Tier Lists!

[id795078477]

Okay, they start to arrive. Compiled (some) just for you. Figured it's better to give scores from different sources to see how they align. As a context:

-- Necros is a high(ish) rank DPS with biases around Spiderman. Expect him to have a good eye on balance, but also rank Spiderman's/dive counters higher on the list than they should be
-- bogur is a fairly high rank flex (?), noticed to have some .. interesting takes, so his list can have some blunders here too. Still a take from a high ranker.
-- Merchant positions himself as a "your average buddy" and his list is taken as "for normal players", so this will likely not work if you've climbed the ladder too high.
-- Cozy is a new channel dedicated to the matter, but it grows fast. I think it's high-mid rank but I could be wrong.
-- Guides sounds just as the name suggests, trying to create guides for the game. From what I saw, it's mid-high rank.
-- Flats is a (active?) top-500 tank player in OW recently climbed fairly high on the ladder in Rivals, playing in premades mostly. Expert on tanks, could flunk other roles.
-- (Coach?) Mills has recently reached GM and in general spent a lot of time grinding ranked. What's interesting about his list is that he decided to wait and see how meta shapes up instead of trying to be "the first".

Sources:
-- Necros' list: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vy8srFM5-1o
-- bogur's list: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Ret3xdisno
-- Merchant's list: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XM_7yIP4d8
-- Cozy's list: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hx5FvxZdI8
-- Guides' list: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FJfAYt1VtQ
-- Flats list: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FaCwAAWOw0
-- (Updated!) Mills list: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XsPxD6UMYmc

(made for season 0, at the moment of this post give or take 12 hours)

---

Adam Warlock
Necros = A, bogur = B, Merchant = A, Cozy = B, Guides = A, Flats = A, Mills = S

Black Panther
Necros = S, bogur = C, Merchant = A, Cozy = B, Guides = C, Flats = B, Mills = A

Black Widow
Necros = C, bogur = D, Merchant = B, Cozy = F, Guides = D, Flats = C, Mills = D

Captain America
Necros = B, bogur = C, Merchant = A+, Cozy = B, Guides = A, Flats = B, Mills = B

Cloak & Dagger
Necros = S, bogur = S, Merchant = S, Cozy = S, Guides = A, Flats = S, Mills = A

Dr. Strange
Necros = S, bogur = A, Merchant = S, Cozy = S, Guides = A, Flats = S, Mills = S

Groot
Necros = B, bogur = B, Merchant = A+, Cozy = B, Guides = A, Flats = A, Mills = A

Hawkeye
Necros = A, bogur = S, Merchant = A+, Cozy = S, Guides = S, Flats = A, Mills = S

Hela
Necros = S, bogur = S, Merchant = A+, Cozy = S, Guides = S, Flats = S, Mills = S

Hulk
Necros = C, bogur = C, Merchant = A, Cozy = D, Guides = C, Flats = C, Mills = B
* There are videos showing that Wolverine is likely just not used correctly and that it's in fact is a secretly OP character: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BqPRCle3Xe8

Iron Fist
Necros = B, bogur = C, Merchant = A+, Cozy = B, Guides = B, Flats = B, Mills = C

Iron Man
Necros = D, bogur = D, Merchant = B, Cozy = D, Guides = C, Flats = F, Mills = B
* There are videos showing that Hulk is likely just not used correctly and that it's in fact is a secretly OP character: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=84rZoIMV1nQ

Jeff
Necros = A, bogur = C, Merchant = S, Cozy = A, Guides = B, Flats = C, Mills = B

Loki
Necros = C, bogur = B, Merchant = A, Cozy = B, Guides = B, Flats = B, Mills = A

Luna Snow
Necros = S, bogur = A, Merchant = A+, Cozy = A, Guides = A, Flats = S, Mills = S

Magik
Necros = A, bogur = C, Merchant = A, Cozy = C, Guides = C, Flats = A, Mills = B

Magneto
Necros = S, bogur = A, Merchant = A, Cozy = A, Guides = S, Flats = A, Mills = A

Mantis
Necros = S, bogur = S, Merchant = A+, Cozy = S, Guides = S, Flats = S, Mills = S

Moon Knight
Necros = A, bogur = A, Merchant = S, Cozy = A, Guides = A, Flats = A, Mills = B

Namor
Necros = A, bogur = B, Merchant = B, Cozy = C, Guides = C, Flats = B, Mills = B

