too difficult to find food early

[sergykid]

this game looks absolutely awesome, very complex for a free game, i soon as i start i click everything just to see the environment

after a while, i am attentioned that i`ll die from starvation, and as i run around the city i just fall on the street cuz nobody has food

going into forest, i tried 4 times (by dying and starting again)
1) nothing in the forest. No food nothing to colect
2) nothing in the forest but a boar, which headbutts me and goes further
3) a bandit, who has silver coins, no food
4) a bandit, who has some apples, i remove starvation, but i die out of cold while walking

i understand that is random generated, but it should be easier to get food early in the game, i can hardly get anywhere like this

[fizzii_ish]

I take it you're a warrior? I noticed in a lot of Let's Plays that people tended to miss the spear, which is on the east side of the town (east of the adventurers' guild). Then you can get the boar

If you are a sorceress, there are roots to collect just south of the city, and if you're a rogue, you don't need to leave the city at all. Getting food isn't dependent on random combat.

Anyway, what you are dying from is the cold, not starvation so you need to watch your stamina bar. Once that drops, you will start to lose hp. Running will also use up stamina, as will standing around.

Things will generally get easier as you level up your stamina (otherwise you can put more points into stamina). Otherwise, lowering the difficulty setting will also make it easier (the easiest setting will remove any effect of the cold altogether... but this will also make combat a two-shot affair).

[krazbobeans]

Came here to make the same complaint. It's cool someone took the time to make this for free, but getting food in the beginning is frustrating because the game prevents you from doing the obvious (just kill the boar with the sword, why wouldnt you?) and fails to guide you to the spear. And why can't I just buy a spear from the blacksmith. From a design perspective it doesn't make sense and just confuses me. If you can't do the obvious solutions to a problem you have to come up with some kind of real reason. Starving to death and not using a sword because "its not he best weapon for hunting" is asinine.

[sergykid]

save your breath, krazbobeans

later in game u`ll find same puzzles, you'll have to guess, or by luck, or try anything until works for most puzzles

[fizzii_ish]

Originally posted by krazbobeans:

Came here to make the same complaint. It's cool someone took the time to make this for free, but getting food in the beginning is frustrating because the game prevents you from doing the obvious (just kill the boar with the sword, why wouldnt you?) and fails to guide you to the spear. And why can't I just buy a spear from the blacksmith. From a design perspective it doesn't make sense and just confuses me. If you can't do the obvious solutions to a problem you have to come up with some kind of real reason. Starving to death and not using a sword because "its not he best weapon for hunting" is asinine.

You'll need to pay attention. I'm pretty sure the game mentions finding a spear - and at least Heime says 'go hunting' at the beginning. Granted, a lot of people didn't seem to notice the spear even with the sparkle over it - point taken for next time. But you'll actually find it difficult to actually kill a boar in real life with a sword when it's charging at you, so yes, it does make sense.

Originally posted by sergykid:

save your breath, krazbobeans

later in game u`ll find same puzzles, you'll have to guess, or by luck, or try anything until works for most puzzles

No, you don't need to guess or be lucky. You just need to be able to pay attention and be patient and look for the clues provided - other people have played through the game without any hints at all, and they worked out the puzzles by themselves. The only real point where there is a bit of moon logic involved is with the rogue and the lodestone, in my opinion.

[sergykid]

the boar isn't there at the begin of the game all the time, i died 5 times with the warrior when i started either from starvation or frozen, even if i had or not the spear

the problems is the game kills you at every mistake, you have to try a puzzle until it works, because most of them just kill u if u take it wrong

[fizzii_ish]

That's why we introduced the difficulty slider. If you start with the tutorial, the setting would be on difficulty 2. If you skipped the tutorial, the setting will be difficulty 3 (assumes the player will be a bit more experienced). If you're still having trouble, then it's best to lower to difficulty 1.

The game doesn't kill you at every mistake; it's simply a matter of being aware of what you're doing. The game is designed to be hard to achieve full points (while still being logical), but easier if just aiming to complete it without going for 100% score. If the game purely required trial and error, it wouldn't have gotten past testing without some complaints.

