Empire Pop Growth Rate is Stupid

[yuzhonglu]

I mean it just becomes a matter of rushing megastructures like Dyson Spheres and Matter Compilers. Otherwise you'll never get the pop for resources.

[Storm]

引用自 Ertwin：

As a casual player, I don't think I've ever had a population much higher than 200, even when facing down a crisis. So I'm not really seeing a problem with being capped around 5 times that.

3000 pops for me and the ai having more was normal with no mods on admiral and largest galaxy

[WolfAteMyLegs]

引用自 Daddy Parietal：

There is alot of anecdotal "Well I played it and It was fine for me" comments on almost every post mentioning this.
A Few Points:

Habitable megastructures are now useless in the endgame (Also cybrex if you wait too long)

Any focus on diplomacy beyond war is basically useless

Empires that focus on peace, migration, and diplomacy are objectively worse then empires that focus on war

End game repeatables will scale out of your reach as the endgame progress (Negating the point of the automated research QOL feature as you need to focus before the tech cost outscales your growth).

Tech rush and Zerg rush are the only viable strategies anymore

There is no incentive to protect your borderlands

There is no point in having any resources beyond alloys (and research) by midgame as there is no point to colonize, build, or manage pops in any capacity beyond building growth building immediately

The endgame turns into HOI4 without the logistics, its just mindless war as there is nothing else to do.

This problem broke and straight made half the context of the game useless to even use, and this is especially annoying to people who bought the DLC's for this content that they cant really use around the time of the game they are suppose to use them (megastructures)

If you want to play aggressive and war-like then you will not have any issues, but If you like building economy and doing anything else, end-game becomes boring and annoying to slog through.

this

[ahnkra]

For me the problem is I cant continue to expand my empire by colonizing planets,... not only that but the growth slows down so much on planets I already have colonized that I cant build anything new at all, like one building on one planet once every 5 minutes or so, THATS boring! I really really want this mechanism gone from my games!

[WolfAteMyLegs]

引用自 ahnkra：

For me the problem is I cant continue to expand my empire by colonizing planets,... not only that but the growth slows down so much on planets I already have colonized that I cant build anything new at all, like one building on one planet once every 5 minutes or so, THATS boring! I really really want this mechanism gone from my games!

exactly why should you punished for colonizing a planet just because it is x years into the game? a brand spanking new 25 terraformed gaia world and it is made completely pointless because your pop growth is at such an insane level that you simply cannot grow pops. want to populate your new ringworld? guess what you can't. I don't understand how anyone can make an arguement for the new system when it literally breaks all non hyper aggressive empires or features. Ringworlds/megastructures = gone. pacifism/isolationism = gone. game is either assimilate or raid pops and pretty much nothing else.

[The Ohio Question]

Played thru the game with a mod that removes the empire pop debuff to growth last night.

Performance does suffer a bitby late game , but its not even close to as bad as it used to be pre update.

I legitimately do not understand paradox's "logic" on adding this, besides they love to add stupid ♥♥♥♥ to piss off players.

But what else is new.

[Ertwin]

引用自 WolfAteMyLegs：

引用自 ahnkra：

For me the problem is I cant continue to expand my empire by colonizing planets,... not only that but the growth slows down so much on planets I already have colonized that I cant build anything new at all, like one building on one planet once every 5 minutes or so, THATS boring! I really really want this mechanism gone from my games!

exactly why should you punished for colonizing a planet just because it is x years into the game? a brand spanking new 25 terraformed gaia world and it is made completely pointless because your pop growth is at such an insane level that you simply cannot grow pops. want to populate your new ringworld? guess what you can't. I don't understand how anyone can make an arguement for the new system when it literally breaks all non hyper aggressive empires or features. Ringworlds/megastructures = gone. pacifism/isolationism = gone. game is either assimilate or raid pops and pretty much nothing else.

That's only a problem if you min/max for pop growth. If all you care about is pops, then yeah I guess it'll eventually be a problem. But if you get to the late game with only about 300 pops, then you won't have any problem populating a ring world or a gaia world.

You can also just manually move pops over to the fancy new worlds.

[Storm]

Is it really 5 years per pop at 2300? Most of my 20 planets have under 23?

[Orion]

引用自 yuzhonglu：

It means there's no point in building districts or investing in pop growth once you hit 1000.

Also, the Ai ISN'T slowed down because the AI rarely gets to 1000 pop.

AI dosnt need pop... they get free resources each month

[tathen]

on the upside... tall is now the only good play style

[RawCode]

引用自 FANG：

Is it really 5 years per pop at 2300? Most of my 20 planets have under 23?

it's not related to time, it's related to total population of specific empire, each pop you own increase growth cost by some value on all and every of your planets.

and yes, new colony in 2300 will take ages to reach reasonable population, but in 2200 it will grow multiple pops per year.

[InvIzIble]

Now not playable as void dweller at all, you just have no possibility to handle much housing (or there will be no jobs for your pops). Hardly, with buffs, got 220 pops at 2300? growing about 0,5-1/190 pop per month. need 400 month to grow up a single on, just because habitat realities

[The Ohio Question]

引用自 tathen：

on the upside... tall is now the only good play style

Na, any playstyle that relies on stealing pops massively outclassess tall. Tall in fact may be one of the worst ways to go now.

Despoiler, terravore, assimilator, and just working the slave market like crazy are the real top dogs now.

[galadon3]

引用自 Unyielding Sarcasm：

引用自 tathen：

on the upside... tall is now the only good play style

Na, any playstyle that relies on stealing pops massively outclassess tall. Tall in fact may be one of the worst ways to go now.

Despoiler, terravore, assimilator, and just working the slave market like crazy are the real top dogs now.

jepp thing with tall is that planets (and habitats ringworld-sections) are still the pop-breeders, that doesnt change.
So more planets still means more growth, while more pops means more growthpoints needed for a new pop, wich means an empire that has 1000 pops stretched over 50 planets will still grow faster then a tall empire that crams its 1000 pops on 10 planets.

It basically just means that any expansion that doesnt come with conquering pops is pointless.

[The Ohio Question]

引用自 galadon3：

引用自 Unyielding Sarcasm：

Na, any playstyle that relies on stealing pops massively outclassess tall. Tall in fact may be one of the worst ways to go now.

Despoiler, terravore, assimilator, and just working the slave market like crazy are the real top dogs now.

jepp thing with tall is that planets (and habitats ringworld-sections) are still the pop-breeders, that doesnt change.
So more planets still means more growth, while more pops means more growthpoints needed for a new pop, wich means an empire that has 1000 pops stretched over 50 planets will still grow faster then a tall empire that crams its 1000 pops on 10 planets.

It basically just means that any expansion that doesnt come with conquering pops is pointless.

Pretty much (though pop stealing is VERY strong for snowballing now)

Honestly, all of this is prob a pointless conversation atm, from the massive amount of blowback the new system has, its clearly going to be tweaked if not ripped out entirely.

[galadon3]

引用自 Unyielding Sarcasm：

Honestly, all of this is prob a pointless conversation atm, from the massive amount of blowback the new system has, its clearly going to be tweaked if not ripped out entirely.

Don't be too sure, back before 2.0 when you couldnt control the planets in sectors yourself, people really really hated it and the sloooooow progress towards, first more and more finetuned control over the AI handling them and FINALLY (not long before 2.0 killed the system entirely) giving players the option to at least build stuff themselves on those worlds if they wanted to took LITERALLY years...

I hope you're right though and the actual team is bit less loath to let go of bad ideas then it used to under 'Whiz' rulership...