"Pirates" are a bunch of arse

[CrazyFool]

The pirates are ruining my enjoyment of this game. Leave a hole, and they might spawn and completely destroy every mining station you have in the near vicinity. Leave a hole, and they don't spawn. Leave a fleet of 3.2K in a system where you've previously destroyed their base and their fleet, and a few seconds later, they spawn a new base and a fleet of 4.5K in the location where you are, while you're waiting for a construction ship to turn up. It sucks balls. Everyone says, "Oh, pirate fleets are easy to destroy - just send three corvettes." Are they people playing on "easy"? For the last few hours, I've not seen any pirate fleet less than 3K. I know that the pirates are now supposedly attacking the AI nations, but how do we know they are? I'd like to know where these pirates get the resources to build a 3K fleet within ten minutes when they're operating out of a ♥♥♥♥♥♥ base. Everyone keeps telling me the pirates are nothing, wait until the big ♥♥♥♥ starts, but I've got to be honest, with this pirate ♥♥♥♥ going on, eating out my resources, depleting my fleets, I'm not convinced I've got the enthusiasm to wait that long. I have to occupy every ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ system I come across, just so pirates don't miraculously spawn their giant fleets? And I've never been able to negotiate with them. It is, without a doubt, the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ part of this game. Just now, I had three pirate fleets attacking me from three of the four corners of my empire. I wouldn't have minded, but I'd placed my fleets (none of them, incidentally, big enough to defeat the pirates) in locations where I thought the pirates would spawn. I had a hole in the middle of my empire where there was one of those space Amoeba things. And I'm thinking, well, they're 1K, they don't invade, I can leave them there. So I did. For many years. Then I thought to myself, I want a nice empire with no holes. I destroy the Amoeba with my 3.5K fleet, order my science ♥♥♥♥ there (it hadn't been surveyed), and I've got my construction ship on standby to build the base. Then the pirates spawn a base and a 4K fleet, wipe my fleet out and go to destroy all of my mines in the surrounding star systems. Meanwhile, I'm waiting endlessly for my back-up fleets to arrive. This is ♥♥♥♥♥♥ up. Battling against another empire (which hasn't happened to me yet, and the entire galaxy is almost uncovererd) might be fun, perhaps were it not for the fact that every other empire is "overwhelming". But wasting time fighting pirates who don't capture your systems is a bit ♥♥♥♥. I'm sure I'll get flamed by "experts" who will tell me what I'm doing wrong. But seriously, this is rubbish.

[Apeironic_Entelechy]

Station your fleets better, due to the slow travel speed if you don't properly place your fleets near hotspots then you won't be able to respond to threats. You'know like the logistical issue that any large empire has to work with.

[DonutKing]

Yeah spread your fleets out acrost your empire's frontier or you might have to spend a long while waiting for your fleets to destroy pirates

[CrazyFool]

As I said, I've tried to pre-empt where the pirates would spawn, and stationed my fleets accordingly but they spawn anywhere. And I've had a 3.5K fleet with a 4 star Admiral up against a 3K fleet of pirates and they've beaten me. It's just taking away the enjoyment of this game. It was bad enough in Civ, even after I'd turned off the Barbarians, that Ghandi would start a war with me over the slightest infringement, but at least we could steal one another's cities. I've even tried a mod to remove the pirates, but that's about as much use as tits on a bull. I do wonder, with these games, whether the AI are playing to the same rules as us humans. I don't mind losing against the AI, but not if the AI is cheating.

[atm]

I understand why a lot of people don't like this mechanic. At first I was like making 'oh my god this is unfair' faces when they popped up for me, but now that I have gotten a good handle on 2.02, I actually don't stress about pirates very much at all.
I have been working on finding the best strategies to grab the most territory (on insane), and frankly you basically have to snake to do that, so you have a LOT of holes, and a very wide empire. Despite having say 40 empty neighboring systems that might qualify as holes ins a 200+ system empire, I still only get one spawn every now and then (say one every 30 minutes on normal?). I have had them spawn at the start of wars when my fleets are comitted elsewhere, and end up wiping out about 6 systems worth of stations before I get back to them. But since I have come to see them as the price of snaking, I feel it is a price I will proudly and smugly pay, since I am cutting entire arms of the galaxy off from the AI (they won't jump over you and claim systems even if you only block them off by 1 system).
A few stations destroyed every half hour? My empires tend to be very big, so even losing 10 systems worth of stations is hardly a dent. Blocking off a fifth of the galaxy so the AI can't even touch it? Worth infinitely more than those stations.