[sergykid]

it's not about the difficulty, the game kills you if you take a wrong move at some puzzles. It also kills u often even by without knowing that u will die if u do that. Reloading from latest save every time is easy but morale lowering

*SPOILERS*

pass near the plant in the swamp - first, you don't get the idea of using the shield; if you do, you can't know that you have to prepare it on the click from first time -> dead

for Thrivaldi in the cave, i thought i`ll fight him, but he just smashes a rock in my head -> dead

getting the bark, you hear a sound coming enemies - think u fight them or to leave the map -> dead

the imp, i tried going to talk with him, boulder smashes me -> dead

jump inside the mage's tower through window -> dead

get wrong answers at the three ladies at the stones - lost in abyss -> dead

not knowing if u can pass through flames at viking -> dead

when last boss casts spell at u, the game tells u about the gloves AFTER u die (u may not even have the gloves, i could have left them in a chest, what happens then?)

at the time portal, u don't know that coming back to portal or going out in the woods u lose it, as warrior i can fight 3 giants at a time, but still -> dead

selecting another option at the chat with urself -> dead

etc... there's more examples i just don't remember now. I only played as warrior, but i`m sure as rogue or mage i`ll die from almost every bad move too

[fizzii_ish]

Well, one of the features of the game is finding all the different ways to die :). There is also a reason why there is a save game as well as an autosave.

pass near the plant in the swamp - first, you don't get the idea of using the shield; if you do, you can't know that you have to prepare it on the click from first time -> dead

There's a visual clue, where the plant flicks up its arm with a spike.

for Thrivaldi in the cave, i thought i`ll fight him, but he just smashes a rock in my head -> dead

Well, I suppose no one would know that a rock would hit your head, but it stands to reason that if he can nearly kill Sigurd (plus he nearly takes out the heroine in the beginning too), that it wouldn't be wise to approach him just like that. Aurvandel explains that Thrivaldi is the strongest of trolls too.

getting the bark, you hear a sound coming enemies - think u fight them or to leave the map -> dead

The in game message should indicate that it is wise to hide. I don't recall what it says though.

the imp, i tried going to talk with him, boulder smashes me -> dead

That one's an easter egg. I would've thought that the in game message indicates that you're not meant to be there. If you play our small game called Quest for Yrolg at some point, you'll understand why the imp kills you! (and it actually does tie into one of the puzzles in that game).

jump inside the mage's tower through window -> dead

Well, if you're playing as a warrior, does it really make sense to try and jump into Aurvandel's tower when you can use the front door? The beast head is also there from the beginning and you can see it following you, like a camera.

get wrong answers at the three ladies at the stones - lost in abyss -> dead

If you've been paying attention to the story, there really is no reason why one should get these questions wrong.

not knowing if u can pass through flames at viking -> dead

Arngrim provides the clue - he has dialog which says that when fighters want to prove themselves, they find a mighty beast to defeat.

when last boss casts spell at u, the game tells u about the gloves AFTER u die (u may not even have the gloves, i could have left them in a chest, what happens then?)

We made it so that players could not put the gloves into the chest. I'm fairly sure Eitri explains what the gloves are for, and yes, it does require "quick" thinking on the part of the player.

at the time portal, u don't know that coming back to portal or going out in the woods u lose it, as warrior i can fight 3 giants at a time, but still -> dead

I don't think giants roam together in packs normally. I can't recall what indication there is to not walk further out, but the main objective was to find a way to get to Egther. Your character takes the portal because that's the only way to go, and once you get the key (which is hinted at in the Jarl's throneroom), you have your way to get to him.

selecting another option at the chat with urself -> dead

Again, one needs to pay attention. It is a time loop so logically, when the puzzle arises, you should do what you've seen/heard before.

I agree that the game isn't easy to complete, but I disagree that it's extremely unfair. With any RPG/adventure, some deaths can be expected. The general philosophy when playing games like these is to save early, and save often.

