cringe ass fanfic writing

[Kana]

so like cloud and zack get sucked into an alternate dimension to fight sephiroth in a super le epic fight. this ♥♥♥♥ is like some fanfic some idiot wrote in a myspace blog back in the early 2000s

[babobaka]

Originally posted by Xao:

Originally posted by windsea888:

3) the plot of Chrono trigger takes places across, you guessed it, one single game. It isn't stretched out with filler across three separate multi generational full price games...

Not only is this wrong, but FF7 Remake/Rebirth is a masterpiece compared to the actual mess that is Chrono Trigger's sequels. Which by the way, the second of which involves an extremely convoluted multiverse plot.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radical_Dreamers
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chrono_Cross

Stop LARPing. It's really obvious you're a right wing zoomer trying to kick up drama, because you don't like that this game isn't SUPER EDGELORD WRIST CUTTING SIMULATOR 9000.

You lot overplayed your hand already. Pretending to be something else isn't going to work.

Well to be fair, Radical Dreamers and Chrono Cross are exact fan-fic style games mentioned by OP.

Very much like FFX-2

When Chrono Trigger was initially released, it was made with intention of being one off complete game and story.

[babobaka]

Originally posted by goodbye_bonito:

I don't see any minuses.

Also Myspace did not exist back then, kid

I'd say 2003 can be considered early 2000's

For some reason, back then there was smooth transition from Xanga to MySpace, then later Facebook. It was like a trend.

Either way, nitpicking pointless detail that isn't even incorrect nor major point of the argument makes you look petty and desperate to grasp for anything to avoid dealing with the actual argument.

[Weltall8000]

Love how the writing staff of OG FFVII is being accused of fanfic writing on this project based on the game they wrote.

[DeFitSquid]

Originally posted by windsea888:

The crazy thing too is the people defending this game so much on here are actually harming square enix in the long run. SE keeps losing customers over all the questionable things they do as a company and they need to change their strategies big time if they want to win customers. Three million sold for FF16 seems like a bad financial result for them considering how much they spent on that game including its VA and marketing campaigns. Development cost then $59 million and I'm not sure if that includes marketing?

Anyone trying to cheer SE on to make more of the same is cheering on their gradual financial decline.

Fanboys are gonna fanboy, not a single critique. And it's not just Final Fantasy, it's Call of Duty, Super Mario, Legend of Zelda, Mass Effect, Dragon Age, etcetera...

ALSO ON-TOPIC... You know, there's something called 'spoiler tags'... For people who aren't in that part of the game yet.

[This PC]

gamers pretending to know how business and code works
I don't expect better from steam forums tho ;p
SE are doing fine by any other metric than steam forums lol, they haven't been doing this good since the late 90's.

[windsea888]

Chrono Cross is INDEED a terrible story that is basically no different from remake/, rebirth in terms of its bad exposition dump nonsense ending. Chrono Cross was NOT made by sakaguchi and Horii. It is, just like this trilogy, a bad sequel that was not needed because Chrono trigger was a complete story.

Just like this game, Chrono Cross tries to actively invalidate what the characters accomplished in the original. Chrono Cross starts interesting, is a pretty game with pretty music, and then it becomes a narrative disaster with one of the biggest and weirdest exposition dumps in gaming history that made no sense. They ran out of budget or something and just had it wrap it up without really tyng anything together.

So thank you for bringing up Chrono cross, which is exactly the same thing as this awful reboot trilogy on a smaller scale. It was made by Kato, who was not the leader by any means of the original, just like this stuff is made without the originals leader and is just a fashion designers fan fiction of ff7.

[babobaka]

Originally posted by This PC:

gamers pretending to know how business and code works
I don't expect better from steam forums tho ;p
SE are doing fine by any other metric than steam forums lol, they haven't been doing this good since the late 90's.

On what metric are they doing fine?

Square stock holding around the same level of 2018? Down 33% from their peak?

