Problems with the Combat Merge, and how to solve them (maybe?)

[Fogmoz]

Background

The main reason for the combat merge as stated by Fen is, "having per episode combat professions is putting off new players," but I do not think this is an entirely accurate assessment. It is addressing the symptom, not the cause. The issue is not necessarily per episode combat, it's that the combat in every episode feels exactly the same, and nothing from previous episodes carry over into the next. The reset feels unjustified.

Merging the combat doesn't solve this. It just turns identical copies of combat into one extremely long combat grind. Worse, it still doesn't solve the feeling of having to "restart" combat, because personalized striping will inevitably tell the average player to go backwards to a previous, incomplete episode in order to progress their combat level.

My goal in this post, is to provide ideas to make combat more engaging for players who want to invest in it, while also keeping it accessible for players who do not (breadth and depth).

Combat Professions

Structurally, they don't change. 500 is the magic number for Adothria, and I'm sticking to it. Enemy skins, level ranges, leaderboard ranks, capes... it's all staying the same, baby.

Instead, to enhance the immersion of each profession, they're all getting passive Boons. Whenever a player is engaged in battle, their episodic combat profession will be providing them with a small, unique advantage, thematic to the name of the profession.
Some examples:

• Guard: Damage taken reduced while Blocking
  
• Scout: Increased attack range with Ranged weapon, and/or increased Ranged ammo
  
• Minefighter: Chance to do extra damage (critical hit)
  
• Watchperson: Higher damage multiplier when using element enemy is weak to
  
• Shieldbearer: Increased chance to Block

Once a player reaches a high enough level (200?), they become proficient in that profession, and gain the ability to receive that profession's boon, in every episode!

* A higher level goal I would like to see added, is the addition of themed, profession-specific gear/transmog. Elite Hopeport Guard armor, Chef's attire, Blacksmith's garb, etc.

Equipment

Obelisks are the source of power for our equipment... but perhaps we have been undervaluing good, honest craftsmanship. For the first (40? 50?) levels, no tuning is needed. All crafted and dropped equipment up to level (40/50) is universally available and usable, in every episode. Additionally, this equipment will automatically scale with the player's episodic combat level, up to the level the gear was obtained as.
For example: A level 20 Rare Helm drops in Hopeport.
The player is

• 20 Guard,
  
• 15 Scout,
  
• 60 Minefighter,
  
• 4 Watchperson.

The item would then be

• level 20 Rare in Hopeport,
  
• level 15 Rare in Hopeforest,
  
• level 20 Rare in Mine of Mantuban,
  
• level 4 Rare in Crenopolis.

* Note that these levels would not display on the item all at once. Instead, where the item's level is, there would be two numbers: one for the item's obtained level, and one (in parenthesis) for its effective level. When using the item below its obtained level, the obtained level would grey out to emphasize that the effective level was being used.

Equipment above (40/50) would still need to be tuned to an episode to utilize the power of an obelisk in order to be strong enough to undertake the challenges that episode had to offer.

The Skill Tree

Each combat level gained in any combat profession will count towards a Total Combat level. Every (1? 5? 10?) total levels awards a Skill Point to spend in the Skill Tree. Since a player's combat power progression is still episodic, the Skill Tree will instead provide relatively small power bonuses, which add up, in addition to other interesting utility bonuses. Some examples (mostly pulled from Fen's initial merge post):

• Base Minhit / Maxhit
  
• Base Damage Deflection
  
• Maximum Hitpoints
  
• Hitpoint Regeneration
  
• Combat Movement Speed
  
• Immunity Cast Speed

* To avoid the possibility of players with a high Total Combat level (and thus a large number of Skill Tree bonuses) from one-shotting early episode enemies, these bonuses could scale with a profession's level.

For the most part, Gathering feeds into Crafting, which feeds into Combat. The Skill Tree could be a way for Combat to feed back into the other two, with bonuses like:

• Out of Combat Movement Speed
  
• Gathering Speed
  
• Crafting Speed
  
• Chance for bonus Gathering Yield
  
• Chance for Improved / Increased Crafting Product

Conclusion

I have faith in the core mechanics of Brighter Shores, and I believe it can still work. I think the changes I've proposed both keep the current system as undisturbed as possible (to avoid disrupting or devaluing current players' achievements / competitions), while also providing more depth & accessibility to engage all types of players.

