dark matter drawing

[Brady]

i know you need the tech, but this is a science question. How would anyone ever collect dark matter? dark matter isn't something you can collect. it's invisible and it can't interact with really anything. so how would this work?

[marmotte18]

Dark matter is the absence of photons, basicaly dark matter is some molecules without photons passing through it, in the game they got the technology to keep these molecules ''protect'' from photons.

How this technology work ?

I don't have any idea.

-
But I have a theory that the limit of the univers (the limit we can see), is expending through nothing right ?, but what if the ''nothing'' is the dark matter of black holes and when the ''limit'' of the univers pass through, it break the black matter into photons, and when there's too much photons that ''hit'' each other it create black holes, like when suns explode or colapse, that mean black matter is an object , scientist know that behond the visible limit of the univers there's a mass, it's mathematically proven that there's something and it's black matter, and by extracting the black matter from the black holes with some unknown technology (probably the contrary of using polarize glasses), it's the same thing as trying to catch light.

[PlutonArioch]

What kind of answer do you expect to get to this question on a game forum?
We don't even know what dark matter really is, we just theorize it exists because we can observe its effects, as if it were matter, but have not observed the matter that has the effect yet, so we called it dark matter. We don't know what uses it has, how to use it, much less how to gather it. How could we if we don't even know for sure that it exists? It could still be just a fundamental misunderstanding of physics.

[Ryika]

"This exotic substance has many properties that seemingly defy the laws of physics. Harvestable concentrations can only be found near Black Holes or in certain nebulas."

...you go to a place where there's enough of it and draw it out. Easy!

[mss73055]

You wipe it with a tissue, just like other places where the sun doesn't shine.

[Theutus]

The term dark matter is filler language for the unknown. They know something exists that is influencing gravity, they don't know what it is, they call it dark matter.

The reason we can collect dark matter in a sci-fi game is... because it's a sci-fi game.

[mss73055]

It is matter, as this "something's" density varies with the third power of distance.
As opposed to the density of energy, what varies with the fourth power of distance. This is the prime difference between energy and matter.

It is dark, because it at least doesn't interact using the electromagnetic mechanism.

[Orion Invictus]

Dark matter is a theoretical substance that bends space without interacting with electromagnetic energy (light). It's undetectable except by the gravitational lensing effect it causes (basically makes everything look like you've got a giant magnifying glass).

Occam's Razor naturally leads to the conclusion that it has no other "abnormal" properties beyond what we've observed, so we should just be able to mine it the same way we can any other type of matter. Of course, that's incredibly simplistic and most likely wrong.

Originally posted by marmotte18:

scientist know that behond the visible limit of the univers there's a mass, it's mathematically proven that there's something

That's not true. Anyone who tells you they know with 100% certainty what's beyond the visible universe is lying. It's literally undetectable.

[mss73055]

The universe at large is boring, It is the same stuff all over the place.

Supposed it wraps around in all directions, and as we understand it expanded, while we also see no repeating patterns, one can travel at least 250 times farther into the same stuff like we see around us.

[VïkådïN]

Originally posted by Brady:

i know you need the tech, but this is a science question. How would anyone ever collect dark matter? dark matter isn't something you can collect. it's invisible and it can't interact with really anything. so how would this work?

Firstly, ignore this as it is completely WRONG and inaccurate \/

Originally posted by mss73055:

The universe at large is boring, It is the same stuff all over the place.

Supposed it wraps around in all directions, and as we understand it expanded, while we also see no repeating patterns, one can travel at least 250 times farther into the same stuff like we see around us.

Short answer:Siphon dark energy or equivalent power source, E=mc2 it into matter, make the matter hyper dense with insane mass for small area = dark matter fuel pellet. Convert pellet back into energy used to create it via e=mc2

Long answer. Hope you have as much fun reading as I did writing

Everyone here is giving you misinformation.

Dark Energy can be defined as the energy which is driving the expansion of our universe. Think of the universe as a loaf of bread with raisins. The raisins are galaxies held together by local gravity. As the bread bakes, and rises and grows, all the raisins get further and further apart even though the raisins themselves don't expand. We can and have proved this mathematically, and have even proven it will not rubber band back (a theory in the 90's) and that it is continuing to accelerate alarmingly rapidly. We have even calculated a 'day' when all the galaxies will be so far apart and so spread out that every species in every galaxy, when they look out, will see nothing and believe they are completely alone. The reality will be that everything is accelerating away from them too fast for them to see it, at least with EMF, x ray etc that we use. This also means that eventually, in several hundred trillion years, everything will be so spread out and far away from eachother that heat and light will be outrun and not able to travel across space, and then everything will become the same temperature and die a slow, cold, heat-death. Assuming black holes don't speed up, devour the whole universe, and re-start a new big-bang style universe creation, which could be how the whole universe functions forever. It could actually be that black holes are the "entities" in our universe, and that stars and everything made from star-stuff is just food they eat and when all the food is gone and the last black hole has devoured everything maybe it implodes, explodes out the other end and all it's eaten is spewed back out into a new big bang.. My personal pet theory. I digress. Dark energy exists, and is most simply understood as "the force which is blowing the universe out and away from itself". It's the baking in the oven.