Peni Parker
Necros = C, bogur = D, Merchant = A+, Cozy = A, Guides = A, Flats = B, Mills = B

Psylocke
Necros = S, bogur = A, Merchant = A+, Cozy = S, Guides = S, Flats = S, Mills = S

Punisher
Necros = A, bogur = A, Merchant = A+, Cozy = ?, Guides = A, Flats = A, Mills = A

Rocket Raccoon
Necros = B, bogur = B, Merchant = B, Cozy = B, Guides = A, Flats = B, Mills = B

Scarlet Witch
Necros = D, bogur = F, Merchant = A+, Cozy = D, Guides = B, Flats = D, Mills = D

Spiderman
Necros = B, bogur = D, Merchant = A+, Cozy = B, Guides = B, Flats = B, Mills = B

Squirrel Girl
Necros = A, bogur = D, Merchant = B, Cozy = D, Guides = B, Flats = C, Mills = C

Starlord
Necros = B, bogur = B, Merchant = A, Cozy = C, Guides = B, Flats = B, Mills = A

Storm
Necros = C, bogur = F, Merchant = B, Cozy = F, Guides = C, Flats = C, Mills = C

Thor
Necros = B, bogur = S, Merchant = S, Cozy = S, Guides = A, Flats = A, Mills = A

Venom
Necros = B, bogur = A, Merchant = A+, Cozy = A, Guides = B, Flats = A, Mills = A

Winter Soldier
Necros = S, bogur = S, Merchant = S, Cozy = A, Guides = B, Flats = S, Mills = A

Wolverine
Necros = E, bogur = F, Merchant = A, Cozy = D, Guides = D, Flats = D, Mills = D
* There are videos showing that Wolverine is likely just not used correctly and that it's in fact is a secretly OP character: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anEnuVRSmf4

---

This is NOT indicative of balance. But it's just food for thought. Observations:

Most agreed on:
-- Hela (S or almost S)
-- Mantis (S or almost S)
-- Punisher (A tier)

Most disagreed on:
-- Hulk (C tier high rank / A tier mid-rank)
-- Peni Parker (tiers all over the place, from top to bottom)
-- Scarlet Witch (clear loser in high ranks, but high tier mid-rank)
-- Wolverine (extremely low in high ranks, rather high in mid-ranks)

Clear winners (got nothing lower than A):
-- Cloak & Dagger
-- Dr. Strange
-- Hela
-- Hawkeye
-- Luna Snow
-- Magneto
-- Mantis
-- Moon Knight
-- Psylocke
-- Punisher

Clear losers (got nothing higher than C):
-- None

High-ranks losers (high ranks nothing higher than C):
-- Black Widow
-- Hulk
-- Iron Man
-- Scarlet
-- Storm
-- Wolverine

[Magnadeus]

Tier lists don't mean s**t and are only the opinion of one person.

[Hybrid Theory]

Don't care, didn't read. The game just dropped and the meta still needs to be more figured out. Literally just enjoy the honey moon phase my dude.

In this crazy age of SWEAT GOD E-sports people forgot what gaming is.

[Snobby Hobo]

Of course these will all change depending on meta drafts. So far this looks pretty inconsistent. From my experience having played Overwatch at a very high rank a long time ago, and Dota 2 competitively I would say there are a few clear standouts currently:

- Jeff is the strongest hero in the game to me currently. His healing potential is among the highest in the game, and his ultimate is completely broken on so many objectives. I can even see Loki being somewhat good (he's probably not) just because he can copy another Jeff ultimate

- Dr. Strange seems to me like the best tank in the game at the moment. He hits all the notes in the tank archetype and then some. I would be very surprised if he isn't pick or ban in all games he's going to be in

- Cloak and Dagger seems ridiculously consistent. I haven't played them enough to give something more constructive - but every game they are in they pull big numbers regardless of the pilot

- Iron man is a really bad hero. Guy deals way too little damage for how floaty he is. Any amount of focus fire will instantly blast him and he just doesn't bring enough to the table to make up for that

- Wolverine is even worse. This hero is so far removed from viable he's more comic relief than anything else

Personally I think the Punisher is very overrated - especially in the obvious "healer meta" we are in now. Without team synergy he's just nowhere near as good as picks like Hela, who can ping priority targets from across the map.

Flankers feel really bad in this game so far. The only notable standout is Back Panther, who I personally think is crazy overtuned at the moment.

