how it feels. I hypothesize that number of shots is mostly aesthetic and actually this is just 25% damage, 50% damage, and 100% damage (based on the number shown at loadout), while split across multiple targets based on a maximum damage per arrow.

So forcing your opponent to move is annoying, but again any melee unit can do that, but what if Kobolds also slowed their opponent to only be able to move 1 square (maybe only if both attacked the same target, or maybe only against archers)? If you properly sandwich an archer between 2 kobolds, they actually can't move out of melee range when slowed. This would be a huge buff to their anti-archer power while barely buffing them in general utility.

I think in terms of numbers, something being overpowered or underpowered is uninteresting and the devs can find the right balance for it, but for kobolds simply doing extra damage isn't enough to really counter archers. Even if they stick on an archer full-time doing decent damage, he can move 2 squares every turn getting out of melee range and shooting 2 arrows. Since any melee can do this, I think Kobolds should get some extra mechanic added (like the slow I suggest).

[danpaladin]

Kobolds are scary little guys in PVP.

[Khalgar]

Originally posted by danpaladin:

Kobolds are scary little guys in PVP.

correction : Kobolds are scarED little guys in PVP :p
Seriously, though, they are pretty useless, not only because they will never reach an archer alive (they will be targeted asap since they are easily killed), and even if they did, as I said, very few ppl play archers without mounting them on spidaurs anyway, making Kobolds useless against them as they can't hit the archer.

[danpaladin]

They're on one of my go-to teams, so I'm only able to speak from my own experiences on the anecdotal side, but - they get bonuses on archers but aren't solely made for killing archers. They are a swarm unit with a lot of mobility and can assist front lines and back lines with certain amounts of ease, as well as swapping out which ones of them are taking the brunt of the damage with a cupcake nearby for endless waves.

Like any fighter in the game, they can be strong but need to be supported properly in order to do so. They can't simply head to the back and be fine. I would imagine that would end in tragedy more often than not.

[FieserMoep]

Agree to that: Kobolds are bit niche yet work rather well in their comfort zone.

[Pherdnut]

Mine were kicking butt in PvE with a Spidertaur-mounted mascot but I suspect level-normalization takes the air out of those tires in PvP. Also Ps tend to not cooperate by standing still for the mascot-boosted kobolds. Annoying, that.

[pride]

I've actually beaten the unfair challenge multiple times solo and with a friend with a team of 10 kobolds and a hero cupcake. The thing about them is in numbers they can be devastating. While the damage numbers aren't that impressive the amount of them and their mobility can be devastating combined with the mountains of healing from the hero cupcake. I usually will always single our enemies like overextending humans, vamps, or enemy kobolds one by one until just tanky enemys are left. From that point I split my team in half going after different tanky enemy or archers. Since the entire team is kobolds, and they resist archer damage a lot they hardly get bothered by an enemy archer pecking them from a distance.

The thing about running kobolds with a cupcake is not only does the cupcake get loads of healing points, allowing it to level up quicker. The kobolds, since they have one of the lowest max hp's of all units in the game. Are able to be almost fully healed if focused on by the cupcake in just two turns. This means they are not as likely to get one shot, and vampires will have a hard time doing their bonus damage since they are always fully healed beyond the "low hp" point where the vampire can do bonus damage.

I've also added kobolds to my normal teams of humans and hair trolls because they serve as a good flanking unit and are very useful for baiting out enemy so your other teammates can surround them and do some real damage. I feel like the biggest counter to kobolds are mushrooms. Whenever I run a full team of kobolds and there is a mushroom on the enemy team I can hardly do anything. They have a lot of health, and the mushroom does so much damage t all of the kobolds they cant extend out to the front-lines without getting one shot.

In my opinion I think Kobolds are a pretty decent unit when combined with a cupcake and a reliable team. I've found most of my troubles with them when they either are too far for heals, or a mushroom is on the enemy team, which rips them to shreds. You have to know how to play them correctly and they can not only be utilized for dealing with archers, but they can also be great mobbers and make quick work of the enemy team.

[Xilo The Odd]

i always thought it'd be funny to make a team of kobolds and gnomes and launch them past your melee line at the enemies ranged line but i've yet to try it.

[FieserMoep]

We need a ranged thrower weapon for cyclopses that fire Kobolds at the enemies.

[xlockeed]

Pvp Turtling can also kill a kobold group. Nothing ticks me off more then when the opponent wedges themselves in a corner and never moves.

[TheWackyWombat]

I've been playing around with a bunch of different unit combinations lately, and I think one of the reasons that weak units, like the Kobolds and Zombies, or spawning units, like Gorgan and mom, seem less desirable is the abundance of units with AoE.

In a regular PvP match there's some balance, but in an unfair run you could run into a team that's both oversized and stacked with mushrooms or robots. In those sorts of match-ups it's difficult to keep your squishy units alive, so a single bad matchup early can just ruin a team.

And unfair throws AoE heavy teams at you a lot.

I love Kobolds, and I'd like to keep a pair on my main team, but since my main focus lately seems to be unfair matches I just can't justify the cost.