Dark matter is known to exist because we can mathematically calculate how much mass an object should have based on the orbits we see them take in our solar system. Newton, who invented calculus for this purpose, realised that there was 'missing mass' required in order for the calculations to match observations, but since observations are evidence and the math seems to work correctly in every testable circumstance, the missing mass was a mystery. Newton said it was god and that was that because monotheism is a mind virus that destroys critical thinking and stunts scientific advancement. However,

During the first world war a mathematician who was calculating trajectories in his spare time named Karl Schwarzschild on the front lines hypothetically proved using mathematics that a black hole could exist. He never got to flesh out the idea but I believe his son did. So the idea of a mass in space creating intense gravitational pull strong enough to pull in light (Karl did these calculations a few weeks after Albert Einstein published his papers on gravitational physics and relativity. The idea of 'riding a beam of light'.)

Steven Hawking first made larger inroads into scientific mainstream with black holes by writing a book, which had some gaping physics flaws I won't get into, and while being adamant he was right for years, somebody finally managed to get through his head WHY he was wrong, and he revised his books and his theories to fit in more with how we understand black holes today.

This was catapulted leaps and bounds forward in the last few years when almost by sheer impossible luck, we managed to build a machine capable of detecting gravitational waves in space-time. This is confusing if you're still of the elementary school ideas of SPACE and TIME as two separate things, but any physicist worth their salt knows that the fabric of reality is "spacetime" and it is essentially a single sheet. I won't get into my personal theories of how this means "time travel" would be as simple as "changing the expansion of the universe to a specific volume" or that by changing the rate of expansion of the universe, you could travel through time to the specific point where it was exactly that expanded.. I digress. Back to the machine... It managed to detect two supermassive black holes coming into contact with one eating the other like cookie monster and throwing cookie-crumb-energy-waves called Gamma Ray Bursts into the universe, which are many times more powerful than the big bang (Yes, the math on how black holes have seemingly more energy than was present at the expansion of the universe is fascinating but again I won't get into it here and digress too much.) You can look up the 'sound' this made, it's a short "weeeeeeEEEEOOOP-POP" when we ran it through computers, and is literally the sound of space-time itself shuddering like a bedsheet with the earth-quake-like effects of the two black holes colliding.

Now, the BEST way to get energy out of a black hole would be to build a reflective box that shot things NEAR the event horizon but not INTO it and would be accelerated by the gravity and flung out the other side, where we could siphon off the new velocity as energy. There is a neat video I will link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ulCdoCfw-bY
It's important to note we have come to understand black holes as not a singular point or a ball, but a ring with a hole in the middle. Like a drain. It's also important to note they are almost all spinning very rapidly, just like the stars they were made of were usually spinning rapidly when they went supernova. Fun fact, any star 10x larger than Sol (our sun) or more will ALWAYS create a black hole when it collapses. There is also a super massive black hole at the center of every galaxy. We now have the ability to "see" (or rather, detect gravitational disturbance with machines and record the sky and model the empty space to show us what is there based on what we cannot detect. Very neat stuff.)

But you're asking about dark matter, not energy harvesting or the in-game matter decompressor farming debris off the event horizon. The hard answer is "We don't know" but since that's all science for all time, I'll tell you how close we are, as I understand it.