[fmalfeas]

I've made it a policy to ensure that there is no spot on my border that's not a chokepoint, and I install the highest level starbase I can there, bristling with guns and missiles, and with at least 6 platforms (3 of them have a PD section and a hangar, the other three are Medium Mount with Disruptors, and a Large Mount with either a railgun (not artillery) or energy torp.).

It's my unwelcome mat. Equipped with Missile, Gun, Hangar, Gun, Shipyard, Anchorage, with Service Umbilicals/crew quarters, targetting computer, comms jammer, and...I forget the name, but the one that screws up their ability to disengage. The shipyard and umbilicals are because I park at least 3k of ships there, and forget them. They have no job other than to support the starbase, if they get depleted, the starbase can reinforce them, if damaged, it can repair them.

When we're getting to the Star Fortress level, that 3k is often a pair of battleships who exist mainly to draw fire, so are stupidly tanky. At Citadel stage, obviously I install an Ion Cannon.

It bars pirates from my territory, keeps out marauders too. And generally serves as enough of a deterrent that very little is willing to attack me, not even Purifiers.

The downside is that I have to plot all expansion based on available starbase slots, or massive fleet presense until such time as my pop in the new area has increased the starbase allotment or income enough to allow me to seal the choke. I've done blitz expansions of like 20 systems in a burst before in order to have a new chokepoint line, and downgraded all the old one (even though that's a huge loss of invested resources).

Though on one map recently, I found a dead end, one path, 7 systems deep, with a huge (but generally crappy) world at the end. I terraformed the planet, moved my capital there, and put one of those monster starbases at every system on the path. I like making the enemy suffer greatly to depose me.

[CrazyFool]

I'm playing on normal, and I find the pirates to be insidious. Maybe I'm expanding the empire too quickly, so I can't half fleets and decent starbases where I need them. But the AI seems to expand very rapidly! I've not dared to snake because I've feared the pirates. But having said that, the other empires have never started a war with me (well, the FEs have whenever I'm colonized a holy world)/ I'm finding that I'm creating bigger fleets than I should, and having more starbases than I should have. It eats massively into my resources, which means that when the pirates, springing out of nowhere, wipe out the mines from half a dozen systems, I'm losing resources. This is my issue with pirates. If you're fighting a true enemy (another nation in a game like this) you expect their forces to come from that direction. You also expect that if you destroy their resources, it will take them a while to build up a decent fleet. The pirates? Well, they can just magic that ♥♥♥♥♥ out of thin air. It does seem as though the progamming is "IF 'system' = CLEAR spawn BASE + 4K FLEET" with an addendum "IF ENEMYFLEET > 4K then FLEET = ENEMYFLEET+1K".

[Ficelle]

Pirates will spawn in any empty system and go after stations

If you cant battle them and cant fill all empty space, solution is simple, dont build stations you cant defend close to where they can spawn

Those stations will cost more to build, rebuild and rerebuild than what they will produce
And you save your ships too
This way, you can ignore them in some places until you are strrong enough to fight them everywhere and have filled most empty spaces

Now, i also find them quite unfair because there is no delay
They attack as soon as you get the popup
There should be some delay in my opinion

[Fortuna]

Originally posted by CrazyFool:

I do wonder, with these games, whether the AI are playing to the same rules as us humans. I don't mind losing against the AI, but not if the AI is cheating.

No need to wonder. The AI certainly does not play by the same rules. What their rules actually are is the mystery.

Supposedly, they do spawn pirates now but I can't confirm that.

[Allusion]

Pirates have spawned to the AI in our latest game. My friend killed 3 pirate bases on the 1st spawn of them.
Just stay at max fleet cap all times with 2 to 3 fleets around mid-late.
If u cant support max fleet cap then u need more mineral and energy income.
Leaving ur fleet in the system where they spawn is free Admiral XP!
Design ur ships to counter them.