Square announcing sales failed to meet expectations?

Top sales of games hovering around 20 million mark, while all Square games fails to break 10 million mark?

Concurrent players on steam shows FF7 Rebirth hit peak 40k, while Baulder's Gate 3 hit 875k. Putting what best Square has to offer hitting 5% of what leader of the industry was able to hit is good sign?

Selling off one of their bigger game dev department away for pennies (300 mil)?

So only critic scores and user review matters? Even if you are looking at user review, considering how low number of people actually reviewing FF7 Rebirth already shows the interest in this game is way down. Outside of fanboys, people are not even interested enough to review bomb this game. Bad market interest is better than no market interest, and FF series have reached no market interest to most people.

So what is the metric that shows SE is doing fine?

[This PC]

Originally posted by babobaka:

Originally posted by This PC:

gamers pretending to know how business and code works
I don't expect better from steam forums tho ;p
SE are doing fine by any other metric than steam forums lol, they haven't been doing this good since the late 90's.

On what metric are they doing fine?

Square stock holding around the same level of 2018? Down 33% from their peak?

Nice how you cherry pick information, I can do this too, they're up 5x the price it was at in 2011, we're at the same level as the release of shadowbringers. They're doing fine. ;p

Originally posted by babobaka:

Square announcing sales failed to meet expectations?

Top sales of games hovering around 20 million mark, while all Square games fails to break 10 million mark?

These are false equivalences. I'm not sure how this is even relevant. ;p
Would rather they sell 10 million copies because they make good games than sell 20 million because they market it.
And don't give me that BG3 bs, not all games need to have this level of success to be successful. Square also taps into a lot of different markets and have a lot of B projects that are cheaper to develop and pretty successful, like Octopath.

Originally posted by babobaka:

Concurrent players on steam shows FF7 Rebirth hit peak 40k, while Baulder's Gate 3 hit 875k. Putting what best Square has to offer hitting 5% of what leader of the industry was able to hit is good sign?

Square is a JP company, pretty sure most people play this on console.

Originally posted by babobaka:

Selling off one of their bigger game dev department away for pennies (300 mil)?

That was a mistake imho, doesn't mean they were in trouble. ;p

Originally posted by babobaka:

So only critic scores and user review matters? Even if you are looking at user review, considering how low number of people actually reviewing FF7 Rebirth already shows the interest in this game is way down. Outside of fanboys, people are not even interested enough to review bomb this game. Bad market interest is better than no market interest, and FF series have reached no market interest to most people.

So what is the metric that shows SE is doing fine?

You're alarmist, starting with the belief that SE is failing, and looking for evidence that it is, that's the problem we're dealing with here. Usually stuff like this works the other way around ie: you see something happening, and once you have assembled all the evidence, you come to conclusions.

One thing about your evidence: it's circumstancial, people said X and Y, etc...
I look for hard numbers, and I don't try to fit them to confirm my beliefs lol.

Square has seen much worst for 12+ years and they survived. Calm down mate. ;p

[Roan]

1997 FFVII Writer: Kazushige Nojima
2020 FFVII Remake Writer: Also Kazushige Nojima
2024 FFVII Rebirth Writer: Still Kazushige Nojima

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[windsea888]

Look at the development structure and the total team then vs now. "Writer" means the script writer, not the sole creator of the plot, the scenarios, the themes, the goal of the work.

I.e. Who is in charge? fashion designer, or creator of the best JRPGs that started JRPGs alongside Yuji horii.

