I do not undestand these "reviews"

[Blackened Halo]

POSSITIVE?
- emulation is bad
- there are slowdowns
- there are zero emulation settings
- it looks and runs worse than the original

Why are you rating this piece of crap high? So you dont want the game to be better? Is this what PC gaming means today? We are just happy that Tomba was released no matter what state the game is in?

[MaChao]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von MaChao:

I'm pretty sure it's a case of "rose tinted nostalgia glasses"
Yes, in regions such as the cursed villa, the game has some struggles spinning the map around.
But that's not "FPS issues", that's just how the game always worked.
It's the reason why some of those transitions are blacked out, because the game can only keep two of the four sides in memory.

The emulation is fine.
People just haven't seen a native PS1 game in a while :D

no, the emulation is abysmal

this is this Special Edition on PC:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8egJzsgfcU

this is the PS1 version running via Duckstation:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=POQaXllGAbM

you can clearly see that the Duckstation version is much more stable, there is no texture warping, no wobbling, z buffer is corrected, it runs smoother, there is also antialiasing etc ... This is how this Special Edition should looked like for 20 bucks!

You're comparing apples to oranges here though.
If i want a faithful emulation, raising internal resolution, adding post processing effects, removing polygon and texture warping, overclocking logic etc is just not what i want.
There are people who like these "improvements" and people who don't.
An emulator running faithfully isn't "abysmal" simply because you expected different results.
It's how Tomba runs without tinkering. And if you just sell Tomba, not a remaster, not a remake, it's exactly what i expect.
If i want to post-process the hell out of it, i use my PSX image on a non-commercial emulator and go nuts.

[Blackened Halo]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Tanoomba:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Torade:

You expect the general public to notice these differences without pointing them out via timestamps.

I'm honestly trying to see the difference and I can't.

really? dont focus on textures' quality, focus on how stable the textures are, how they behave when the camera moves.

its clear as day you have zero experience when it comes to PS1 emulation, otherwise you would have noticed all the flaws immediately after few seconds...

[Blackened Halo]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von MaChao:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

no, the emulation is abysmal

this is this Special Edition on PC:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8egJzsgfcU

this is the PS1 version running via Duckstation:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=POQaXllGAbM

you can clearly see that the Duckstation version is much more stable, there is no texture warping, no wobbling, z buffer is corrected, it runs smoother, there is also antialiasing etc ... This is how this Special Edition should looked like for 20 bucks!

You're comparing apples to oranges here though.
If i want a faithful emulation, raising internal resolution, adding post processing effects, removing polygon and texture warping, overclocking logic etc is just not what i want.
There are people who like these "improvements" and people who don't.
An emulator running faithfully isn't "abysmal" simply because you expected different results.
It's how Tomba runs without tinkering. And if you just sell Tomba, not a remaster, not a remake, it's exactly what i expect.
If i want to post-process the hell out of it, i use my PSX image on a non-commercial emulator and go nuts.

wrong! this is not how the original PS1 version looked like in the first place

In addition, you want a faithful product? Then how come you can play it in (fake) 16:9? PS1 did not support it. Thats not tinkering? I bet you are not even playing in the original resolution 240p. You said you wanted no tinkering.

You know, wanting to have the original experience is fine, however emulators can do much much better than Tomba shows.

[MaChao]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Tanoomba:

I'm honestly trying to see the difference and I can't.

really? dont focus on textures' quality, focus on how stable the textures are, how they behave when the camera moves.

its clear as day you have zero experience when it comes to PS1 emulation, otherwise you would have noticed all the flaws immediately after few seconds...

Again, they aren't flaws. That's how the game was meant to be.
That's just how the hardware worked back then.
Everything else are "corrections" of how these games could have looked, which is not always what people want if you sell them a nostagia trip.
That's stuff you expect from remasters.

[Blackened Halo]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von MaChao:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

really? dont focus on textures' quality, focus on how stable the textures are, how they behave when the camera moves.

its clear as day you have zero experience when it comes to PS1 emulation, otherwise you would have noticed all the flaws immediately after few seconds...

Again, they aren't flaws. That's how the game was meant to be.
That's just how the hardware worked back then.
Everything else are "corrections" of how these games could have looked, which is not always what people want if you sell them a nostagia trip.
That's stuff you expect from remasters.

So you are playing Tomba in 240p, right?

[MaChao]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

In addition, you want a faithful product? Then how come you can play it in (fake) 16:9? PS1 did not support it. Thats not tinkering

No, it actually isn't. You're stretching a 4:3 image. Pretty much all TV's can stretch and crop images. You're not internally meddling with the game, you're udjusting the output image.

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

I bet you are not even playing it in the original resolution 320x260. You said you wanted no tinkering.

Same as above, output resolution and internal resolution are vastly different things.
To achieve the former, you don't need to mess with the latter.

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

You know, wanting to have the original experience is fine, however emulators can do much much better than Tomba shows.

Just because they can doesn't mean they have to.