[Allusion]

Originally posted by Fortuna:

Originally posted by CrazyFool:

I do wonder, with these games, whether the AI are playing to the same rules as us humans. I don't mind losing against the AI, but not if the AI is cheating.

No need to wonder. The AI certainly does not play by the same rules. What their rules actually are is the mystery.

Supposedly, they do spawn pirates now but I can't confirm that.

AI cheat on any difficulty above Normal, Normal is too easy though

[CrusaderF8]

It is annoying that you can eliminate the Dimensional Horror enclosed within your own space, and the pirates will set up shop there before you can get the construction ship you had placed in the adjacent system to build an outpost there...

[Fortuna]

Originally posted by HwanDeag:

AI cheat on any difficulty above Normal, Normal is too easy though

The AI "cheats" on every difficulty.

[CrazyFool]

Originally posted by Clunge plunger minge mangler:

Instead of learning how to deal with them you just call them bad? I find they are a great and free income of technology unless you are picking your techs blindfolded and not building on planets I don't see how they could even be anything other than a minor annoyance.

By the way, I love your name. It's hilarious. But I'm not an inexperienced gamer. If I showed you my empire map, you would have to be slightly deranged not to say, "WTF?" Pirates spawn within a few seconds in places where you seriously wouldn't expect them to, and greater than even a fleet I have posted in their system. Like I say, I don't mind fighting against another empire (then I'll probably moan about the diplomacy - the diplomacy in Civ is terrible) but I'm presuming other empires fight wars for star systems? Pirates just destroy everything. Maybe my game installation is a bad one, because I have pirates spawning a base and a giant fleet within a few minutes, even though I have a giant fleet based in that star system. I'm just left there wondering where they got their resources from to build such a massive fleet in such a short space of time.

I like the idea of planning a war against another empire. Building up my fleets, hiding them close to the border, and then unleashing them. But what's the point when the pirates spawn a giant fleet miles away? From a realism perspective, "pirates" don't exist (certainly not on this scale), and no way could they create such a massive fleet in such a short space of time. From a game-playing perspective, pirates are ruining it for me.

[RodHull]

Originally posted by CrazyFool:

perhaps were it not for the fact that every other empire is "overwhelming".

I think this is more your issue tbh

If every other empire is showing as overwhelming it means your way way behind the power curve of the AIs. Pirates spawn at a strength roughly based on the era of the game and relative strength of all nations. So yeah if all the AIs are overwhelming in power to you (around 4 times stronger) then the pirates are spawning at stronger than you

By comparison im superior or equal to all the AIs in my current game and pirates spawn at roughly 1/10th my fleet strength, they cant even take out an outpost quickly.

Not meaning to be a ♥♥♥♥ either just saying I think you should probably revisit your strategy or play on easy for a bit before you get the hang of things, cause trust me if your having trouble with pirates that far in the AIs will destroy you when they eventually start turning their attention your way

Originally posted by CrazyFool:

I like the idea of planning a war against another empire. Building up my fleets, hiding them close to the border, and then unleashing them. But what's the point when the pirates spawn a giant fleet miles away? From a realism perspective, "pirates" don't exist (certainly not on this scale), and no way could they create such a massive fleet in such a short space of time. From a game-playing perspective, pirates are ruining it for me.

Remember this is grand strategy not a typical 4x

So each system is vast on its own its very easy for a pirate group to set up and start operating in a vast solar system that nobody controls. And pirate groups are basically scalliwags and criminals from your own empire they dont just appear they represent the criminal activity on the fringes of your systems

[Apeironic_Entelechy]

Originally posted by Fortuna:

Originally posted by CrazyFool:

I do wonder, with these games, whether the AI are playing to the same rules as us humans. I don't mind losing against the AI, but not if the AI is cheating.

No need to wonder. The AI certainly does not play by the same rules. What their rules actually are is the mystery.

Supposedly, they do spawn pirates now but I can't confirm that.

They receive less upkeep and do to a glitch (that I believe is fixed in the beta) they did not receive any pirates. Though when the new difficulty modes are released this will change and the player will be able to have more control over the bonuses they receive.