How do people develop so fast in the early game?

[Xaphnir]

I've played this game a lot, but one thing I've never figured out is how people develop so fast where they're saying you should have stuff like 10k fleet power and 1k research by 2240. That's never been an issue for me before, but suddenly in the last few days I've been trying to start a new game but every single time I face an existential threat in the first 40 years where I'm being invaded with 10k+ fleet power. And this is on late game scaling difficulty, so the AI's not getting much in the way of bonuses at this point.

Generally, I can't even start building research labs until around 2220 without going heavily into consumer goods, energy or mineral deficit (depending on whether I'm playing regular, machine, or hive mind). Even 500 is beyond what I'm usually at by that point. And then to do that while also producing enough alloys to make a fleet of several thousand or more fleet power by 2240? I don't even see how that's possible.

Are there some little tricks that I'm missing? Do you normally fish for exception RNG on your starts? Are there only certain origins capable of doing this? What are the key things to do to develop this quickly?

[BigTurnip]

What exactly are you doing at the start of the game that's stopping you from building a science building until 2020.

The only builds that probably should SLIGHTLY delay science are hive's as they are better off building science buildings on there first colony to get the -20% and then -40% (after discovery)mineral upkeep reduction and they unlike normal empires can build alloys on their capital and benefit from higher stability + capital output bonus especially when combined with synapse drone stability boosts.

[Cinnamoon_dragon]

8 - 10k fleet in 2240 is realistic. Your second guaranteed habitable planet must be industrial, build your first alloy foundry as soon as possible, buy the necessary resources on the market monthly. Fortresses greatly increase your fleet cap, put down one fortress on every of your worlds.

[Xaphnir]

Originally posted by BigTurnip:

What exactly are you doing at the start of the game that's stopping you from building a science building until 2020.

Well, yeah, I can get one science building. But anything more than that and I'll hit shortages.

Originally posted by Static-ghost:

8 - 10k fleet in 2240 is realistic. Your second guaranteed habitable planet must be industrial, build your first alloy foundry as soon as possible, buy the necessary resources on the market monthly. Fortresses greatly increase your fleet cap, put down one fortress on every of your worlds.

I mean, I know it's realistic, because I see people talking about it like it's routine. I just don't understand what I'm supposed to do. And I do make my second guaranteed world focus on industrial sectors. I just never seem to have enough pops for my planets to be producing much of anything by that point, even if I take traits to increase pop growth. My latest one, I had I think 7 planets colonized by 2230. But most of those had pops working just coordinator and replicator jobs, enough maintenance drones to keep positive amenities (with the trait that increase amenity output), and maybe one or two jobs beyond that. I think only my first two planets beyond my capital were significantly developed. For machine empires and hive minds, should I be forgoing machine assembly plants/spawning pools? Should I run negative amenities?

[Razorblade]

Originally posted by Xaphnir:

Originally posted by BigTurnip:

What exactly are you doing at the start of the game that's stopping you from building a science building until 2020.

Well, yeah, I can get one science building. But anything more than that and I'll hit shortages.

Originally posted by Static-ghost:

8 - 10k fleet in 2240 is realistic. Your second guaranteed habitable planet must be industrial, build your first alloy foundry as soon as possible, buy the necessary resources on the market monthly. Fortresses greatly increase your fleet cap, put down one fortress on every of your worlds.

I mean, I know it's realistic, because I see people talking about it like it's routine. I just don't understand what I'm supposed to do. And I do make my second guaranteed world focus on industrial sectors. I just never seem to have enough pops for my planets to be producing much of anything by that point, even if I take traits to increase pop growth. My latest one, I had I think 7 planets colonized by 2230. But most of those had pops working just coordinator and replicator jobs, enough maintenance drones to keep positive amenities (with the trait that increase amenity output), and maybe one or two jobs beyond that. I think only my first two planets beyond my capital were significantly developed. For machine empires and hive minds, should I be forgoing machine assembly plants/spawning pools? Should I run negative amenities?

You may be over-expanding, leading to most of your Pops working unproductive jobs that only serve to keep your planets afloat, rather than expanding your economy. Filling your home planet with mostly Labs in its building slots and Industrial Districts in its District slots should give you reasonably close to the output you're looking for, without any Pops wasted on unproductive jobs, and without resources being wasted on an excess number of Colony Ships or upkeep for unproductive Colony pops.

It should also be noted that running a deficit economy in the early game isn't a terrible idea; just don't run such a deficit that your Minerals become more expensive to buy on the Market than the sale price of your Alloys, for example.