First, there is negative matter which you seem to call dark matter, which may not be the same as dark matter (or may be related). This is matter which has negative charges instead of positive. Not only can we make small bits of this in the lab, but because it violently reacts with any type of positive matter, (which is EVERYTHING we know of and use and are made of) it's difficult to store or handle for even nano-seconds. This is likely what science fiction uses as "anti-matter" and science indicates that MOST of the universe is actually made up of anti-matter, not matter as we know it. This is fascinating because it raises billions more questions than it answers, and we can't even imagine how chaotic and insane it must be on the edges where anti matter and matter meet. But whatever the case, the idea that space is uniformly the same no matter where we go is not only wrong, it's stupid. We get materials and minerals from outside our solar system which do not match materials here on earth, ad that's just from the oort cloud. The universe is probably so much more extreme and incredible than we could even imagine from our tiny little backwater perspective on the far-flung tip of our far-flung backwater galaxy. It's literally HUGE out there. I highly doubt it's the same everywhere when even islands on our own planet have been known to be bereft of iron. Any element heavier than Iron is only formed when a star goes super nova, so gold, platinum, silver, all the precious metals are all formed by a star's death. The dispersion of those materials probably varies incredibly over the universe. And since stars are born in batches, it's likely there are different "batches" or "biomes" in the universe ourside our galaxy.

Back to dark matter. It's about the math. The math indicates we are only able to perceive a limited spectrum of what is going on. You could even imagine our entire universe as a pool table where every force and material we know of is a ball on the table. We all agree that no matter how chaotic the break (provided no foul IE ball flies off table) everything stays on the table of our universe. But the sound of the break does not. It reverberates off the table and into the room, and if we were to measure it on the table it would be only a fraction of the total sound waves. So if we were to measure sound waves JUST on the table and run the math on the collision of the break (which is a metaphor for the large hadron collider) we would find missing values for the sound that left the table. The table is our universe. The sound is gravity.

All the forces we know of, namely EMF, strong nuclear, weak nuclear, and gravitational, gravity is the weakest. It seems also, however, to be the only force that spans the literal entire length of the literal entire universe. By which I mean, an apple on earth is gravitating towards a rock on the opposite side of the universe, and that rock on the opposite side of the universe is pulling on an apple on earth. The force is so weak we can't REALLY measure it, but in the frictionless environment of space even single atoms and molecules pull together because they inflict gravitational pull on one another. Gravity, when we smash particles together, 'leaks' off our pool table universe and into the space of the room around. Now, WHAT that space in the room around IS MADE OF we have NO IDEA. But we can tell, thanks to the missing gravity, that it exists. And not only does it exist, but it's positions and masses or whatever values it has, have an effect on us here in our universe. We measure that force by "mass" or sometimes "density" but essentially what we're doing is using the weight here on earth with our gravity calculated with the size of the object to come up with a number that would have a very high density per small unit of size.

If we were able to somehow take that energy that exists as gravitational mass, and convert it into matter via E=MC^2 (the basis for replicators on star-trek and the light, the idea that mass and energy are interchangeable. That you could put energy in and make mass, or you could use mass to create energy. A super advanced form of "I burn wood, wood makes heat energy" to over simplify it) that would be dark matter. It would be a VERY heavy, VERY dense, though likely very SMALL piece of matter that you could think of as a battery. Futurama does a great job of showing Nibbler's poop as dark matter which fuels their space ships; it is very small and very dense but because of that can be converted back into equal energy.

So to understand dark matter you have to understand mass, density, gravity, and e=mc^2 (energy is equal to the mass of the object times acceleration at the speed of light squared.) and imagine them coming together to create a super dense fuel source which could then be converted back into energy. This could be in the form of a 'gravity laser' in a lab which hypothetically converts the seemingly infinite dark energy of the "room" outside our table (this energy is the driving force for the expansion of the universe and seems limitless to us despite likely not being truly infinite) and use the dark energy to 'paint' superdense particles into a sheet, or a ball, or a block, which could then be plugged in or 'incinerated' like fuel to re-use that energy elsewhere. So maybe a gravitational lense on a black hole installation outside the event horizon manufactures these dark-matter materials in the vacuum of space where they can still be moved in lower gravity, the dark matter pellets or batteries are then transported where they are needed in the empire, and the stored energy is released just like the stored solar energy that converts carbon in the air into wood can be released when burned. It would all come down to a simple matter of energy conversion into super dense materials.

[grubygrubas]

ok

[VïkådïN]

Originally posted by PlutonArioch:

What kind of answer do you expect to get to this question on a game forum?
We don't even know what dark matter really is, we just theorize it exists because we can observe its effects, as if it were matter, but have not observed the matter that has the effect yet, so we called it dark matter. We don't know what uses it has, how to use it, much less how to gather it. How could we if we don't even know for sure that it exists? It could still be just a fundamental misunderstanding of physics.

The kind that I gave: heavily academic and over-analysed with just enough imagination to explain how we MIGHT be able to do that in the reasonably near future. Anti-matter was once science fiction, now we make it in a lab. It was the plot point to the Angels and Demons movie with Tom Hanks, it's gotten so mainstream. Dark-energy is mathematically proven as the expansion force in the universe. Dark matter is just around the corner, just like cold fusion with Thorium reactors is not a pipe-dream but possible if the establishment would stop covering it up to make money.

