Early War

[Jaxtaboxl]

Hi im new ot the game, and im not really sure how to handle early conflicts, and im not finding much specific info online. I browsed alot through the internet and only found posts about early war being really hard, because of how strong the starports are early on and that if you want to fight early you should just ignore starports and invade their planets and also hit mining stations to cripple their resources. The problem is that i can't attack anything in the enemys system without my ships going into battle vs the starports, so how are you supposed to ignore them? Maybe it has something to do with the battle ai on the ships that cause them to just fight the ports? (its the first one that says that they just fly in and attack). But yeah no idea how to go about this and also if I want to completly take over the enemys territory, do I need to lay claim on all their systems?

[MissedHurry]

Well, a couple of things.

You have to take over the starports in order to get that territory, no matter what.

If either you or the empire you are fighting is considered an imminent threat (like a determined exterminator or a devouring swarm) then you don't have to make claims to get the territory. Otherwise, yes you have to spend influence points to make claims on the star systems you want, then declare war for the claims, and send fleets to conquer those systems. Once you can settle for a status quo with that empire (they never really surrender until you take all their territory and planets), then you will get the systems you took over and had claims on.

You need weapons upgrades and lots of alloys so early in the game you should be making buildings and focusing on techs that boost research and alloys (well the building upgrade for the alloy plant).

If your fleet are a lot weaker than the other empires in the early game, you can sometimes stave off an invasion by giving them gifts (in trade) of food and consumer goods (sometimes minerals), to earn opinion points so they like you better.

[tempest.of.emptiness]

To keep a system after the war you will need to have claimed it (usually, see below). You don't need to claim all of their systems, but any that you don't claim will revert back to their control. This is true of conquest wars, and true of some other types of war that end in a status quo peace. The big exception is a total war, which is typically one that involves a genocidal enemy. In those wars, full control of a system changes hands immediately when the system is fully taken by force, and no claims are necessary.

Claiming systems is less expensive before the war starts, but it also alerts your enemy that you intend to attack. That will usually prompt them to improve their defenses, so just be aware of that. Depending on circumstances it might be better to make your claims during the war, provided you will have enough influence to claim the systems you want.

Stellaris has gone through many changes as new versions have been released, so keep in mind when you read about the game online (especially about strategy) that some of the things you find may no longer apply. Now every system has a star base, but that was not always true. Also, typically there is no longer any point to attacking mining or research stations. Those changes may render invalid the strategy you've read about.

Most systems will just have a basic star base (an outpost). These are not very dangerous, even in the early game, and you probably don't need to avoid fighting them. In fact, because you have to defeat the outpost in order to take control of a system, only in a strictly defensive war might you ever avoid fighting them entirely.

More advanced star bases can be dangerous, particularly if there is a friendly fleet guarding them. Depending on circumstances you may be able to avoid their systems entirely, sticking to the less-well-defended systems that only have outposts. If you do have to fight a base other than an outpost, make sure your fleet power is stronger than the base and that there are no friendly fleets in the system before you attack it. If there is a fleet there, try to draw it away by defeating enemy outposts, and then attack the fleet while it is in another system (assuming your fleet is stronger, of course).

If you want to enter a system without fighting the enemy star base or fleets automatically, then your fleet stance is key. The default stance will not engage enemies until they get close (where "close" is determined by the weapon range of the ships in the two fleets), and that is the stance you would want to use. The stance you appear to be describing is the aggressive stance, and a fleet in that stance will automatically move toward any hostiles in the system in order to start a fight. So to be able to potentially bypass defenses in a system you would want to make sure that your fleet is not in an aggressive stance. Just be aware that bypassing an enemy fleet may not be as easy as a star base, because they may choose to move to engage your fleet.

[Jaxtaboxl]

Originally posted by tempest.of.emptiness:

To keep a system after the war you will need to have claimed it (usually, see below). You don't need to claim all of their systems, but any that you don't claim will revert back to their control. This is true of conquest wars, and true of some other types of war that end in a status quo peace. The big exception is a total war, which is typically one that involves a genocidal enemy. In those wars, full control of a system changes hands immediately when the system is fully taken by force, and no claims are necessary.

Claiming systems is less expensive before the war starts, but it also alerts your enemy that you intend to attack. That will usually prompt them to improve their defenses, so just be aware of that. Depending on circumstances it might be better to make your claims during the war, provided you will have enough influence to claim the systems you want.

Stellaris has gone through many changes as new versions have been released, so keep in mind when you read about the game online (especially about strategy) that some of the things you find may no longer apply. Now every system has a star base, but that was not always true. Also, typically there is no longer any point to attacking mining or research stations. Those changes may render invalid the strategy you've read about.

Most systems will just have a basic star base (an outpost). These are not very dangerous, even in the early game, and you probably don't need to avoid fighting them. In fact, because you have to defeat the outpost in order to take control of a system, only in a strictly defensive war might you ever avoid fighting them entirely.

More advanced star bases can be dangerous, particularly if there is a friendly fleet guarding them. Depending on circumstances you may be able to avoid their systems entirely, sticking to the less-well-defended systems that only have outposts. If you do have to fight a base other than an outpost, make sure your fleet power is stronger than the base and that there are no friendly fleets in the system before you attack it. If there is a fleet there, try to draw it away by defeating enemy outposts, and then attack the fleet while it is in another system (assuming your fleet is stronger, of course).