Also even if it were all nojima which is isn't, thirty years is a long time to expect someone to still have the motivation and ability to produce good writing, when they're being told to do yet ANOTHER ff7 game

[Weltall8000]

Originally posted by windsea888:

Ignorant. Look at the development structure then vs now. "Writer" means the script writer, not the creator of the plot, the scenarios, the themes, the goal of the work

Sakaguchi: I’ve been working with Kitase for a long time, since FF5. He did most of the event scenes in FF6: the opera house, Celes’ suicide scene, the scene where Setzer climbs the stairs and reminisces, and more. I’m not exactly turning things over to the next generation just yet, but for FF7 almost all the story was done by Kitase. His original ambition was to be a film director, so he’s well-disposed towards this work–I’ve left all the in-game event scripting in his hands.

https://shmuplations.com/ff7/

[Katitoff]

Originally posted by Kana:

so like cloud and zack get sucked into an alternate dimension to fight sephiroth in a super le epic fight. this ♥♥♥♥ is like some fanfic some idiot wrote in a myspace blog back in the early 2000s

That "fanfic" was written by Tetsuya Nomura.
Writer of FF7 in 1997.

[windsea888]

To say he is the writer of FF7 is patiently false. He was a junior member of the team that Sakaguchi saw strong visual artistic ability in due to his work on ff6. He contributed, but he's not "the writer"

[babobaka]

Originally posted by This PC:

Nice how you cherry pick information, I can do this too, they're up 5x the price it was at in 2011, we're at the same level as the release of shadowbringers. They're doing fine. ;p

Actually you seems right about this one. I was looking at wrong stock ticker for Square. Their stock value seems fine actually, although they have been stagnant for five years, but at least they didn't crash when many game companies are struggling these days. Not great, but not the worst like Ubisoft. Stagnant is not good, and 5 years is long time, but at least it didn't crash. Still not a good sign for publicly traded company, but it's not awful as I once thought it was.

Originally posted by This PC:

These are false equivalences. I'm not sure how this is even relevant. ;p
Would rather they sell 10 million copies because they make good games than sell 20 million because they market it.
And don't give me that BG3 bs, not all games need to have this level of success to be successful. Square also taps into a lot of different markets and have a lot of B projects that are cheaper to develop and pretty successful, like Octopath.

They are not false equivalency as games are developed with return in mind, and they are pouring massive budget for these games to get return of games with fraction of the budget.

Also considering FF series used to be top name in the industry, it is showing that it lost market share. FF used to outsell RE games by double, and now they are selling at half the amount. It shows the franchise name value is not what it once was.

FF was supposed to compete with the best, and now they are not. That is not a good sign.

Originally posted by This PC:

Square is a JP company, pretty sure most people play this on console.

Ok then Monster Hunter concurrent players are 330k. Made by JP company, pretty sure most people play that on console as well.

Originally posted by This PC:

That was a mistake imho, doesn't mean they were in trouble. ;p

Companies selling their assets is usually not a good thing. Companies that does well usually buys assets, not sell them.

Originally posted by This PC:

You're alarmist, starting with the belief that SE is failing, and looking for evidence that it is, that's the problem we're dealing with here. Usually stuff like this works the other way around ie: you see something happening, and once you have assembled all the evidence, you come to conclusions.

One thing about your evidence: it's circumstancial, people said X and Y, etc...
I look for hard numbers, and I don't try to fit them to confirm my beliefs lol.

Square has seen much worst for 12+ years and they survived. Calm down mate. ;p

How about YOU provide some evidence that Square is doing well instead? I've seen no indication that Square is doing well, and you haven't provided any evidence for it, while I've provided enough solid evidence that is an indicator that SquareEnix is not doing too well as a company. Evidence vs empty claim. I think I have better argument here.

[Weltall8000]

Originally posted by windsea888:

Yes your proving my point thank you these guys were good artists years ago, now they are making fan fiction level stuff because they are being assigned to milk an old series for the tenth time. The old FFs were a collaboration between these guys with Sakaguchi at the helm. Now they are being led by a guy who is seeminglyobsessed with male tension and big swords and key blades and multi verses. It is night and day

They wrote what you venerate. By definition, this cannot be fan fiction. You also cannot accurately claim that they don't understand the source material or original intent.

Sakaguchi himself even said Kitase did most of the story. Which is what you keep bringing up having issue with.