[Vik]

I love this game, I managed to figure most things out by myself. Man, there's a lot of belly-aching here about very simple things. Seriously, stop for a second and think, the solution will come to you.

[Rithm Fluffderg]

Originally posted by Viktorhark:

I love this game, I managed to figure most things out by myself. Man, there's a lot of belly-aching here about very simple things. Seriously, stop for a second and think, the solution will come to you.

Some things are simply less obvious to some people than other people.

Which isn't necessarily indicative that they're less observant, just... differently observant?

However I think some people do have a tendency to be too quick to complain. A human reaction, depending on the circumstances of one's life, but also one that needs to be worked on.

[steevm]

Yeah, this is silly. I talked to both Heime and his mum and the message I took from the conversations was "go to the forest to find food".

I did not take the message "there is a spear in that you need to hunt" from the conversations with them. So I wander into the forest and wonder why I can't attack boars with my weapon. That is bad game design.

[sergykid]

Originally posted by steevm:

Yeah, this is silly. I talked to both Heime and his mum and the message I took from the conversations was "go to the forest to find food".

I did not take the message "there is a spear in that you need to hunt" from the conversations with them. So I wander into the forest and wonder why I can't attack boars with my weapon. That is bad game design.

the game is brilliant, it just has these small flaws, trial and error, problem is that the "error" kills you

[Rithm Fluffderg]

Originally posted by sergykid:

Originally posted by steevm:

Yeah, this is silly. I talked to both Heime and his mum and the message I took from the conversations was "go to the forest to find food".

I did not take the message "there is a spear in that you need to hunt" from the conversations with them. So I wander into the forest and wonder why I can't attack boars with my weapon. That is bad game design.

the game is brilliant, it just has these small flaws, trial and error, problem is that the "error" kills you

Those "flaws" that you're talking about are a core staple of games like this. You have the ability to save at any time, but you can also die at any time. Learn what doesn't kill you. Learn what does. Most of the deaths you complained about before could have been avoided if you simply paid attention.

And as far as that goes, Heroine's Quest is MUCH more lenient than, say, King's Quest 5.

Save frequently, and keep multiple saves across a single playthrough. The game outright tells you early on that the gloves you get nullify magical power... so when an enemy is charging up a magical attack against you, logic says you need to *nullify* it.

It's simple logic, and these games are excellent for learning it, but only if you know to take responsibility for your errors and not immediately blame it on the game.

[jenbitespeople]

Originally posted by Zachski243:

Originally posted by sergykid:

the game is brilliant, it just has these small flaws, trial and error, problem is that the "error" kills you

Those "flaws" that you're talking about are a core staple of games like this. You have the ability to save at any time, but you can also die at any time. Learn what doesn't kill you. Learn what does. Most of the deaths you complained about before could have been avoided if you simply paid attention.

And as far as that goes, Heroine's Quest is MUCH more lenient than, say, King's Quest 5.

Save frequently, and keep multiple saves across a single playthrough. The game outright tells you early on that the gloves you get nullify magical power... so when an enemy is charging up a magical attack against you, logic says you need to *nullify* it.

It's simple logic, and these games are excellent for learning it, but only if you know to take responsibility for your errors and not immediately blame it on the game.

Yes, this. Play any of Sierra's Quest games and you die all the time - and those games also had dead ends, which Heroine's Quest doesn't appear to. (Ever tried eating the fish you catch? The message about how you needed it to complete the game followed by the "lol, jk" message is a reference to the arbitrary nature of those old games, where a minor action early on could turn out to cost you the endgame. Sierra was merciless.)

Personally I agree with the devs - finding all the ways to die is half the fun. I'd much rather do that than constantly be told "no, you can't climb up there, it's dangerous" or "no, you can't throw a dagger at that person, they'll kill you".

[Carighan]

Originally posted by krazbobeans:

(just kill the boar with the sword, why wouldnt you?)

Right. I mean, I'd *maybe* try it with my bow, assuming I'm on an elevated post far away. Nevermind with a spear. *NEVERMIND* with any short-range weapon. It's a friggin' boar!