Is it just me or is Ancient Hunger a lot worse than Undying Fury?

[PLMMJ]

People slander this game a lot, and for the main campaign, I don't think its very deserved, but for Ancient Hunger?

Let's count up its sins, shall we?

• The Flying Croks are bulky enough to tank a lot of what you can throw at them.
  
• Quickfeet seemingly only exist to distract you and screw you over if you don't kill them. They're fast and able to transform regular Gators, which, reminder, are the basic cannon fodder and can be spawned partway into the map from Crokinders, into Killadiles which are essentially worse versions of Cult Abominations.
  
• Nesting Gators are essentially tankier versions of the already annoying Vile Spawners. Add that to the fact that their Crokinders have defense and fully heal on hatching, as well as synergizing with the Quickfeet, this makes them much more annoying than they have any right to be.
  
• Sylvara's reach is weirdly short and she's very dependent on her power. Additionally, said power doesn't mesh with the upgrade that gives you a free use of a power every 5th use as it doesn't stack.
  
• The second level. The. Freaking. Second. Level. I haven't been able to beat this level on any difficulty higher than Casual (mostly Normal and a couple Impossible!) Woe betide you if you decide to play on Impossible for whatever reason.
  
  • Half the level is full of swamp, including most of the distance on each path, and you physically cannot target enemies in the swamp. Additionally, your units cannot move through the swamp, making using reinforcements pointlessly annoying.
    
  • There are so many paths that using Grim Wraiths to move around your strong towers is next to mandatory. And reminder, you can only use Demon Pits and Bog Hermits in the Iron Challenge...
    
  • The top path. Just look at it. No path in a level with so many paths has any right to be that short. And Winged Croks spawn on it.
    
  • Hydras are gigantic resource drains on this map due to the fact that they can swim through the swamp just like any other enemy, thus being able to shortcut straight to the final stretch, and having more health than any enemy that can take such a shortcut has any reason to have. Additionally, they plow through units like they were nothing. They're not nearly as bad on the third level due to it not having ridiculous amounts of swamp.
• Abominor:
  
  • Eating your towers without being able to tell which it is.
    
  • Growing to obscene sizes. Sure, it looks cool, but it's obnoxious because it gets in the way of selecting things.

[???]

Originally posted by PLMMJ:

Originally posted by Anteater:

My only assumption is that you’re not buying the Bombardment skill, as that is what makes it so strong. Also don’t buy Overheat.

I was buying both, that must be it

The overheat skill stop bombardment from triggering whilst its active. Last update, they've buffed it so the skill is much less likely to get in the way of bombardment skill.

[Maurice gaming division]

Assuming the wiki is right bombardment at level 3 shoots out 22 bombs with 40-80 damage so 60 on average. 22*60=1320 damage every 15 seconds, making bombardment do 88 explosive (ignores half armor) aoe dps. Usually some shots miss so if only two thirds of the bombs hit which is low-balling it, then it does 15*60 or 900 damage every 15 seconds, or 60 explosive aoe dps. Additionally, it can get boosted by 40% because for some reason this ability counts towards arcane wizard's empowerment. If that isn't op then I don't know what is.

[PLMMJ]

Arcane Wizard's what? I haven't used the tower enough to know what exactly that is, I just used necro instead as soon as I unlocked it. Also, our best wiki is a Fandom wiki, meaning it should automatically be taken with a couple grains of salt.

Also also, if a tower needs another tower to work with it to make it truly OP, then the tower is not OP, only the combination. It's like the Prism Combo in Mega Man Battle Network, neither of the attacks that make it up are that useful on their own, but when used together they absolutely destroy most enemies.

[???]

Originally posted by PLMMJ:

Arcane Wizard's what? I haven't used the tower enough to know what exactly that is, I just used necro instead as soon as I unlocked it. Also, our best wiki is a Fandom wiki, meaning it should automatically be taken with a couple grains of salt.

The wiki copied the descriptions they gave in game. And from my testing bombardment is OP.

Also, arcane wizard tower is the basic mage tower you unlock at start. It has much higher dps than necro and has instaKill and tower buffs.

[PLMMJ]

Did some testing and I have to concur: Tricannon + Arcane Wizard is completely ridiculous, especially if you also have Sylvara's Deep Roots ability boosting the tricannon. Even on Impossible they're able to capably defend a couple waves on the Veteran version of Corruption Valley, a map which I and seemingly a lot of others revile for its difficulty.

Edit: I think I see the problem: I hadn't had the highest tier tower skills unlocked when I gave up on Tricannon, one of which maximizes explosion damage and the other of which reduces skill cooldown, two things that this tower greatly benefits from.