- Players looking to go deep into combat are incentivized to specialize: high levels in Guard + Shieldbearer = the beginnings of a "Tank" class for endgame play. The addition of Special Attacks will further help diversify player builds.

- Untuned gear gives players a "soft meta" to strive for: get at least 1 combat profession to the untuned cap, obtain epic gear at that cap, then never have to worry about equipment until / unless they decide to "go deep" into a combat profession.

- The Skill Tree provides players with long-term progression, no matter where they decide to experience combat in Brighter Shores. Getting levels in any combat profession never feels like a waste.

Disclaimer

I have zero expectation anyone at Fen will see this, nor do I think any of my ideas are particularly unique or novel or deserving of attention. If Fen does see it, feel free to take any ideas (or none). I do not need permission; I do not ask for credit. I just want the game to succeed.

[WhiteWingDevil]

The passive bonuses legitimately feels like an elegant solution, even if I ignore the rest of your post (and I do think you're cooking with a few of those ideas). I don't know how easy or difficult it would be to implement, but my sense is that it would be relatively easy to do compared to reworking the system as a whole, and it would retain a lot of the current feel of combat, while also giving people genuine power to work towards that isn't caged into a single area.
It wouldn't solve all the complaints people have, but it would be a significant buff compared to the current full-reset system.

[Celebeth]

I know someone reads the threads, because someone is moderating. So I'm confident your thread will be read.

Although I'm not smart enough to talk about what systems are best, it's clear that you spend enough brain capacity on the topic for it to be given some consideration.

Here's a push for it to be taken into consideration. *Push*

[Omega Haxors]

Minefighter's key aspect is that you get monster drops from it, so I think its passive effect should be to increase the droprate of items. Not equipment, only item drops.

Also make it so that you can enchant an item with a certain profession to boost its effect. So if you want to get lots of items you could enchant with minefighter's obelisk.

[Greb]

So, these passive boons, are they a permanent thing, or something you have to switch out which one is active at any time? Because if you permanently get a passive boon at level 200 in a combat skill, it would become essential for everyone to hit 200 in every skill before even caring too much about combat itself, just to have all of the boons active and thus be at peak operating capacity for any future bossing or whatever.

Also the dropping of items having all these different levels stamped into them at the time they were dropped just sounds confusing and a little too complex, at least to me. For me ironically having to manage four different gear sets would be a simpler task than trying to remember what each piece of gear had on it - and it doesn't address the issue with gear being completely disposable until you reach the zenith where you no longer have to replace it. It also adds to that sinking feeling, you find an Epic helmet but because you've not levelled up another combat skill, it's now worthless the moment you start levelling up that other skill.

You have to consider additional combat skills too. If they're going with the quite bizarre system of having to level up a combat skill / obelisk in every episode going forward, and they somewhat optimistically think we'll one day see 21+4 episodes in total, then that's a lot of passive boons and gear levels per item to manage. It'll end up turning into a complete mess in no time at all and would definitely need to be retooled later on.

I don't get why they don't just do tiers of gear and forget the random stats or quality levels or whatever. There's clearly graphics and themes for at least 6 tiers of equipment, why not just go with a RuneScape system where T1 is your iron, T2 is your steel, T3 is your black, T4 is your mithril, T5 is your adamant, T6 is your rune etc, with flat, baked stats. Then include drops from bosses and so on for uncraftable, unobtainable T7 gear which is dragon tier etc.

I guess rarity could still be included but not to the insane degree it is right now, where an "Epic" piece of gear feels like it's +30 levels above a basic piece of gear for that level. Level should just be replaced with a minimum level to equip it, without you needing to replace everything every. single. time. you level up. At least then you'd get some mileage out of your equipment.

You could still have tiers of unlock. You wouldn't just magically be able to wield all T5 weapons the minute you reached say, level 350. You'd start off with basic stuff like shortswords or hammerfists, and work your way up. And weapons would actually have more statistics and attributes to make them all have an identity

Is that so bad? It'd be a hell of a lot simpler for someone like me to understand lol.