If you want to enter a system without fighting the enemy star base or fleets automatically, then your fleet stance is key. The default stance will not engage enemies until they get close (where "close" is determined by the weapon range of the ships in the two fleets), and that is the stance you would want to use. The stance you appear to be describing is the aggressive stance, and a fleet in that stance will automatically move toward any hostiles in the system in order to start a fight. So to be able to potentially bypass defenses in a system you would want to make sure that your fleet is not in an aggressive stance. Just be aware that bypassing an enemy fleet may not be as easy as a star base, because they may choose to move to engage your fleet.

Ok thx for all the tips. So the problem is, the species that im in conflict with has a starport so the real base not just an outpost, in each of its systems thats why i can't really avoid it and was searching for a way to harm them in other ways, to weaken them till i get a chance to take out the ports. Atm its a stalemate where i can't do anything. My fleet stance is on passive my ships just got into the weapon range of the starport since i tried to destroy mining stations, but if thats not viable anymore then thats that, i just didn't know if there is a way to attack things close to the starport without getting locked into the auto battle, I thought maybe there is a way to ignore it while it fires on you and just attack the target that you order but it seems its always the auto battle when you are in range..

[Jaxtaboxl]

Originally posted by MissedHurry:

Well, a couple of things.

You have to take over the starports in order to get that territory, no matter what.

If either you or the empire you are fighting is considered an imminent threat (like a determined exterminator or a devouring swarm) then you don't have to make claims to get the territory. Otherwise, yes you have to spend influence points to make claims on the star systems you want, then declare war for the claims, and send fleets to conquer those systems. Once you can settle for a status quo with that empire (they never really surrender until you take all their territory and planets), then you will get the systems you took over and had claims on.

You need weapons upgrades and lots of alloys so early in the game you should be making buildings and focusing on techs that boost research and alloys (well the building upgrade for the alloy plant).

If your fleet are a lot weaker than the other empires in the early game, you can sometimes stave off an invasion by giving them gifts (in trade) of food and consumer goods (sometimes minerals), to earn opinion points so they like you better.

So you have to always take out the starports first, before you can invade planets with attack armies or bombard them with your fleet?

[MissedHurry]

Originally posted by Jaxtaboxl:

So you have to always take out the starports first, before you can invade planets with attack armies or bombard them with your fleet?

I don't think you really have to, but two things:

If both the starbase and planet have FTL inhibitors on them, and the system is at a chokehold point so you can't get past it without defeating it, then you'll need to defeat both the starbase, and conquer the planet.

Another problem is, that if you just send an invasion army to the system without a fleet around, or the fleet going in first to take over the starbase, the transport army is in danger of being wiped out before it can even land on the planet.

[Nightmyre]

I don't think you can actually invade a planet without conquering the starbase first, but I think you can probably bombard it. Just that you almost never will be able to, since it is usually within range of the starbase.

[Dakota]

First step to early game dominance is knowing what you can do and not losing it all. It all starts with how you expanded, rush to some chokepoints for good defense, build a starbase at the choke point and put some weapons on it, I prefer hangars and comm jammers for max damage. Next up is to have some alloy income, I'd recommend at the very least having an extra alloy foundry or two as soon as you can if you plan to have any sort of wars.

Generally at the really early game when you're just corvettes and both sides cap out at about 20 corvettes you aren't gonna take their starbase without some losses and their fleets are likely to disengage, heal up, and come back again while you're attacking the base, this means you'll just be bleeding off ships instead of getting stronger. What you really wanna do is just avoid the starbase in their capital entirely in this first war, instead cap everything else that's easy, all the outposts, all their expansion colonies, get all that and status quo out.

Use the big boost in pop growth and planets to get stronger in the next 10 years while the enemy is contained to their world then after that you'll likely be able to take their capital without worry. You can also go and fight another AI during this 10 year NAP.

[Jaxtaboxl]

Originally posted by Dakota:

First step to early game dominance is knowing what you can do and not losing it all. It all starts with how you expanded, rush to some chokepoints for good defense, build a starbase at the choke point and put some weapons on it, I prefer hangars and comm jammers for max damage. Next up is to have some alloy income, I'd recommend at the very least having an extra alloy foundry or two as soon as you can if you plan to have any sort of wars.

Generally at the really early game when you're just corvettes and both sides cap out at about 20 corvettes you aren't gonna take their starbase without some losses and their fleets are likely to disengage, heal up, and come back again while you're attacking the base, this means you'll just be bleeding off ships instead of getting stronger. What you really wanna do is just avoid the starbase in their capital entirely in this first war, instead cap everything else that's easy, all the outposts, all their expansion colonies, get all that and status quo out.

Use the big boost in pop growth and planets to get stronger in the next 10 years while the enemy is contained to their world then after that you'll likely be able to take their capital without worry. You can also go and fight another AI during this 10 year NAP.

Ok great suggestions thx. Actually i did it exactly like that, i rushed to choke points where i then secured them with starports and i cut the enemy species off completly into a corner, sadly they have starports in every system so i can't take anything to then status quo out, i guess that means i just have to focus on expansion and just have to ignore them till later... just makes the beginning kinda boring since i can only wait. But yeah thx for helping a noob out!

[tempest.of.emptiness]

Originally posted by Jaxtaboxl:

I thought maybe there is a way to ignore it while it fires on you and just attack the target that you order

That isn't an option. A battle starts when either side attacks the other, and you can't control whether the star base will attack so all you can do is stay out of range (or try to, since you can't see the limit of its range).

Since they have a base in each of their systems, there probably isn't much you can do aside from either building up your fleet to the point that you can take on a base, or else waiting for their fleet to come to you.