Arc Welder start maybe bugged

[chris23162]

No matter what combination of ethics and civics I choose without picking any that directly affect station output I always start with an income of either 1 or zero minerals and around 30 energy this is terrible considering a empire not using arc welder start gets 70 or so of both energy and minerals a month at the start.

Did this already get nerfed or is it something that will only become semi ok later on or decent if you get say cybrex ?

[GammaDragon]

for me everything work great

[chris23162]

Originally posted by _Gamma_Dragon_:

for me everything work great

What are you running civics and ethics wise ?

[chris23162]

The issue is it's always giving me 3 industrial districts right off the bat and you always start producing either 36.25 or 37.25 minerals and the jobs use up 36 minerals thus all your minerals are eaten right away and the arc furnace isn't even 1 to 1 efficient stations bring in 16.25 or 17.25 minerals but the cost of the arc furnace is 20 and the mining stations is 10 so your paying 30 energy for 16.25 or 17.25 which is just terrible.

[Gingermonkey]

Are you using mods? I just did 3 random starts using the origin with different civics and ethics each time, and i had +30-36 starting energy income, and +40 minerals, with only 1 industrial district built.

[chris23162]

Originally posted by RMS_Gingermonkey:

Are you using mods? I just did 3 random starts using the origin with different civics and ethics each time, and i had +30-36 starting energy income, and +40 minerals, with only 1 industrial district built.

No mods and I am assuming you did a machine empire which it works fine for as they don't need consumer goods so you save a ton right off the bat as you have 2 alloy producing jobs at the start as machine empires but as a individualistic machine you need consumer goods and to get enough consumer goods for all your pops it starts you with 3 industrial districts which gives you 3 alloy jobs and 3 consumer goods jobs each job has 6 mineral usage so 6 x 6 gives you the 36 mineral usage I am getting.

The only way around this is to start the game as a either a fanatical materialist for the -20% machine upkeep, materialist and durable for the -20% or if you go fanatical materialist and durable you get -30% machine upkeep. You need a minimum of -20% though as that is the lowest percent discount needed to get enough consumer goods reduction to start with just 2 industrial districts and thus 2 alloy jobs and 2 consumer goods jobs meaning your mineral upkeep is 24 so you start getting 12 minerals a month.

Basically the origin is completely incompatible with any individualistic machine build that does not take fanatical materialist or materialist and durable. So the origin needs to be changed so the system is the same for machine empires but for individualistic machines the system needs to be a set system with another 40 minerals in it just to break even with gestalt machine empires.

[Gingermonkey]

https://steamcommunity.com/id/jbraley868/screenshot/2480998426832990598/

Heres the newest start i did. Only slightly problematic thing is that i started with a -.09 consumer goods, but thats easily fixed

[chris23162]

Originally posted by RMS_Gingermonkey:

https://steamcommunity.com/id/jbraley868/screenshot/2480998426832990598/

Heres the newest start i did. Only slightly problematic thing is that i started with a -.09 consumer goods, but thats easily fixed

Just tried the same build and ended up with 77 energy a month but still 0 minerals income as it gave me a third industrial district however it started me with positive consumer goods because of it. The issue is certain combinations of civics and traits can give you jobs that cost a decent amount of consumer goods and the origins mineral production is just too weak to cope if it decides you need 3 industrial districts and even when it doesn't the origin is just plain bad for individulistic machines but ok for normal machines as machine world is still better start wise.