How would that work with crafting? I have no idea. Crafting already seemed weird with how you just mass produce the highest level weapon you can and sell them to a quartermaster, and that's it. Only when you reach 500 in all weaponsmith skills so you can always make Epic weapons of any level does it become spectacular. The rest of the journey is just a soulless money making grind practically.

Well I'm just waffling on at this point, as always any suggestions I come up with always lead to more problems elsewhere lol.

I just want them to make every combat skill have its own armour style and at least one unique weapon, with the rest of the weapons just being neutral. Ability to swap combat skills to whatever you want as your active one, used anywhere. Skill trees for each combat skill which are inherently biased towards certain themes or playstyles. Weapons and gear which aren't completely disposable until you reach the absolute peak.

Honestly don't even want a global combat level, it'd be far easier asking for "LFG 400+ Shieldbearer" than saying "LFG 2150+ combat level" or whatever.

[Fogmoz]

Greb, just to be clear, all of this is just from my head, none of it is planned by Fen

Originally posted by Greb:

So, these passive boons, are they a permanent thing, or something you have to switch out which one is active at any time? Because if you permanently get a passive boon at level 200 in a combat skill, it would become essential for everyone to hit 200 in every skill before even caring too much about combat itself, just to have all of the boons active and thus be at peak operating capacity for any future bossing or whatever.

I hadn't envisioned them as being so amazing that people would focus on them over anything else in combat. They would be intended more to be small bits of flavor to make each combat profession feel a little more unique. Players may feel inclined to focus on a few of them in order to fit a sort of "class identity" but they aren't all meant to synergise. (Minefighter could be changed to only work with 2h weapons, for example) I feel like getting total combat levels and filling out the skill tree would have a greater potential power benefit than obtaining every profession boon.

Originally posted by Greb:

Also the dropping of items having all these different levels stamped into them at the time they were dropped just sounds confusing and a little too complex, at least to me. For me ironically having to manage four different gear sets would be a simpler task than trying to remember what each piece of gear had on it - and it doesn't address the issue with gear being completely disposable until you reach the zenith where you no longer have to replace it. It also adds to that sinking feeling, you find an Epic helmet but because you've not levelled up another combat skill, it's now worthless the moment you start levelling up that other skill.

I think maybe I could have explained that section better... the goal there was to fix the frustration of getting to the next episode and having all your gear be useless. It directly addresses the sinking feeling you describe, lol.

The reason I put a cap on it (level 40 or 50, somewhere thereabouts idk), is so that gear progression in each combat profession still matters. Otherwise players could just get 1 combat prof to 500 and never need to get any gear ever again.

Originally posted by Greb:

You have to consider additional combat skills too. If they're going with the quite bizarre system of having to level up a combat skill / obelisk in every episode going forward, and they somewhat optimistically think we'll one day see 21+4 episodes in total, then that's a lot of passive boons and gear levels per item to manage. It'll end up turning into a complete mess in no time at all and would definitely need to be retooled later on.

They scrapped the obelisk leveling bit, at least for now.

Originally posted by Greb:

I guess rarity could still be included but not to the insane degree it is right now, where an "Epic" piece of gear feels like it's +30 levels above a basic piece of gear for that level. Level should just be replaced with a minimum level to equip it, without you needing to replace everything every. single. time. you level up. At least then you'd get some mileage out of your equipment.

Wait, you don't want rarity to feel like it's +30 levels above basic gear, but you do want to get some mileage out of your equipment? Idk if I'm misreading that but those two statements feel contradictory, lol. The entire point of higher rarity items being so strong is so that you don't need to replace them every time you level.

[Ratsplat]

The leveling of combat was only ever as big a deal as it was, was due to the actual combat performance being bland. If there was variety, actual magic, special attacks... perhaps they would have never gotten trapped into having to redo everything and push back actual content for months.

[Greb]

Originally posted by Fogmoz:

I hadn't envisioned them as being so amazing that people would focus on them over anything else in combat. They would be intended more to be small bits of flavor to make each combat profession feel a little more unique. Players may feel inclined to focus on a few of them in order to fit a sort of "class identity" but they aren't all meant to synergise. (Minefighter could be changed to only work with 2h weapons, for example) I feel like getting total combat levels and filling out the skill tree would have a greater potential power benefit than obtaining every profession boon.

