Questions about vassal subsidaries

[Nordos/atord]

So, I recently started a game as an Astro Miner and thought 'Prostectorium? That sounds like it may get well together with my build!'. searched for a friendly neighbour and became his vassal - after all, it read that I get up tp 40% output and discover rare resources I can then mine as well! .... until I realized that the subject taxes were multiplicative, so it would take 30% of my 1.4 mining -> leaving me with ~0,98%, causing a deficit that slowly spread out of control until I had to change my profession (since I can't lower the amount of subsidaries I need to pay, even if my overlord was very willing - I can't rem,ember if energy production was boosted to begin with).
So, 'learning' from that, I changed into a Bullwark. After all, here I get resources and am not required to pay anything. My contract was also very very favourable, so I got up to 45% tech.

... And then I get the message that my overlord can't pay the tech subsidary they owe me. I ... what? How come they can't pay 45% of their tech?! How the hell is the tech handled?

I had been a Scholarium before when playing with friends, but I didn't really look at whatever I was ganing/loosing through the subsidaries. I figured I pay 30%, but since I had tech in the high thousands still left over, I didn't really care about it. It also transmitted the immense tech spike when I got my lathe to over 200 people, temporarily boosting me into 140k tech (while still being a Scholarium).

So, with that in mind .... how exactly does the tech subsidy work, and why does it seem to be different from the resource subsidaries? How come that someone can't pay their '45%' science subsidary? Is that too a percentage of the whole science production, or does it interact differently with the scholarium own 'produce 40% more science', leaving you actually with a surpluss when only playing 30% taxes?

[Adskmln]

The overlord pays a percentage of the vassals production not their own. If you are making 100 science with a 45% subsidy the overlord pays 45 science regardless of their own production.

[Nordos/atord]

Escrito originalmente por Adskmln:

The overlord pays a percentage of the vassals production not their own. If you are making 100 science with a 45% subsidy the overlord pays 45 science regardless of their own production.

ah, thanks, that does clear it up regarding my overlords inability to pay - does that affect the other resource productions as well?
I am by magnitudes bigger and stronger, be it in science or economy. I would have assumed I would bankrupt my overlord if they would pay their primary/secondary resource production scaling with my own as well?

[Ryika]

Escrito originalmente por Nordos/atord:

ah, thanks, that does clear it up regarding my overlords inability to pay - does that affect the other resource productions as well?
I am by magnitudes bigger and stronger, be it in science or economy. I would have assumed I would bankrupt my overlord if they would pay their primary/secondary resource production scaling with my own as well?

It goes for all resources.

But yeah, you'll bankrupt them. You're a subject, they're an overlord... you're not supposed to be bigger than them.

[RCMidas]

Escrito originalmente por Nordos/atord:

Escrito originalmente por Adskmln:

The overlord pays a percentage of the vassals production not their own. If you are making 100 science with a 45% subsidy the overlord pays 45 science regardless of their own production.

ah, thanks, that does clear it up regarding my overlords inability to pay - does that affect the other resource productions as well?
I am by magnitudes bigger and stronger, be it in science or economy. I would have assumed I would bankrupt my overlord if they would pay their primary/secondary resource production scaling with my own as well?

Eventually, sure, but that's going to take a while. First their stockpiled resources must be depleted, their capacity to purchase or rejig their economy to produce more of said resources will need to be neutralised, and their own expansion should be curtailed so that they can't simply go into debt whilst building up new worlds and stations to offset your own leeching off of them.

[Nordos/atord]

Escrito originalmente por RCMidas:

Eventually, sure, but that's going to take a while. First their stockpiled resources must be depleted, their capacity to purchase or rejig their economy to produce more of said resources will need to be neutralised, and their own expansion should be curtailed so that they can't simply go into debt whilst building up new worlds and stations to offset your own leeching off of them.

Okay, that may explain the rebellions my overlord has to contend with..... Damn, that is some hella underhanded tactic to bleed someone dry - you could then attack them to free yourself, and repeat the process. A shame for the lost experience with the subspecialising, though.

That said, I am still a bit confused then. Someone who is magnitudes weaker (in tech?!) than me can only become a protectorate - I assumed that the specialisations are not possible since they would in no way be able to pay the immense taxes - but if it is based on the subject, not the overlord, that shouldn't factor in.

Also, regarding the science taxes - are they multiplicate or additive when you are the subject? I.e. you produce 100 science, get a 40% bonus from the specialisation and pay 30% - are you left with 110 science orwith 98?