Starbases can also be a fantastic resource, especially as a Gestalt empire. Solar Panels in the top slots, and Hydroponics Bays in the bottom can bankroll your Food and Energy upkeep, as well as fund the purchase of Minerals, while you can dedicate your planets to creating Advanced Resources with their Districts and Building Slots.

[Jarlaf]

Sounds like its mostly build order and/or expansion rate (Could be too slow or too fast). More play time with a bit of experimentation early game to tweek things. There's a lot of mid-/advanced level tutorials online as well as game play thru that could help you out. The play thru is where I'd start, See what they may be doing different in general.

[Cinnamoon_dragon]

Originally posted by Xaphnir:

My latest one, I had I think 7 planets colonized by 2230

7 is too much, 3 - 4 planets at the beginning of the game is enough. If you are playing as a machine civilization then yes you want to colonize more worlds for more Machine assembly factories

[Metal]

Originally posted by Static-ghost:

Originally posted by Xaphnir:

My latest one, I had I think 7 planets colonized by 2230

7 is too much, 3 - 4 planets at the beginning of the game is enough. If you are playing as a machine civilization then yes you want to colonize more worlds for more Machine assembly factories

Sometimes i get only 1 planet, strugle is real. I got about 10~ or so planets at end.

[Cinnamoon_dragon]

Originally posted by Metal:

Originally posted by Static-ghost:

7 is too much, 3 - 4 planets at the beginning of the game is enough. If you are playing as a machine civilization then yes you want to colonize more worlds for more Machine assembly factories

Sometimes i get only 1 planet, strugle is real. I got about 10~ or so planets at end.

1 is not enough. Ideally you want to immediately colonize 2 of your guaranteed habitable planets nearby. And then another one that will have a bonus modifier to research. If you are lucky, Wenkwort Gardens is a good one. If you are locked up and surrounded by foreign impire, conquer your neighbor before he builds his fleet and fortifies.

[Metal]

Originally posted by Static-ghost:

Originally posted by Metal:

Sometimes i get only 1 planet, strugle is real. I got about 10~ or so planets at end.

1 is not enough. Ideally you want to immediately colonize 2 of your guaranteed habitable planets nearby. And then another one that will have a bonus modifier to research. If you are lucky, Wenkwort Gardens is a good one. If you are locked up and surrounded by foreign impire, conquer your neighbor before he builds his fleet and fortifies.

Hold on your horses. Did you actualy read what i wrote? I got about about 10 or so planets at the end

[Cinnamoon_dragon]

Originally posted by Metal:

Hold on your horses. Did you actualy read what i wrote? I got about about 10 or so planets at the end :steamsunny:

Yes. At the end, beat the crap out of the neighboring Fallen empire. They have a huge number of pops - your future workers.

[auctorpretiosafacit]

Although these fleet/research numbers you mentioned are fairly achievable, you have to consider that some people who are posting here are playing multiplayer which is generally played at a faster tech gain rate so that the session is over faster. Obviously this results in faster resource gain etc with the right techs, and bigger fleets faster.

Also in a singleplayer session things work out differently (multiplayer often has a 30 year peace treaty, which results in you being able to focus on production and forego defense until just before the treaty expires)

The way you go about things really varies between single or multiplayer.

I don't want to write a wall without knowing which angle you're coming from

[Elitewrecker PT]

Originally posted by Metal:

Originally posted by Static-ghost:

7 is too much, 3 - 4 planets at the beginning of the game is enough. If you are playing as a machine civilization then yes you want to colonize more worlds for more Machine assembly factories

Sometimes i get only 1 planet, strugle is real. I got about 10~ or so planets at end.

10 at the end of the game?

[yuzhonglu]

You need to use top builds to get 1k research, 10k fleet power by 2230. Clone Army/ Techno-Necro/ Overtuned.

[Xaphnir]

Originally posted by auctorpretiosafacit:

Although these fleet/research numbers you mentioned are fairly achievable, you have to consider that some people who are posting here are playing multiplayer which is generally played at a faster tech gain rate so that the session is over faster. Obviously this results in faster resource gain etc with the right techs, and bigger fleets faster.

Also in a singleplayer session things work out differently (multiplayer often has a 30 year peace treaty, which results in you being able to focus on production and forego defense until just before the treaty expires)

The way you go about things really varies between single or multiplayer.

I don't want to write a wall without knowing which angle you're coming from

This is single player, but I do play on .75 tech/tradition cost.

[yuzhonglu]

Techno Necro is the easiest to play. In the first 20 years, build all of the mineral and energy districts in your two conquered primitive worlds and all the research/ industry buildings in your capital. Spam research centers on your primitive worlds after the stability malus disappears.

Technocracy/ masterful crafters. Very straight forward.