Yeah I wasn't sure if I understood what you meant or not. It sounded like you were suggesting we get some unlocked passive bonus at say, 200 X combat skill, which permanently applies to your combat prowess from then on, regardless of what skill or area you're fighting in. Even if it was just a tiny boon like, +2% HP, people would still be required to grab all of these passive boons before feeling "complete" etc.

While there's something to be said about achieving a long standing goal, I feel like having permanent passive unlocks would cause anyone who hadn't achieved those as operating below peak. It'd essentially force everyone to get 200 in every combat skill before they felt "ready" to boss or whatever. At least, that's how it'd make me feel anyway lol.

Originally posted by Fogmoz:

I think maybe I could have explained that section better... the goal there was to fix the frustration of getting to the next episode and having all your gear be useless. It directly addresses the sinking feeling you describe, lol.

The reason I put a cap on it (level 40 or 50, somewhere thereabouts idk), is so that gear progression in each combat profession still matters. Otherwise players could just get 1 combat prof to 500 and never need to get any gear ever again.

This might be a fools errand with a system with 500 levels of equipment and rarity levels, I suppose. Is it even possible to make obtained gear not feel worthless and disposable with a system like that?

Only thing I can think of is letting you reforge items to level them up, costing materials that you get only from breaking down other weapons and gear etc or perhaps straight up the weapons / gear itself. I dunno. That itself sounds like a lot of busywork and would probably invalidate crafting or something.

Would be less of a problem with a tier system though. At that point you're only replacing your gear six times instead of potentially 1000+ times (considering four different rarities x 500 levels) per skill. Which is horrible and also the reason I've been avoiding combat until I've got 500 in all weaponsmith and armoursmith skills, lol.

Originally posted by Fogmoz:

They scrapped the obelisk leveling bit, at least for now.

Well that's good because it sounded extremely odd, almost like a minigame or activity they were trying to turn into a skill, just like Dungeoneering all over again or something. I know they're probably strapped, but it really feels like they're trying to bend something into a shape that's not supposed to be bent that way with ideas like that.

A minigame / long running side-quest to empower every obelisk in the game world, one by one, to earn buffs or whatever else? Neat. Turning that into a skill you have to level up or whatever? Weird.

Originally posted by Fogmoz:

Wait, you don't want rarity to feel like it's +30 levels above basic gear, but you do want to get some mileage out of your equipment? Idk if I'm misreading that but those two statements feel contradictory, lol. The entire point of higher rarity items being so strong is so that you don't need to replace them every time you level.

Is that the point of them? Because to me it felt like they were there to try and make it look like monsters actually dropped loot, and just there so you could fast-track your combat ability to have an easier time with combat, or because loot rarity is a frustratingly common system when games need to encourage players to just keep rerolling the same drop over and over until you get a god roll AKA keeping them playing. The moment you level up from 123 to 124, all of your 123 gear becomes inferior, even the Rare or Epic gear, since 124 Rare or Epic gear is better than 123 Rare or Epic gear. Sure, it might only be a minute difference, but you'll want to be at full capacity if you can, as befits the name of the game. It might not be necessary to replace your gear every time you level up, even if it was all Common grade, but...you get the idea, I hope.

Imagine in RS you Rune gear at 40, but then Rune+1 gear at 41, or Rune+2 gear at 42, all the way up to Rune+9 or something. Then I dunno, it's Granite+0 all the way to Granite+9 until 60, then Dragon, etc etc. That's what this system is like, even if each +1 tier only improved the base stats by like +1% people would still want to use the best they can when they can, replacing it often.

I dunno about you but I would much prefer equipment to be static, divided by tiers which we already have, without rarity even being a thing, really. Sure, you'd still have disposable equipment, but it would last much longer and you'd only need to replace things a scant few times as you level up.

We already have these tiers in place - gear goes from Basic > Moderate > Fine > Strong > Superior > Perfect. It could easily be repurposed into a system just like RS or whatever else. Instead of god knows how many Basic+1, Basic+2, Basic+3 versions we have now until we reach Moderate+0, Moderate+1 etc.

