Build Order?

[GrizzGolf]

I noticed I keep getting stuck at my eco cap and hangging while trying to build a milltary. Any advice on how to make sure a ton of resources are always coming while having the balance of building an army?

[[AS]_Pimp-Masterflex]

Lol

Probably one of the most general and abstract questions for RoN...

But... here's a quick post in terms of build order for a good boom: : http://www.kingameya.com/2012/09/booming-expert-guidelines/

Anywho..... Build order aside (cuz there's a lot of ways you can go), about your question for the eco cap. In terms of researching Commerce Techs.... there's a general rule of thumb that if you have at least 2 flashing recs (as in 2 rec types that have hit the cap), research the next commerce tech. Now obviously that's just a general heuristic.... I mean don't go for Com 7 in Classical.... but sometimes re-arranging your standard library tech order for your commerce cap is sometimes beneficial in those cases.

Now.... that Being said.... it's actually pretty easy to win a game when capped at +150 in the early ages. But I think what you're looking for is a standing army boom approach. I would only recommend that if you were Americans (cuz of their standing army +3 eco bonus), but generally, hold off on building a military until you want to attack (or being attacked). If you want to boom, focus 95-100% of your recs on universities and scholars and your eco. Around IV or so is when you should start building the army.

But again, that's not a general booming strategy, since there are a lot (like the one I linked here). But hopefully this gets you thinkjng and practicing some new starts, and hopefully prompts more specific questions..... cuz honestly, this is a question that can spark debate between even the most veteran of players.

[GrizzGolf]

Originally posted by AS_Pimp-Masterflex:

Lol

Probably one of the most general and abstract questions for RoN...

But... here's a quick post in terms of build order for a good boom: : http://www.kingameya.com/2012/09/booming-expert-guidelines/

Anywho..... Build order aside (cuz there's a lot of ways you can go), about your question for the eco cap. In terms of researching Commerce Techs.... there's a general rule of thumb that if you have at least 2 flashing recs (as in 2 rec types that have hit the cap), research the next commerce tech. Now obviously that's just a general heuristic.... I mean don't go for Com 7 in Classical.... but sometimes re-arranging your standard library tech order for your commerce cap is sometimes beneficial in those cases.

Now.... that Being said.... it's actually pretty easy to win a game when capped at +150 in the early ages. But I think what you're looking for is a standing army boom approach. I would only recommend that if you were Americans (cuz of their standing army +3 eco bonus), but generally, hold off on building a military until you want to attack (or being attacked). If you want to boom, focus 95-100% of your recs on universities and scholars and your eco. Around IV or so is when you should start building the army.

But again, that's not a general booming strategy, since there are a lot (like the one I linked here). But hopefully this gets you thinkjng and practicing some new starts, and hopefully prompts more specific questions..... cuz honestly, this is a question that can spark debate between even the most veteran of players.

Thank you so much man!

[Michael]

Scout for ruins with your scout + 1-2 citizens (keep an eye on the minimap). Make sure you practice, practice, practice the link that pimp sent above. It's a good baseline to then jump off from as you learn each nations abilities.

A solo game w/ 0 enemy nations is boring, but it's a good way to quickly practice the first 5 - 10 minutes of the build order. And it doesn't count toward your W/L ratio, if you care about that.

If you're weak in classical & midevil ages, you're likely to lose every match.

[GrizzGolf]

Originally posted by ungayplatypus:

Scout for ruins with your scout + 1-2 citizens (keep an eye on the minimap). Make sure you practice, practice, practice the link that pimp sent above. It's a good baseline to then jump off from as you learn each nations abilities.

A solo game w/ 0 enemy nations is boring, but it's a good way to quickly practice the first 5 - 10 minutes of the build order. And it doesn't count toward your W/L ratio, if you care about that.

If you're weak in classical & midevil ages, you're likely to lose every match.

I am very weak in those two ages.

[[AS]_Pimp-Masterflex]

Originally posted by ungayplatypus:

Make sure you practice, practice, practice

If you need to build up a certain gameplay, this is the best advice. Losing is the first step to winning

[Dutchgamer1982]

So you want to boom... AND have an army at the same time.. AND have plenty resources to go around. That is not gonna happen untill quite late game.

You have a limited number of resouces and you have to add them to where they are most needed. Boom, Rush, Balance ether strategy is valid, but you cannot have all of them.

I can give a few pointers in how I play :
-in early game I am most pressed for gold and wood. wood as it builds my bases, gold as it expands the science tech (making all other tech cheaper)

And gold is also the hardest to obtain in early game, but my standard first techs are :
Civic 1 (get that 2d city early, get temples, and get taxation running)
Economy 1 (get markets in your city's)
Science 1
Science 2
Civic 2 (get that 3d city)
Science 3
Economy 2 (expand wood production)
Military 1 (by now you need more population space)
Science 4
Civic 3 (get that 4th city, and increase taxation)

After this it varies.. but you get the idea.

