x rebirth vs x4 foundation You ever wonder why you cant get back into x rebirth.

[Howdoyoupurr]

no matter however many times you try. Something always feels off.

I ask anyone at all to make corrections to what I'm about to say. put in their own opinions. Which is true or not. read everything and except all possibilities. Anyways

Why does x rebirth always feel off. Why cant i get back into it no matter how many times I try.
I
ts for a few simple reasons. Read on and then think about what The game has been from the beginning up to the present.

For myself
I try to get into the game but without the ability to switch up to a stronger ship to make the fights more engaging and more interesting. Timber. The tree cant stand cause its rotten at its base. the x series format of gaming. simply could not be present. So the game falls under its own weight

But why didnt it happen. Why wasnt it put in. The awnsers to that question quite simple. First main hurdle. They made the ability to go into space stations.

Now think about the problems across the entire game with this in the game.

To make the game be able to handle more then one ship. they would have to create an interaction system in a 3d engine within the stations. for small ships all the way up to the system for loading and unloading outside of bigger ships.
It would make the space ships vastly more intensive. unbalanced and full of bugs. they would have to put in ship models in full detail for their walking engine.
Heck it was not even egosoft itself that created a larger interactive ship interior. It was a modder.
I'm sure that egosoft will have it in the new game x4. I mean someone from the community created the skeleton that they can use as a blueprint for being able to actually put it into x4

Think about how much work that would have been. how long it would have taken. we know that now. 2018

And people wonder why i say that egosoft created x rebirth and broke many of their fans hearts. Well lets look at what things we learned along the way. the game engine itself The system at the start, people looked into the game code and clearly saw code for consoles not pc. So ya egosoft focused on their engine to be able to go to console. We know that didnt work. We know this because of people looking at the code and telling us within 2-3 days of launch. of them seeing code ment for the xbox controller within the engine itself. Simply part of how games work in the xbox 360.

Well modders wanted to go in look at the engine and see what they could do with it.
And went what the beep. So told us all about it.
So Ya Here we are. x rebirth the alpha version of x4 foundations at launch. With just the most basics put into it, and calling it a full game.
so they just worked on their engine giving access to us the players. when it was the alpha version of x4 foundation.

The complete game is the beta for x4 .
They then went to create the VR version of the game.
What did they accomplish with this. they got to optimize and re adjust their engine for the high end spectrum of modern technology.
Released x rebirth vr. and there the vr crowd got to pay for the optimization of their engine for x4 So they could acclimate the higher end current tech. which will be the standard for the game of closer to it by the time that 2018 comes around for x4 foundations.

And the trading system not being enough without that feature. It is that simple

So The condition of the trading system.

First off. Remember the fact that everyone knows that they never upgraded their first engine throughout x rebirth. The same flawed concept engine. is in the game still. the alpha version of their engine for the next generation of the x series. Keep that in mind when reading the next part. The defects and left out features of the game.

None of the game was hit harder then the trading system.
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=636259790

The above link altho not pretty is all of the raw stats for building anything in the game.
If you dont care to actually go in and follow the production chains. which is a bit of a pain.
The above link is just for the raw stats. not grouped together to show the chains themselves.
If you actually go into the game and think of production lines. how much they build. And what resources they take. Then look at the miners for said resources. and how fast they can mine against the demands for your stations. You really see how badly the game engine is set up for trade.

Simple make a full production cycle. To make energy cells. The very beginning of a production chain.
how much resources they make. And what you need to keep it running how many ships mining. And how often even with all that. the system shuts down.
The awnser its trash. The first step to making and having a factory empire. is toast before it starts.

Well that makes trading suck and boring. Ow I forgot to mention the fun of the warehouse building. The item silo.
When you get to this point. Choose an item at random. collect it and fill your warehouse with it.
ok you have done so. then go back to the game. and goto make your profit. wait i havent effected anything. this cant be right. look at the stations you would sell to again.
Say to yourself aw man. and then quit playing x rebirth yet again.



Ok so lets then look at combat.
For over a year. you bought higher level ships. and they didnt use their lasers.
Didnt matter what level of attack ships.
Anyone besides me remember that bit of joy.
Ya. would spit on the ground in disgust for that one among others.

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Remembering my first story based major large scale combat in x rebirth.

First year they had a mission where you went in with the heart of albion fleet and saw the fleet destroy a station.
then you saw the fleet destroy a station. then you.
Stops
sits there
looks around.
ok heart of albion are moving closer to the station. They are well within attack range.
ow that was nice a single laser finally fired.
ow its once every 6 seconds.
ow the enemy patrol craft are flying around and shooting a single laser every 2 seconds and missing something 3 times larger then the chrysler building.

-------------------------------------
elevator music
2 1/2 minutes later.
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come back from the bathroom. ow yes they are 600 meters away from the station.
alright

Ow I'm so excited I'll get to finally see that big ass super destroyer class weapon. that is going to destroy the station.
---------------------------
elevator music (really again nothing happening at all)
30 seconds go by
..............................
wait huh
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9 seconds go by
----------------------------
incoming pop up message at top of screen.
We have succeeded get to the nearest transport you have 60-90 seconds
.
.....
blinks.
..
um ok

so fly to big ship
teleport out.
--------------------------------
look at the station that you just blew up.
......
still there ??
///////
no explosions.
.....
no nothing.
.....................................................................................................
.
.
.