It'd also let them release specialised, unique equipment a lot easier. Could you imagine trying to balance something like Barrows armours with their set bonuses, if you had to create essentially 500x4 different versions of them and include those on some kind of drop table for whatever boss / raid they came from? It sounds terrible, lol.

Even if they got around the weirdness of these things on a per-player basis by making these bosses etc drop boxed loot which is untuned / unstamped and then when a player opens the box it's automatically tuned / stamped to their current levels, which would make getting the "perfect" drop a lot less painful, it'd still be a mess.

I don't know. My suggestions might not even be good, but they're just what I'd be able to tolerate, lol. I'm biased towards loot levels and rarity grades because I find them annoying and pointless fluff most of the time. They have their place in something like Diablo or some fast paced hack'n'slash shoot'em'up looter game, I guess. Just doesn't feel like something that belongs in an MMO, or like, slower role playing games like The Witcher etc.

Like, systems like that with levels and rarities seem to desire the whole game to be based around the constant acquisition of loot. If this game was foremost a combat game with a frontloaded emphasis on combat being the ultimate goal, it'd make more sense, but it's not, right? It's an MMO covering a whole bunch of skills and activities, with combat only making up one part of it. It's not a looter shooter, so I don't know why they feel the need to apply this kind of system to it.

I just don't feel like this is the kind of game where ditching equipment constantly feels warranted. And when we throw like, combat levels going into the 2000s into the mix I feel like it's just going to get worse, even if you no longer need individual equipment sets on a per-episode basis. Nothing will be clear anymore or easy to understand and plan out, not for my smoothbrain. I'll hate everything about it until I max out my gear levels, and only then will I feel worth a damn or that I could understand my actual abilities in combat.

Maybe it's just me, I don't know.

[Fogmoz]

You're setting yourself up for frustration if you intend to try and equip the best possible gear at every level. My highest combat prof right now is 138 and I am still using level 126 (rare) weapons to great effect. My shield is only level 96, and my armor is between 112 and 131. Also, when naked my deflect values are at 55.06% across the board. All of my armor combined is only providing between 7% (Cryonae, my "weakness") and 9.20% additional deflect, lol.

I just grabbed an old epic Torso from my bank to compare. Epic level 88 vs Uncommon level 126. According to the wiki, rarity adds about 15 levels' worth of stats, so the (approximate) level comparison for the two pieces is 133 vs 141. The higher level armor has 8 more Impact deflect... which is a whopping 0.2% increase. Do not torture yourself with constant upgrades, they really do not matter that much

It's all disposable, and it's all meant to be - at least for now. Once we get player trading, maybe we can sell rare & epic gear we no longer need and everyone will go around leveling with hand-me-downs As someone who's played plenty of MMOs, I'm used to haphazardly replacing gear while leveling up, so it doesn't bother me, but I can understand wanting gear to matter more. OSRS especially seems to lean on the "collect everything and hoard it in your bank" mentality.

Hopefully in the future endgame (and even midgame) activities can give us interesting & unique gear to collect & admire. :)

[Greb]

That's crazy. I get it's early days yet, but why would they design the combat system that way? Gear only counting for such a tiny fraction of your defence, because the majority of it comes from your innate magic power or something?

Why even bother with armour at that point then? Go with something like Bloodborne where armour barely matters and is mostly a style choice, save the rare occasions when you need some Frenzy or Poison resistance or whatever.

And yeah I wasn't planning on replacing gear every single level, just saying that the moment you level up your equipment is no longer cutting edge, which I detest. At least with a tier system this wouldn't happen too often and would actually turn into something to look forward to instead of the inevitable pointless 1-499 climb until you reach an actual meaningful point which is 500, and gear stops being thrown away.

I wouldn't call it an RS mentality, it's not about hoarding, it's about building a kit that has you ready for anything the game can throw at you, which you can't really do here until you reach max level and you know that finally, your gear isn't going to be replaced and anything you find / craft is actually something to be happy about. You can do that in a whole variety of games, preparing your armoury and whatnot, having all the tools needed for all the jobs.

