Research points questions

[curious nu]

1) So, let's say 'm researching something that requires 360 points. Current progress is something like ~100/360. I complete a special project and the pop-up tells me I get +180 points. I would expect my progress to now be 280/360, but this is.. not the case. I typically don't have the research window open, either, so I can't easily see how many points I -did- get, if any. How do these translate? Is it 10% of the award or something?

2) I'll look at my research and see it has 11 months to go. A few months later I open the window again and its jumped up to 23 months to go. (these are arbitrary numbers) What gives? Is there some randomizer that either boosts or delays research? I'm not losing research points in the meantime (like losing a station or a pop or something).

[Moonjunk]

1) Depends on the type of research you got. If you got 180 Physics research, you won't get 180 Society or Engineering Points. There is no bonus to get 180 research points for across the board.

2) Research is a numbers game. There are certain %'s that add to the speed of research. A level one scientist with no AI tech aid and with no specialties gives about a 2% bonus. Now, there are certain things that can cause a research speed to go down: Research Grants, for example, gives a 20% boost to one of the three sciences, but a -10% boost to the other 2. Building research stations and research labs can add research points, but if you get rid of them, or you lose the research station via someone/something destroying them or if someone else expands their boarders and the station is transfered over to them. I think population also adds to the amount of time it takes to get a new tech, but I am not 100% sure.

[LordOfPants]

When you end a month without researching something in a category or get bonus research points, they go into a 'saved' pool of points for that category. Each month you'll spend points up to your total research from the saved pool until the pool empties, so instead of getting +180 to your research right away you get doubled research until you've gotten a 180 bonus. I think what happens when you see a big jump like that is that if you're getting a bonus from the pool, the research screen estimates based on having that bonus until you finish researching, even if you only have enough saved for a month or two. Colonizing new planets and expanding population do increase your research times, but unless you're doing something really weird you're not going to see your research time double from doing that.

[corisai]

LordOfPants wrote fully and complete answer to your question, curious nu, ignore other messages.

[Moonjunk]

Originally posted by corisai:

LordOfPants wrote fully and complete answer to your question, curious nu, ignore other messages.

I was literally the only other message.

[LAG]

Originally posted by corisai:

LordOfPants wrote fully and complete answer to your question, curious nu, ignore other messages.

rude

[curious nu]

Yeah, that "stored research" is what I was missing, I think. Thanks!

[Delta Prime]

Is it just me or does AI cheat a little with research?

[UnshackledJester]

Originally posted by Alpha Omega:

Is it just me or does AI cheat a little with research?

Oh it does. The way most dev's compensate for an "AI" is to make a basic structure of behavior and then pad the stats with bonus crap to make them more powerful to offset the inevitably bad decisions the program is going to make. Instead of writing an algorith to make the aI use extreme effeciency in it's methods for expanding, setting up resource useage on planets, military might, and tech research(which would be a ♥♥♥♥♥ given the nature of the game) they let it simply get extra stuff to compensate. If they made an algorithm, we would more likely see an obvious pattern in the way the AI works and it would be a rock-paper-sissors scenario of how to take advantage. Personally I with the dev's would do both a little better; right now it seems like the AI is dumb as ♥♥♥♥ and cheats like hell.

[Delta Prime]

Originally posted by UnshackledJester:

Originally posted by Alpha Omega:

Is it just me or does AI cheat a little with research?

Personally I with the dev's would do both a little better; right now it seems like the AI is dumb as ♥♥♥♥ and cheats like hell.

Speak the truth brother.

[UnshackledJester]

Lulz, yeah Alpha, I don't know how many games I'll see someone with like 2 planets that has me out gunned and out researched when I'm like 1/3-1/3 way through all the weapon/fleet research despite me having a VERY decent section of real estate claimed with only a few colonies. It seems like right now the only viable option I've seen is to try and spread out without claiming a lot of planets to bum rush research until you're strong enough to make a competitive fleet. Then you drop a ♥♥♥♥ ton of colonies, build the basic buildings and make them sectors, then focus on building a fleet to defend yourself. The way the research is balanced is ass for the player.

I've been womped so many times from either ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ MASSIVE empires I watched grow from wimps or tiny little sectors that have god-like military powers.

Last one that I was like -flip table- on was a 2 planet neighbor with a 20k carrier fleet less than 2 hours into a game... wut?