[Cpt Obvious]

Super high elo tier list don't apply for the majority. It will only apply to people who play at that level which is less than 5%. Tier lists should always be utilized to what is practical for the majority. Developers should also balance towards majority which usually fall in mid to high elo if they want their game to live.

[id795078477]

Originally posted by John Outlast:

The list doesnt make any sense. You added these arbitrary, made up meta tiers that only you know the definition of and are poorly defined and downright confusing. Im not even trolling.

Don't hold me for what makes sense and what doesn't. I didn't make those up, it's from high elo players (with mixed in a "regular" players take):

Originally posted by id795078477:

Sources:
-- Necros' list: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vy8srFM5-1o
-- bogur's list: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Ret3xdisno
-- Merchant's list: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3XM_7yIP4d8

I just compiled it together and observed commonalities or discrepancies. Is it too early? Yes. Is it indicative? Sort of .. no .. yes? Some people had the time to put dozens of hours into the game already and climb the ladder. So again - don't shoot the messenger.

Originally posted by Cpt Obvious:

Super high elo tier list don't apply for the majority. It will only apply to people who play at that level which is less than 5%. Tier lists should always be utilized to what is practical for the majority. Developers should also balance towards majority which usually fall in mid to high elo if they want their game to live.

A very fair point. This is why I included Merchant's list that's made for mid-ranks. Most notable outtake from that one is that there's really no terrible heroes in mid-ranks apart from maybe Storm.

[60]

Originally posted by Practice:

Don't care, didn't read. The game just dropped and the meta still needs to be more figured out. Literally just enjoy the honey moon phase my dude.

In this crazy age of SWEAT GOD E-sports people forgot what gaming is.

You know ranked is a thing, right?

[hakabata]

Thumbs up for OP linking the clips. What more important is not tier lists but actual explanations reasoning behind so it's worthwhile watching the videos.

[id795078477]

Originally posted by hakabata:

Thumbs up for OP linking the clips. What more important is not tier lists but actual explanations reasoning behind so it's worthwhile watching the videos.

Most of the explanations won't work for just anybody, unfortunately. That's because oftentimes high tier streamers do implicit assumptions about mechanical skills and game awareness without even realizing it.

[Strajik]

lol... What 10 year old typed this? Wtf is a necros, bogur, and a merchant? Are you talking about the same game? lol... Just settle down and play the game.

[Baxxy.Nut]

Originally posted by Practice:

Don't care, didn't read. The game just dropped and the meta still needs to be more figured out. Literally just enjoy the honey moon phase my dude.

In this crazy age of SWEAT GOD E-sports people forgot what gaming is.

It's tier list, not a meta guide. It's kinda sad you wasted time to come here and say this.

[Sylphie Fioré]

Cloak and dagger lacks in raw healing power off cooldown though (even then the abilities rely completely on close grouped up teammates which is something ill advised most of the time), they rating her high just because of the lock on or something? Its more of a character you go when you need to dps as a support due to lacking teammates, especially with flying enemies. If I want to heal, which is my job theres much better choices.

[id795078477]

Originally posted by Strajik:

lol... What 10 year old typed this? Wtf is a necros, bogur, and a merchant? Are you talking about the same game? lol... Just settle down and play the game.

Well, then I guess it takes a 1 y.o. to be unable to click the links.

---

Updated the thread with a 4th list from Cozy! Looks like high(ish) tiers folks at least converge on the losers list.

[Kyutaru]

Originally posted by Strajik:

lol... What 10 year old typed this? Wtf is a necros, bogur, and a merchant? Are you talking about the same game? lol... Just settle down and play the game.

All of that was explained in the topic already so you are basically saying you didn't even read it. Having a short attention span is common among 10 year olds.

Originally posted by id795078477:

Jeff
Necros = A, bogur = C, Merchant = S, Cozy = A

Scarlet Witch
Necros = D, bogur = F, Merchant = A+, Cozy = D

Seems legit.

[id795078477]

Originally posted by Kyutaru:

Originally posted by id795078477:

Jeff
Necros = A, bogur = C, Merchant = S, Cozy = A

Scarlet Witch
Necros = D, bogur = F, Merchant = A+, Cozy = D

Seems legit.

Well, Merchant is mid-rank. Scarlet rules low and mid ranks. Jess rules them too but he's also not terrible at higher tiers, just falls behind Luna and Mantis a bit. I take bogur's "C" on Jeff as a "momentary lapse of judgement" since nobody is perfect.

[Sloppy]

Where's Namor?