I do wonder how this is going to work when they turn the combat system on its head again, lol, and how the crafting is going to look after the fact too.

Gear being so minor on your defensive stats compared to your innate defensive power actually makes reducing armour sets into six tiers even less awkward than it might be, then. Just add a few new armour sets with different functions or defensive values, and then split them between 6 tiers instead of 500. Sorted!

This just makes me wish they'd change the combat system to be different combat classes themed around each episode they appear in that you can just use anywhere, lol. No need for this massive overhaul thing they're doing if they just did that, it'd be simple and easy for everyone to understand, especially if they tiered the armour and weapons to go with it.

Just keep the perk system they have planned to add some variety of builds, which also clearly running a theme with each class (perhaps Scout has less damage+ perks in its tree, but way more ranged ammo+ and combat speed+ perks etc, to build into the theme that it can be predominantly a speedy ranged type class).

[Fogmoz]

Yeah it super surprised me how little the gear contributed. I mean, I want to say it’s still impactful… but only in the sense that it can slightly help negate bad RNG.

Slight disclaimer - even at 140 my attacks hit for only around 25-35 on average, and I’ve seen high level players doing hundreds of damage… so it’s possible that the gear becomes increasingly more important, probably after 200 if I had to guess. Omega could give us a better idea but he’s a little volatile atm, lol.

Originally posted by Greb:

I wouldn't call it an RS mentality, it's not about hoarding, it's about building a kit that has you ready for anything the game can throw at you, which you can't really do here until you reach max level and you know that finally, your gear isn't going to be replaced and anything you find / craft is actually something to be happy about.

This was kinda what I had in mind when I thought of the passive boons + the skill tree: building a custom repertoire to suit your playstyle. If equipment was about building a kit, would you still feel compelled to get everything possible before you were comfortable tackling a boss, like what you said earlier with the passive boons?

Originally posted by Greb:

This just makes me wish they'd change the combat system to be different combat classes themed around each episode they appear in that you can just use anywhere, lol. No need for this massive overhaul thing they're doing if they just did that, it'd be simple and easy for everyone to understand, especially if they tiered the armour and weapons to go with it.

This is exactly what I had thought the combat professions were going to evolve into at first, before this whole “merge” thing. Episodic combat lends itself well to a classic job system like from FFV. Train specific combat types in their respective episode, learn unique skills, acquire unique equipment, and be able to take that combat type anywhere. My boon idea also came from FFV, how you could mix & match job skills to create your own character build.

Idk what Gower has planned now, lol. I’ll keep playing BS regardless, because I enjoy it as a second monitor game and the setting, story, and core mechanics still show potential. Hopefully combat ends up somewhere we both can be happy with 😬

[Omega Haxors]

Originally posted by Fogmoz:

Omega could give us a better idea but he’s a little volatile atm, lol.

Man the average american really has lost all their social skills since the 'vid. Just for that i'm not telling you since you clearly have an issue expressing basic human decency.

Find another person with nearly maxed combat who still plays and is active on the steam fourms, and treat them a little better and maybe just maybe then you'll get your answer.

[Fogmoz]

That reaction really is just… *chef’s kiss*

[Omega Haxors]

You're deplorable.

[Fogmoz]

Wait just to be clear - is English your first language? I wasn’t actually trying to insult you or anything. Saying you’re a little volatile just means you’ve been angry a lot lately. The point of saying it was to indicate you might not be willing to cooperate atm. I wasn’t making fun of you.

That’s why your reaction was so good. I didn’t think you’d be up for cooperating, and you respond by saying you aren’t going to cooperate, lol.

[Greb]

Originally posted by Fogmoz:

Yeah it super surprised me how little the gear contributed. I mean, I want to say it’s still impactful… but only in the sense that it can slightly help negate bad RNG.

Slight disclaimer - even at 140 my attacks hit for only around 25-35 on average, and I’ve seen high level players doing hundreds of damage… so it’s possible that the gear becomes increasingly more important, probably after 200 if I had to guess. Omega could give us a better idea but he’s a little volatile atm, lol.