[VïkådïN]

Originally posted by Orion Invictus:

Dark matter is a theoretical substance that bends space without interacting with electromagnetic energy (light). It's undetectable except by the gravitational lensing effect it causes (basically makes everything look like you've got a giant magnifying glass).

Occam's Razor naturally leads to the conclusion that it has no other "abnormal" properties beyond what we've observed, so we should just be able to mine it the same way we can any other type of matter. Of course, that's incredibly simplistic and most likely wrong.

Originally posted by marmotte18:

scientist know that behond the visible limit of the univers there's a mass, it's mathematically proven that there's something

That's not true. Anyone who tells you they know with 100% certainty what's beyond the visible universe is lying. It's literally undetectable.

This whole thing is just wrong. Ignore it all. Literally the whole thing is WRONG.

Edit: Dark Matter does not bend space. EMF (Electromagnetic frequency) includes magnetism and is not limited to light, certainly not to VISIBLE light on the spectrum. You are incorrectly confusing gravitational lensing (like how space appears distorted when we view a black hole) with dark energy (the expansion force of the universe). And it DOES NOT look like a magnifying glass, that is the STUPIDEST explanation I have ever heard, it shows us the BACK SIDE of the object, and it;s TOP and BOTTOM curved around a single point in space based on our relative viewing position. Don't EVER use Occam's Razor, are you a pseudo-scientific religious politician? And are you now saying you could "Mine" "dark energy" WTF are you even saying???? Do we MINE sunlight?

"its literally undetectable if I can't see it with visible light" how do you think we proved black holes, GENIUS?!?!?! Just... Go read a book or something, please.

[Salami Tsunami]

I'm guessing that scientists in the 1700s had no idea how to refine plutonium. And yet, here we are.

[Xaphnir]

Originally posted by VïkådïN:

I doubt your reading comprehension was capable of digesting half of that, but since you're ether too stupid or too lazy to refute it I guess I can just ignore you like a fart on the wind. <3

You're acting as if we know:
-what dark matter and dark energy are
-you can convert dark matter to dark energy and vice-versa
-it's possible to extract usable energy from dark energy

None of these are known. Maybe they're possible, but we do not know the exact nature of dark matter or dark energy.

You also claimed matter with negative mass (I assume that's what you mean by negative matter) exists, when it's hypothetical, at best.

And this doesn't even scratch the surface on the factual inaccuracies, relativistic woo and pop-science bs that your post is filled with.

Also

Originally posted by VïkådïN:

Edit: Dark Matter does not bend space.

Yes it does the entire reason we even know it exists is because we can observe its gravitational influence on other bodies.

[Orion Invictus]

Originally posted by VïkådïN:

Originally posted by Orion Invictus:

Dark matter is a theoretical substance that bends space without interacting with electromagnetic energy (light). It's undetectable except by the gravitational lensing effect it causes (basically makes everything look like you've got a giant magnifying glass).

Occam's Razor naturally leads to the conclusion that it has no other "abnormal" properties beyond what we've observed, so we should just be able to mine it the same way we can any other type of matter. Of course, that's incredibly simplistic and most likely wrong.


That's not true. Anyone who tells you they know with 100% certainty what's beyond the visible universe is lying. It's literally undetectable.

This whole thing is just wrong. Ignore it all. Literally the whole thing is WRONG.

Edit: Dark Matter does not bend space. EMF (Electromagnetic frequency) includes magnetism and is not limited to light, certainly not to VISIBLE light on the spectrum. You are incorrectly confusing gravitational lensing (like how space appears distorted when we view a black hole) with dark energy (the expansion force of the universe). And it DOES NOT look like a magnifying glass, that is the STUPIDEST explanation I have ever heard, it shows us the BACK SIDE of the object, and it;s TOP and BOTTOM curved around a single point in space based on our relative viewing position. Don't EVER use Occam's Razor, are you a pseudo-scientific religious politician? And are you now saying you could "Mine" "dark energy" WTF are you even saying???? Do we MINE sunlight?

"its literally undetectable if I can't see it with visible light" how do you think we proved black holes, GENIUS?!?!?! Just... Go read a book or something, please.

I'm a physicist and simplified it for the sake of what I'm guessing are (mostly) laymen readers. What are your qualifications?

PS: Dark Energy isn't the same thing as Dark Matter.