Materialists getting psionics?

[Celestial Tesla]

I am playing fanatic materialists. I have read that the only way for materialists to get psionics. Is for them to get a psionic scientist. But i have read people saying they have never gotten a psionic scientist as a materialist. So does anyone know if it is possible for materialists to get a psionic scientist (or any reliable way for them to get psionics)?

[Malecord]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von zanaikin:

It is possible to have a scientist to have the psionic trait as a hiring option

-.-'

If you actually read the thread you would know that this is not possible unless you previously researched "psionic theory" technology.

And the only way to get "psionic theory" as a research option is to have a psi scientist working on biology.

Which means that the only actual method the unlock the tech branch is to unlock the trait by sending a scientist on a science ship and have him:

-leveling up (it's unclear what the odds are)
-research a certain anomaly that nobody could provide the name of (100% if you get the anomaly that is)
-make an emergency FTL jump (unclear if there are also other requirements for this to work or if is just luck)

[zanaikin]

I got sick of reading all the posts arguing over what materialism actually is =p

I remember seeing that trait on a scientist one at the beginning of a game... so, unless someone actually checked the script (which means my memories are playing tricks again)

[Malecord]

leader_trait_expertise_psionics = {
cost = 1
modification = no
icon = "gfx/interface/icons/traits/leader_traits/leader_trait_expertise_psionics.dds"
modifier = {
category_psionics_research_speed_mult = @categorybonus
}
leader_trait = yes
leader_class = { scientist }
prerequisites = { tech_psionic_theory }
opposites = {
"leader_trait_expertise_materials"
"leader_trait_expertise_rocketry"
"leader_trait_expertise_voidcraft"
"leader_trait_expertise_industry"
"leader_trait_expertise_field_manipulation"
"leader_trait_expertise_particles"
"leader_trait_expertise_computing"
"leader_trait_expertise_new_worlds"
"leader_trait_expertise_statecraft"
"leader_trait_expertise_biology"
"leader_trait_expertise_military_theory"
}

[Manic]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Malecord:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Zubenelgenubi:

Then he would no longer be a materialist. The revelation might even cause him to become a revolutionary or something.

How the hell would dealing with something observable and measurable make you stop being materialist?

Materialism is a philosophy that states all things that exist are material, and nothing immaterial (spiritual/supernatural) exists.

Spiritualism as a general term is a belief that the material/observable universe derives from supernatural/spiritual sources. The word "supernatural" means outside of or beyond nature.

Anything spiritual is non-material, and therefore cannot be measured or studied by material means (material means cannot study things that exist outside of its purview, which is what supernatural things are). So if a materialist witnesses something that defies his materialist point of view, he would be more likely to act like a sceptic and try to explain away his observation, relegating it to some not understood physical processes, or some sort of trick, or mis-perception, and so on.

[Radene]

The problem here is that it's just worded badly. Even a fanatic materialist would want to research something that comes across as "space magic", but obviously works for those spiritualist fools. So maybe there's something going for it that we overlooked. So we better look into it.

[Malecord]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Manic:

Anything spiritual is non-material, and therefore cannot be measured or studied by material means

I don't think you get the point.

Nobody here wants to argue what spiritualism is IRL. My point is that in Stellaris Sci-Fi, psi is a real "material thing", not a "spiritual thing".

Enemy psi warriors can "materially damage"the brains of your soldiers. And their psi navigators can "materially teleport" fleets wherever they want in the galaxy.

And I'd say that both are very observable and very measurable phenomenons. It just defies logic that materialist would deny/ignore these phenomenons as they regularly happen in the galaxy.

[Astasia]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Mistfox:

Guys, topic derail?

Ursprünglich geschrieben von zanaikin:

Wow this thread has gone off topic.

The OP's question was answered in the first few replies, there is no more "on topic." There's no harm in the discussion switching to game balance and interpretations of the game "lore."