.
yah

Think you got the point of what that joy of a mission was done on the complete game i bought

Next what other parts of the game


Ok well lets look at the small ships. the start of the basic combat.
Now remember the switch level between. Ships hitting you seldom shooting at all. even in a small 3-5 ship swarm vs you

the small ships all the same. If your own ships fly around like flies that found spilled whiskey.
Go to a new sector or area.
ow im in combat.
think my ships found a bar on the way to the brawl. I hope they will get here soon.

Ow wait I have drones.
LAUNCH
-----------------------------------
6 drones I will be a god hahahaa
-----------------------------------------
------------------------------------
---------------------
-
3 seconds later
all destroyed.

Ok..

...

thinks to self on the various states of the enemy squad combat conditions throughout the history of x rebirth to the present.

Ok if they aim for me I think they are using their knees around a joystick.
they dont fire very fast.
.
next patch
.
Ow they can hit me and even with level 4 shields. they kill me in 6 seconds every time.
.
short patch day later.
.
ok
now the ships are firing fast but they aim 30% from either side of me. I am pretty sure that 80% of those lasers do not actually have a damage counter on them at all. because i can see they are actually hitting me but only about 1 in 6 to 1 in 8 actually does any damage to me.
........
what the heck.


ya lots of fun.

Go down to the ships themselves.
Anything that is not a xl class ship. dies in seconds to ship swarms if they ever get in trouble.
If I buy any small class ship at all. I lose 1.5 million a ship losing 10-40 million even a 100 million in barely 20 seconds.
Ow I can just go back to my factory to make the money back for it.

Wait 1 hour make 500k early game.
switch to trading. micromanage 10-15 ships. spend 15 minutes going through every item and then searching to where its wanted expecting to lose 10-25% of the best trades and having full cargos of various items. Sell what you can then try to fit in other items for each ship.
and try to make them profitable. 20 minutes later 20% of your fleets have a second item and in another 20 half will have 3.

no system in place within the game. to make it fast and easy to trade.

or correct me. is there a way in game where you can match ew i like that idea will post in x4 forum.
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Trading idea for best buy sell software in x4 foundation.

best buy software
Go in pick the best item to buy at best price. Lock in that price. not buy it simply right out.
checks no best sell software.
opens the slide bar.
end

Have Best Selling software and best buying software.
Go through the items find the most profitable item. the item most wanted.
Click it to lock it in.
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flips to sellers page
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
checks for that item. finds the best price in the universe of the factories you know it.
Locks in.

(the software detects a best sell and best buy lock in)
Brings up a new screen
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
top item Factory that you chose to buy from
what you can buy the item at with the price and slide bar
bottom item
Factory needing resources.
Slide bar below it
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go to slide it all the way to the right
as you are doing this the top factory item is sliding to the left.
You choose to fill the factory demanding to 80-90% of full capacity. to take into account free traders as well as factory use. depending on distance between you and said factory.
Settle on an amount of product you wish to buy
below it the amount the price and a confirm trade button.

Is a feature that never been in an x game before.
Would make it so could more easily to trades without needing to run sector and universal traders
(yes still want those in too)

And would make people have 3 different levels and ways to make profit from the freighter level.
1 do everything yourself.
2 use the best buy/sell software combo. to create the complete loops for a trade yourself without having to look the numbers up.
sorry not all of us like that part.
and 3
run the full ai trading software to not do trading at all and focus on other parts of the game.

I think this would make the new game. really really shine in the trade department.
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No universal traders around or sector traders. to have run around and look for trades for you. So that you can afford to get into a fight every 20 min to 1 hour.
puts game away again.

so ya its not perfect but think im pointed eyes into the general direction of some of the games problems.

Still even complete. the game feels like a 2 year old holding his nut sack and waiting to grow up. when it comes to the combat system. With the albion skunk as is with the horrible misbalance of small ship combat . simular problems with any larger scale ship. drones vs ships and their price vs the actual ingame economy as is without the production x4 mod. Sorry but Without those things and in many cases even with. the game makes you feel always like the small kid that got tossed in his locker and beat up on the way home from school.

so ya x rebirth will never feel fun to me . one of the main features of the game. was removed simply because egosoft needed a paycheck to keep going before they could get the main engine built and then actually build the game. So even tho x rebirth is a full and complete game. meaning you can go into the engine and look around. but thats all the game ever feels like.
I'm sorry but its the truth.

You started working on the upgrade to turn into the next generation of the x series.
you got the ability to go into the world.
you started on the trading system. making the new products and you just put them out there.
you needed something to create the production cycles.
Which is why the trade system in x rebirth will always suck.

x rebirth always feels like the alpha engine it is. the first generation of the x4 foundation engine.

so I've added and deleted the x rebirth game at least 6 to a dozen times in 4 years probably more.