[Space!]

Originally posted by Violent Rainbow:

I mean the three level "campaigns" they keep churning out (most as paid DLC) that are incredibly easy, boring, repetitive and finished in about 11 minutes are, in general. not that great.

since when has this been paid? the three level campaigns have been fine for me, I enjoyed both. Hydra's and the flying enemies were the only guys i didnt like but I suck at the game so my loss to them was totally on me. The new tower is so ridiculously good that you losing at this point is a genuine skill issue.

also how tf do u finish these campaigns so quickly and how are they repetitive? Each level adds new enemies and the boss for the most recent one was fun with an interesting hero that requires high skill to use effectively. And the previous one added bonehart and one of the most unique towers we've seen in ages.

istg yall are so dumb ;-;

[Space!]

Originally posted by PLMMJ:

I fail to understand why a tower that has failed or been outclassed every single time I tried it in the main campaign would suddenly magically be overpowered.

idk man, it must be you playing wrong? I dont even use tri-cannon and I know its the best artillery.

[PLMMJ]

Originally posted by Space!:

Originally posted by Violent Rainbow:

I mean the three level "campaigns" they keep churning out (most as paid DLC) that are incredibly easy, boring, repetitive and finished in about 11 minutes are, in general. not that great.

since when has this been paid? the three level campaigns have been fine for me, I enjoyed both. Hydra's and the flying enemies were the only guys i didnt like but I suck at the game so my loss to them was totally on me. The new tower is so ridiculously good that you losing at this point is a genuine skill issue.

also how tf do u finish these campaigns so quickly and how are they repetitive? Each level adds new enemies and the boss for the most recent one was fun with an interesting hero that requires high skill to use effectively. And the previous one added bonehart and one of the most unique towers we've seen in ages.

istg yall are so dumb ;-;

I agree with a lot of your points. I have no clue how someone beats an entire campaign in 11 minutes. Additionally, the only paid DLC campaigns (to my knowledge) have been the 5 parters.

However, Bog Hermit is not actually THAT good. Still one of the best towers, but not THAT good without support and stalling. Additionally, the fight against Abominor is just a pain considering he randomly eats your towers with zero warning, and the Twilight Longbowers or whatever they were called really only get to do much if you intentionally feed them kills with their t4 abilities, so they're not that useful outside of situations where that can happen.

[Ghin]

If you knew he ate your towers, why did you build Twilight Longbows? Doesn't make much sense.

[PLMMJ]

I used them on the second level, not the third.

[Anteater]

While yeah, tower destruction isn’t great, overall the final level really isn’t too hard to beat/play around. Also the second level is not that hard to just build like Royal Archers, Ballista Outpost, Arcane Wizard, Rocket Gunners, Bog Hermit, or any combination of those to reliably deal with fliers.

If your main gripe with a campaign is that it’s too hard, that’s not really a big deal when you can pretty simply adjust your playstyle to beat the levels. If you’re just stuck doing the same thing over and over again and wondering why it’s so hard, that’s indicative that you need to actually change your playstyle and strategies as opposed to it being “too hard”. The tower destruction being bad as a rule is something I 100% agree with, but I’d be lying if I said it was hard to counter. Watch people’s playthrough of it on YouTube to get a better idea of how to play it. This is not me just trying to say “ha, skill issue”, I’m just trying to be constructive when your main argument against the campaign has been that it’s “too hard”.

[PLMMJ]

I'm not trying to say the campaign is too hard, then I would have just said that. I'm trying to say that it's frustrating which leads to its difficulty feeling unfair and it feeling a lot lower in quality than Undying Fury before it. Does random tower destruction sound frustrating and unfair to you?

[???]

Originally posted by PLMMJ:

I'm not trying to say the campaign is too hard, then I would have just said that. I'm trying to say that it's frustrating which leads to its difficulty feeling unfair and it feeling a lot lower in quality than Undying Fury before it. Does random tower destruction sound frustrating and unfair to you?

Honestly, it seems that much of your frustration and complaint other than the tower destruction arises from you having trouble with the new enemies and the second level(hell you said you are having trouble beating it on casual with bone-hart of all heroes).

[shitass]

Currently playing through ancient hunger, after beating the first 2 levels I can definitely agree that it sucks.

[Alberich]

I rather liked it myself, but in part because of my approach - I listen to something else while playing, use the game for something to do with my hands while I listen, and don't mind trying different combinations (heroes + towers) until I hit the right one. The last level was a bear for sure, at least on Impossible it was, but I don't mind the occasional bear.