[Blackened Halo]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von MaChao:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

In addition, you want a faithful product? Then how come you can play it in (fake) 16:9? PS1 did not support it. Thats not tinkering

No, it actually isn't. You're stretching a 4:3 image. Pretty much all TV's can stretch and crop images. You're not internally meddling with the game, you're udjusting the output image.

The PS1 version was not capable of doing it. It had no such function. So...

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

I bet you are not even playing it in the original resolution 320x260. You said you wanted no tinkering.
Same as above, output resolution and internal resolution are vastly different things.
To achieve the former, you don't need to mess with the latter.

Again, the answer is above...

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

You know, wanting to have the original experience is fine, however emulators can do much much better than Tomba shows.
Just because they can doesn't mean they have to.

Of course, you do not want the best possible quality for your money...so thats the reason Limited Run is so hated by players who know that they can do much much better

[MaChao]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von MaChao:

No, it actually isn't. You're stretching a 4:3 image. Pretty much all TV's can stretch and crop images. You're not internally meddling with the game, you're udjusting the output image.

The PS1 version was not capable of doing it. It had no such function. So...

Yes...because it's a Playstation game...not a TV...
Crop / Stretch / Upscaling is what happens on the display hardware, not on the computing hardware. It's done *after* the console has done it's work already, it isn't even involved in the process anymore.

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

You know, wanting to have the original experience is fine, however emulators can do much much better than Tomba shows. Just because they can doesn't mean they have to.
Of course, you do not want the best possible quality for your money...so thats the reason Limited Run is so hated by players who know that they can do much much better

"best possible quality for your money" is highly subjective.
For me, a faithful re-release is infinitely better than a classic that's being post-processed to death, because if i want to buy an old game, i want to get an old game, not an old game how it could have looked on different hardware.
If you want that, more power to you, but don't conflate your taste with the gold standard.

[Blackened Halo]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von MaChao:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

The PS1 version was not capable of doing it. It had no such function. So...

Yes...because it's a Playstation game...not a TV...
Crop / Stretch / Upscaling is what happens on the display hardware, not on the computing hardware. It's done *after* the console has done it's work already, it isn't even involved in the process anymore.

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

You know, wanting to have the original experience is fine, however emulators can do much much better than Tomba shows. Just because they can doesn't mean they have to.
Of course, you do not want the best possible quality for your money...so thats the reason Limited Run is so hated by players who know that they can do much much better

"best possible quality for your money" is highly subjective.
For me, a faithful re-release is infinitely better than a classic that's being post-processed to death, because if i want to buy an old game, i want to get an old game, not an old game how it could have looked on different hardware.
If you want that, more power to you, but don't conflate your taste with the gold standard.

ill tell you a secret, if you want the original experience, buy a CRT, PS1 and the PS1 version
...this is not faithful, this is faithful:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5aoIdkqAxJw

fine, I admit that differences are not as clear as I hoped to be, they are subtle, but you can spot them if you are focused enough, which means some post process effects are applied in this Special Edition

[Subtle Banshee]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

but you can spot them if you are focused enough

This right here is the problem that no one seems to understand from the people who are giving this game the "ridiculous" reviews. No, we're not focusing "hard enough" on the graphics. We're playing a game that most of us haven't had access to for nearly 30 years, some of whom only ever got to play the demo disk on the original PS1 and never got to play the full game.

We're enjoying the game for what it is, not what it could/"should" be.

People need to learn to just enjoy things. They'll be much happier.

[kode.kristian]

I honestly don't care if it's a perfect 1:1 emulation, or if tweaks have been applied to smooth out some of the rougher edges present on the original hardware. I am just happy to be playing Tomba.

[LT. Vixen Fox]

exactly the same game with only one soundtrack change, where would the work be???? Alex Kidd and Toki have had a modern graphical makeover, there's more work in those games. here they only exploit the nostalgia effect to resell you a 1997 game for 20 euros.

[MaChao]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von LT. Vixen Fox:

exactly the same game with only one soundtrack change, where would the work be???? Alex Kidd and Toki have had a modern graphical makeover, there's more work in those games. here they only exploit the nostalgia effect to resell you a 1997 game for 20 euros.

...and?
Is it really so hard to comprehend that people want exactly that? That this isn't "exploitng" anyone?
It's simply making a classic and beloved game more readily available without changing it.

[Tanoomba]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Blackened Halo:

its clear as day you have zero experience when it comes to PS1 emulation, otherwise you would have noticed all the flaws immediately after few seconds...

Guilty as charged. But then, not wanting to mess with Playstation emulation puts me in the same group as the vast majority of Steam users. If people play this game, and from their perspective it runs fine and is as fun now as it was decades ago, then they're entirely justified in giving the game a good review.

Your mistake is assuming everyone should share your perspective, based on your personal values and priorities. That's not how playing video games works. Don't get me wrong, it's totally fine for you to nitpick whatever details bug you about the game, and you would be entirely justified in giving it a negative review. But your apparent anger and hostility over people liking the game more than you is entirely unwarranted and counter-productive.

[MaChao]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von LT. Vixen Fox:

but on Steam there is the stupidest video game community of all the existing platforms

So is that why you're here then?