So as can see i have pretty good reasons to be annoyed by the game x rebirth and i know I'm one of the passives of the game haters. How do you know this. because im actually still here dreaming for the next gen of the x series.
The others are simply gone. not wasting their time to play something actually fun to play.
x rebirth isnt.

[Kongha]

I did enjoy the game, it felt fun and fresh. You didnt find it fun and its just a game so time to move on :).
You cant enjoy everything and trying to have fun with things that other enjoy and that you cant grasp will just make you frustrated so better to find something else to spend the precious free time with.

[9K]

Over the years I've learned not to blame game devs for features that their game does not have. I mean really you can do this with pretty much any game. GTA4 was an alpha compared to GTA5. X2 was an alpha compared to X3. The V2 Rocket was an alpha compared to the Space Shuttle. Just because you like the new 2 chainz album the best does not mean that he ripped you off on his last album it just means he's getting better as he makes more albums. XR is what it is and isn't what it isn't. It doesn't mean anything.

[mmmcheesywaffles]

I tried to read all that... honestly... but it was just too much.

But reading DaveC9000's reply suggest waht you were on about ;)

Basically, any Dev will start developing the next game in a franchise during the finishing touches to the previous version of their game.

Each game a takes a few years to develop and in that time hardware will progress but the market will be slower to catch up. So you develop your next game for the hardware you anticipate will be common place by the time your game is ready. If things work out yougame will then be available to play on the 'standard' hardware of that generation and hardware bugs will have been found and ironed out by teh time you launch.

[Inkarnus]

Shameless plug of own created guide, which is even inaccurate because it doesnt even include efficency values. Since even the lamest factory starts above 10X% and secondary resources boost production rates same as having a Specialist.

I just say to you X Rebirths economy is pretty robust. You wont simply breake it with Warehouses alone. But there are enough ways to make tidy profits with your own stations in a rewarding way without going for a closed loop (which is ultra endgame anyway).

Heck i can make 50 mill easy in 1-2h without a station if iam lucky and RNG is on my side
with missions. It isnt about profit in this game its about what you want to do and who you want to mess with >:(. Poor poor PMC. just have 1 Station in AL and its a warehouse to help those poor souls to get back on there feet after the recent "Pirate" attacks of the dreaded Piratelord Ren Otani.

Try start with a set Goal e.g. i want to rebuild devries/coldstar or dominate Torride and have fun and try out stuff. Or try to take over the Food market from Chow or Wholesome food etc.
If you just dont do it you can look at yourself and say everything is "shallow" and "boring".
Embrace the game as what it is and not what you want it to be.

While X3 was all about beeing afk or self sufficent complexes. XR rewards you for knowledge about the economy and patience in your decisions.

[ARAVRICE FEDRATION]

Try a trade mod that what i did , it also fix same of the economy probles with no ship delivaries in devries , I also been add station to devries. you have to under stand X-game economy you always start with trade ship make the max money you can then when you max out on trade ships you move to factories then you make more money, I have 12billion credits i am still finding things to do.

[ᏦᏂᎯᏒᏂᎯ乙]

Originally posted by Ink:

Shameless plug of own created guide, which is even inaccurate because it doesnt even include efficency values. Since even the lamest factory starts above 10X% and secondary resources boost production rates same as having a Specialist.

I just say to you X Rebirths economy is pretty robust. You wont simply breake it with Warehouses alone. But there are enough ways to make tidy profits with your own stations in a rewarding way without going for a closed loop (which is ultra endgame anyway).

Heck i can make 50 mill easy in 1-2h without a station if iam lucky and RNG is on my side
with missions. It isnt about profit in this game its about what you want to do and who you want to mess with >:(. Poor poor PMC. just have 1 Station in AL and its a warehouse to help those poor souls to get back on there feet after the recent "Pirate" attacks of the dreaded Piratelord Ren Otani.

Try start with a set Goal e.g. i want to rebuild devries/coldstar or dominate Torride and have fun and try out stuff. Or try to take over the Food market from Chow or Wholesome food etc.
If you just dont do it you can look at yourself and say everything is "shallow" and "boring".
Embrace the game as what it is and not what you want it to be.

While X3 was all about beeing afk or self sufficent complexes. XR rewards you for knowledge about the economy and patience in your decisions.

Couldn´t explain it better. Thanks

[Lupo]

I am with Ink.

The major change to the economy compared with previous games was real supply and demand. And suddenly the economy is broken because someone build a Solar Array in a place with oversupply and thus has no demand whatsoever and is complaining that their wares are not selling so the economy must be broken.

Then the self sustaining loops not working because they are in places where the managers can get their wares cheaper from third party suppliers.

Years and years to this day of people asking for a more real economy and then failing at the first basic concept.

[Takeshi Hatch]

Google search for a x-rebirth to x4 comparison brought me here. any TLDR version??

[Howdoyoupurr]

lol as in too long dont read. lol well i did make this when i was having a rant about the game a longggggg time ago. I cant even remember all that i said in it. old post lol

[Lupo]

Please open a thread here or better still in the X4 discussion forum. Locking as it is a very old post.