Vassals hate me for relative power? :: Stellaris General Discussions

Store Page

Stellaris

All Discussions Screenshots Artwork Broadcasts Videos Workshop News Guides Reviews

Stellaris > General Discussions > Topic Details

griffdog82 has Stellaris

May 23, 2016 @ 5:09pm

Vassals hate me for relative power?

Vassals that I have conquered and enlightened both have a negative influcence thing called "relative power of subjects" that gives them a -700 view of me. Is this a bug, becasuse vassals didn't do this earlier. If not I hope someone with a modding background can make a mod disabling this.

< >

Showing 1-15 of 24 comments

suksas

May 23, 2016 @ 5:11pm

Well they do hate you for being more powerfull. But -700? thats seems like a bug.

griffdog82 has Stellaris

May 23, 2016 @ 5:15pm

yah that what I thought
Plus if I was enlightened I would be happy at the other empire not jealous? Maybe they didn't think that thought.

Wraith

May 23, 2016 @ 5:25pm

The negative modifier is because you *lack* relative power, and it's your empire's power vs. the sum of all your vassal's power, not just the one. You can reduce it be releasing or integrating vassals, or by building up your military.

I'm not sure if there are any negative effects for this, though. I'd assume that eventually they'd start to rebel against you, but I've never seen that it any of my games.

suksas

May 23, 2016 @ 5:26pm

Originally posted by Wraith:
The negative modifier is because you *lack* relative power, and it's your empire's power vs. the sum of all your vassal's power, not just the one. You can reduce it be releasing or integrating vassals, or by building up your military.

I'm not sure if there are any negative effects for this, though. I'd assume that eventually they'd start to rebel against you, but I've never seen that it any of my games.

... I'm more powerfull then my vassals combined. Yet they still hate me for being more powerfull.

Wraith

May 23, 2016 @ 5:30pm

It's not just the sum of the fleets, and it's not a straight comparison. Tech level, for instance, also factors in. As does military capacity. Both those things matter a lot, to the point that the game could think your empire strengths are roughly equivalent even if your fleet would curb stomp theirs. The later you are in the game, the more lopsided and probably inaccurate the equation becomes.

They don't hate you for being too powerful, they hate you for not being powerful enough to justify as many and as strong vassals as you have.

Last edited by Wraith; May 23, 2016 @ 5:32pm

suksas

May 23, 2016 @ 5:33pm

Was wrong. He is strong enough in naval and technology

Last edited by suksas; May 23, 2016 @ 5:37pm

Sohei

May 23, 2016 @ 5:35pm

I think vassals keeping the negative modifier for threat is more annoying. There is a threat I suppose that I could integrate them but if I wanted to do that I could have demanded to cede all planets of a small empire instead. The fact that I chose to force vassalize them should give them some comfort that I will not at least enslave or kill them all. I also will provide some protection as an overlord for my vassal.

I took over a small empire with very similar ethics just because I did not quite have enough relation to ally with them or peacefully vassalize them. After winning a war against another neighbor my threat level immediately got so high that friendly negotiation became impossible. So I had to force vassalize them before they joined an alliance. Yet even after vassalizing them they retained the -180 threat from my war against a dangerous enightbor that could not be avoided.

Vassals should not retain this heavy threat relation that takes a compatible group with maxed embassy bonus way down into a deep negative.

Last edited by Sohei; May 23, 2016 @ 5:37pm

Wraith

May 23, 2016 @ 5:37pm

(edit: @suksas, re:deleted post)
You just mean you have a negative modifier for relative strength, right? That's to be expected in this game. Anything less than -100 probably means you're doing pretty well, and you don't really need to worry about it.

I'm not even sure more than that is a problem, unless you wanted research agreements.

Last edited by Wraith; May 23, 2016 @ 5:39pm

Sohei

May 23, 2016 @ 5:38pm

Originally posted by Wraith:
You just mean you have a negative modifier for relative strength, right? That's to be expected in this game. Anything less than -100 probably means you're doing pretty well, and you don't really need to worry about it.

I'm not even sure more than that is a problem, unless you wanted research agreements. I've never seen or heard of vassals actually rebelling.

No, the relative strength modifier is separate. That is only -20 or something like that since they are my only vassal and are much weaker than I am. The threat modifier is like -180.

Last edited by Sohei; May 23, 2016 @ 5:38pm

Wraith

May 23, 2016 @ 5:39pm

Originally posted by Sohei:
No, the relative strength modifier is separate. That is only -20 or something like that since they are my only vassal and are much weaker than I am. The threat modifier is like -180.

Sorry, that was directed at suksas, not you.

#10

suksas

May 23, 2016 @ 5:40pm

Originally posted by Wraith:
Originally posted by suksas:
Was wrong. He is strong enough in naval and technology
You just mean you have a negative modifier for relative strength, right? That's to be expected in this game. Anything less than -100 probably means you're doing pretty well, and you don't really need to worry about it.

I'm not even sure more than that is a problem, unless you wanted research agreements.

I'm just worried he will rebel if I go to war against any other heavy hitters in the game.
And thats the only option left for me now if I want to progress.or wait two hundred years to integrate him and hope Scrouge kills off other empires for me.

#11

Sohei

May 23, 2016 @ 5:40pm

Originally posted by Wraith:
Sorry, that was directed at suksas, not you.

I just noticed that, My bad.

Last edited by Sohei; May 23, 2016 @ 5:42pm

#12

Wraith

May 23, 2016 @ 5:49pm

Originally posted by suksas:
Originally posted by Wraith:
You just mean you have a negative modifier for relative strength, right? That's to be expected in this game. Anything less than -100 probably means you're doing pretty well, and you don't really need to worry about it.

I'm not even sure more than that is a problem, unless you wanted research agreements.

I'm just worried he will rebel if I go to war against any other heavy hitters in the game.
And thats the only option left for me now if I want to progress.or wait two hundred years to integrate him and hope Scrouge kills off other empires for me.

How low is it? I've gone to war with vassals that had a total of -160 opinion of me, and I've never had a rebellion. You'll probably be okay, and you can even use the AI's follow-the-leader fleet behavior to get some of his fleets wiped out, to reduce the relative power malus.

#13