If you have 3 city's and taxation level 2 + 3 caravans, your economy is doing fine.

Af for what to build in the city's.. Well I do not fully develop them early on.
wood IS limited, I need it to construct buildings, expand economy tech (to increase wood production more), and to upgrade my science tech (to get more tech) and to upgrade the metal and food production efficiency.
-
Obviously I put an academy and a market and a temple in every city (to maximise gold production)
I try to have 1 or 2 good lumber city's, with a lumber mill, boosting that production (lumber production must be expanded to be at it's cap at all times)
I usually have only 1 city with 5 farms and a granary, food is of little use in early game
Oh and I want to build the Senate early, to get democracy for that +50 production cap.
I do NOT waste resources (especially since that costs gold) military buildings like forts and towers.

After the initial fase I expand production to include metal, and add just enough production buildings as is needed to keep production at maximal.
Since I have no use for excess food and metal, it is sold for gold, so I can advance science faster.

Now as for units :

You want to grab each resource that produces gold with a merc early on.
If you find the resource that lowers science tech with 25% make that an absolute priority (defend it!, build a a city right next to it to claim it!)

You also want to go to 3 caravans early on, to utilise those 3 early city;s.

You want to build scientists, but no more than is needed to research the next science tech.
often I get as far as science 3 in my sceme before starting to build scientists.

I do like to build a barracks, and get 2-5 explorers running around to grab me some extra wealth early on. (though often I use some villagers turned into militia for that same task)

For the rest just build villagers, and defend with them, don't build an army untill later.
Sometimes when facing more aggresive players I build a barracks to use some excess metal and food for some units (but do not build the units that cost gold!)
-> military unit count however should never exceed 20% of your current maximum population.

As for wonders :
Getting the colussus is an absolute MUST, do so early.
Yes it cost 200 gold and 200 food, but it increases gold production by 30%, and given your typical early game gold income is around 30 per tick it will pay for itself in 20 ticks or less.
Having a +50 population limit is good too, and prevents us from needing more military tech.
and the extra commerce cap allows for more wood production, further excelerating growth.

If you can get a second wonder in early game, (aka if the other player has not got it before you) ether one is good. If you still can choose, take the piramids.
Getting all 3 of them is even better, but unlikely.

The piramids gives us for a merely 250 wood an extra city (increasing gold production) and adds commerce cap for wealth by 50 (though we are unlikely to hit it any time soon)

The Hanging gardens costs only 250 food (and thats a resource we can waste) but only gives us +50 science production (though thats a lot in early game, it allows us to invest a little less gold in scientists)

In the next age the wonder of interest to us is the colussus, it gives us extra border size (and thus more money from taxation) and the extra artration helps defend against early raids)
If you didn't got the piramids, get the forbidden palace also.. as it as cheap as a regulair city.

The wonder that we do not need is the Terra Cotta army.
-> if you followed this strategy, you would have not have a city left to place a wonder in, so you would have to build a new city and increase civic tech to do so.
Also it eats away from population limit, so it would force us to increase military tech as well further slowing our progress.
also it taks 30 seconds for 1 unit (+delay) so it will only spew out 10 units every 6 minutes orso. nothing militia or artration cannot handle.. so you at best get 2-3 small raids out of this.

Hope this helps.

[Michael]

I'm not saying dutchgamer1982's post is incorrect, aside from this line:

"food is of little use in early game"
- mil1 is 108 food, mil2 (heavy & ranged cavalry) is 120 food (I think) + metal
- classical age is 250 food
- getting woodcutter camps cost 70 food then 90 food then 110 food
- citizens always cost food,
- civ1 is 120food, civ2 is 160 food (I think).

But what you have to realize with his strategy is it is very economic based, which comes with inherent raid/rush weaknesses.

This is why practicing until you get a baseline down from 0 - 15 minutes and then working on each nation's individual abilities is so important. Shooting for craptons of gold is a fine strategy in itself, as the flip side of it is you are able to buy your way to a better economy, but this isn't appropriate for every nation.

[Michael]

But he is right about the fact that you can't have a huge military and a huge economy and a fat bankroll of resources all at the same time. Everything you do requires a trade-off. The hardest thing to master is figuring out what trade-offs are advantageous to each situation, which is then changed by ruins/rare resources/nation abilities/resource locations/enemy actions.

That part is bolded because it is THE most important factor in the game. The point is to beat the other guy, not be super awesome in a vacuum. Getting to the enlightenment age first doesn't mean anything if you're most resource intensive city is getting sacked.

[Stag Hammer]

An alternate stratergy is to rush in the first couple of ages to take a few enemy citys, while they are still weak, then use the extra territory to help you boom for a late game slaughter. This way, you have a small army to defend against other raids while you boom through the mid game.

[GrizzGolf]

I am going to try to do what you guys posted and I will come back with results today and some more questions!