[LAG]

Originally posted by UnshackledJester:

The AI gets unfair advantages to make up for it's poor play

of ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ course it does, where have you been the last 10 years?

ever played civ? or almost any game where an AI has to make it's own decisions instead of running on a railroad?

this isn't something new. Making an AI that can compete with a player is an incredibly hard thing to do.

[LAG]

Originally posted by UnshackledJester:

Lulz, yeah Alpha, I don't know how many games I'll see someone with like 2 planets that has me out gunned and out researched when I'm like 1/3-1/3 way through all the weapon/fleet research despite me having a VERY decent section of real estate claimed with only a few colonies. It seems like right now the only viable option I've seen is to try and spread out without claiming a lot of planets to bum rush research until you're strong enough to make a competitive fleet. Then you drop a ♥♥♥♥ ton of colonies, build the basic buildings and make them sectors, then focus on building a fleet to defend yourself. The way the research is balanced is ass for the player.

I've been womped so many times from either ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ MASSIVE empires I watched grow from wimps or tiny little sectors that have god-like military powers.

Last one that I was like -flip table- on was a 2 planet neighbor with a 20k carrier fleet less than 2 hours into a game... wut?

You win on hard by mass colonizing and making better decisions than the AI. Just colonize every world you see everywhere and outscale the AI.

Set habitable planets to 25% so you can keep yourself under the 5 planet sector limit for a longer period without giving the AI an uneccesary boon.

Pray you don't spawn next to a fanatical purifier, be friends with everyone until you're stronger than them. Do all you can to not discover any AI empires.

[Moonjunk]

Originally posted by LAG:

Originally posted by UnshackledJester:

Lulz, yeah Alpha, I don't know how many games I'll see someone with like 2 planets that has me out gunned and out researched when I'm like 1/3-1/3 way through all the weapon/fleet research despite me having a VERY decent section of real estate claimed with only a few colonies. It seems like right now the only viable option I've seen is to try and spread out without claiming a lot of planets to bum rush research until you're strong enough to make a competitive fleet. Then you drop a ♥♥♥♥ ton of colonies, build the basic buildings and make them sectors, then focus on building a fleet to defend yourself. The way the research is balanced is ass for the player.

I've been womped so many times from either ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ MASSIVE empires I watched grow from wimps or tiny little sectors that have god-like military powers.

Last one that I was like -flip table- on was a 2 planet neighbor with a 20k carrier fleet less than 2 hours into a game... wut?

You win on hard by mass colonizing and making better decisions than the AI. Just colonize every world you see everywhere and outscale the AI.

Set habitable planets to 25% so you can keep yourself under the 5 planet sector limit for a longer period without giving the AI an uneccesary boon.

Pray you don't spawn next to a fanatical purifier, be friends with everyone until you're stronger than them. Do all you can to not discover any AI empires.

OOORRR Be a fun slaver/spiritual/military race that attacks primitives and declares everyone your rival! Who needs friends when you have slugs insulting the glorious Holy Puffin Kingdom!!!

[Exarch_Alpha]

Originally posted by UnshackledJester:

Lulz, yeah Alpha, I don't know how many games I'll see someone with like 2 planets that has me out gunned and out researched when I'm like 1/3-1/3 way through all the weapon/fleet research despite me having a VERY decent section of real estate claimed with only a few colonies. It seems like right now the only viable option I've seen is to try and spread out without claiming a lot of planets to bum rush research until you're strong enough to make a competitive fleet. Then you drop a ♥♥♥♥ ton of colonies, build the basic buildings and make them sectors, then focus on building a fleet to defend yourself. The way the research is balanced is ass for the player.

I've been womped so many times from either ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ MASSIVE empires I watched grow from wimps or tiny little sectors that have god-like military powers.

Last one that I was like -flip table- on was a 2 planet neighbor with a 20k carrier fleet less than 2 hours into a game... wut?

Advanced AI start...

[LAG]

Originally posted by Lord Vlad (Merry Sangumas):

OOORRR Be a fun slaver/spiritual/military race that attacks primitives and declares everyone your rival! Who needs friends when you have slugs insulting the glorious Holy Puffin Kingdom!!!

pissing off an AI with 50%/100% bonus to everything the second you encounter them is a profoundly effective way of getting slaughtered.

keep your friends close and enemies closer.