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Malecord:

It just defies logic that materialist would deny/ignore these phenomenons as they regularly happen in the galaxy.

It's not really "regularly happening." It's mostly late game tech that makes it "visible," and it's still extremely rare for any ethos other than spiritualists. Perhaps the first few encounters it's percieved as a "trick" of some sort, and again it's not impossible for materialists to figure out it's a real thing and open the research wide open for them.

[Coffee Fox]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von CelestialSlayer:

No it's for spiritualists only.

Nope, I've gotten Psionic tech before as a fanatical materialist.

It annoys me that most psionic tech is for spiritualists though - Which is stupid. A scientist, if he saw someone using 'mind powers' would immediately try and figure out how they work. If anything, materialists nations should have a similar, but lesser chance for psionic techs compared to spiritualists.

That would take away the individuality though, I guess.

[Malecord]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Astasia:

It's not really "regularly happening." It's mostly late game tech that makes it "visible," and it's still extremely rare for any ethos other than spiritualists. Perhaps the first few encounters it's percieved as a "trick" of some sort, and again it's not impossible for materialists to figure out it's a real thing and open the research wide open for them.

Yeah well... I was talking about late game when psionics are everywhere in the Galaxy.

I'm not in any way against the early game restriction. It actually adds a lot to the story telling and I like it.

[Zubenelgenubi]

I'm afraid it's a deal breaker for me if materialists get the best of both worlds and spiritualists are just left with their happiness bonus to set them apart.

[robot650]

A quick online search found the answer, haven't tested yet, but it seems plausible. It goes as follows:
"There is a guaranteed method to get Psionics as any ethos.

1. Survey Ocean worlds (you're looking for the anomaly Drops in the Ocean).
2. Survey Black Holes (you're looking for the anomaly Rainbow in the Dark).
3. Do the anomaly Rainbow in the Dark with any Scientist (though ideally, one that doesn't have 4. Paranoid or Maniacal). You can get the Paranoid trait from this anomaly.
5. Do the Drops in the Ocean anomaly from earlier, with the Paranoid scientist you just got.
6. Choose the Paranoid dialog options, once your Scientist gains the Maniacal trait you'll know you succeeded.
7. Wait about a week in game. You will get an alert that your Scientist is now a Psionics Expert.
Cheat method:

1. add_anomaly HOLE_RADIATION_CAT
2. add_anomaly WAT_PLANET_CAT
3. Do the two anomalies you just added to planets in the order you added them."

(Reference http://gaming.stackexchange.com/questions/265744/how-to-get-a-scientist-with-psionics-expertise/266411)

I would assume for the cheat method you would select a planet, open the console, then type in one of the commands, then use it again on a different planet, or the same one after you finish the first anomaly

EDIT: After testing, I have concluded that this does, in fact work. It may take a bit to get the correct responses from analyzing the anomalies, but it will, eventually, work.
It should also be noted that I don't believe you NEED to do the black hole anomaly before the water planet anomaly. I'm certain that so long as you use a scientist with the "Paranoid" trait to research the water planet anomaly, it will probably work just the same.

[suksas]

Are psionic soldiers a part of psionic tech? I remember getting thouse late mid game as Fanatic Materialist Pacifist.

[adobo]

1st Psi tech gives Psi commando attachment. 2nd Psi tech gives psi army. 3rd psi tech gives psi comp for ships. Last psi tech is jump drive.

[AnneFrankFanfiction]

I'm a little puzzled at why materialists would be precluded from studying psyonics.

I mean if, hypothetically, psychic powers were a real thing, then there would be some material cause for it that could be studied the same way all other natural phenomena can. Or is it canon in the game that psychic powers are purely magic and don't have a real cause? Because if that's the case it seems weird that it's something that can be researched.

[MeatPopsicle]

I saw on the forums that you can get psionics from a maniac scientist that does special research projects from planets. It gets a paranoid trait and then eventually turns into psionics.

Can't find the link, will try and find it and post back later for anyone who's interested.