Yeah I do feel somewhat at a disadvantage (when discussing combat stuff, I mean) for not really getting stuck in to the combat system as it currently works, with my highest level combat skill being like 66 or something. It didn't bore me, I just didn't like it. Too many things wrong with it, and I'd rather skill than kill anyway, but I wouldn't say no to a bit of combat here and there. Just if it's going to be ripped apart and glued back together I may as well not get too acquainted with it, right?

Originally posted by Fogmoz:

This was kinda what I had in mind when I thought of the passive boons + the skill tree: building a custom repertoire to suit your playstyle. If equipment was about building a kit, would you still feel compelled to get everything possible before you were comfortable tackling a boss, like what you said earlier with the passive boons?

Yeah, I'd say so - within reason, of course. If we go by RS as an example, I wouldn't be saying "Noooo! I can't fight Elvarg until I've got Turmoil and Soul Split!" or whatever, but yeah, I've had too many experiences with impatient people who try to rush boss fights or whatever else and then it's either much harder than it needs to be or it's just an impossible task. It's better to be prepared than jump in feet first, at least for me.

It's not a problem with levels, as levelling up is a natural part of an RPG or MMO. Unlocking extra boons though, if you had every combat skill grant a permanent passive boon at 200 or whatever, well you'd never be operating at max until you have all of those passive boons active. Even if you could handily get by without them, I personally would still have to unlock all of those as soon as I could before I even considered trying to plan out the rest of my "toolkit" or whatever.

Originally posted by Fogmoz:

This is exactly what I had thought the combat professions were going to evolve into at first, before this whole “merge” thing. Episodic combat lends itself well to a classic job system like from FFV. Train specific combat types in their respective episode, learn unique skills, acquire unique equipment, and be able to take that combat type anywhere. My boon idea also came from FFV, how you could mix & match job skills to create your own character build.

Yeah, I don't know anything about Final Fantasy really, but that sounds like the kind of thing I'm thinking of. You'd have your episode and it's themes (I.E Hopeport + Guards) lending aesthetics and design to the combat skill, in this case the aptly named "Guard" and then they'd have to determine what kind of mechanics or styles this class would have.

In this case I'd say it'd be mundane weapons, not a focus on elemental but simple stuff, with an emphasis on fighting as a team, against multiple basic foes as opposed to being geared towards fighting a boss or an elite enemy. Certainly a player could fight and win against an elite enemy on their own as a Guard, of course, but their skill tree would have more perks leading towards dealing with many foes, and working in a team.

They'd have "the city watch" themed armour and their unique weapon would have to be some kind of standard bearer thing (shield slot) which buffs their Guard abilities. They'd definitely have special attacks like "Stop!" which causes basic mobs to be stunned for a turn or two due to the authority of your voice which only a Guard can muster, as well as Battlecry! to embolden themselves and allies. Stuff like that.

I remember hearing about a gun from Destiny, it was themed about rats, and I think it had a "Rat Pack" special ability which made it do more damage if more players in the team were using it at once. Something like that as a unique function for Guards would be a cool theme, but less about damage and more about support.

Would it make them useless in a solo situation? No, but they wouldn't be stealing the show or anything, but they'd be well equipped to deal with basic enemies and such.

Guard as a style / job like you say could be used anywhere you wanted, but it has to be learned in Hopeport first.

And also not every Episode would have to add a new combat style / job. There's no need for 20+ classes, right? But when they did decide to release a new episode and it had a new combat class, well that'd make everyone rightly happy and excited for it. Especially if once the main story got established they began dipping into Necronae / Infernae themed stuff too.

Originally posted by Fogmoz:

Idk what Gower has planned now, lol. I’ll keep playing BS regardless, because I enjoy it as a second monitor game and the setting, story, and core mechanics still show potential. Hopefully combat ends up somewhere we both can be happy with 😬

Yeah, I don't know either. I feel like the team are trying extremely hard not to just make RuneScape 2.0 and in some ways this is harming the game a bit because some of RS's designs are quite good, simple to understand but add a lot to the game (gems, rings and bracelets, and enchantment, for example - or eating food for heals or buffs) and not having those present here adds a bit of a void or something.

And yeah, I'll keep playing BS too. It's interesting enough and I like it overall, interested in seeing where it goes over time.