Jeff change is actually a buff

[Bobr]

Hear me out. Most people played jeff wrong, either as a dps or a burst healer with the bubbles. Those are the incorrect way to play jeff.

He was designed around being a brawl/sustain healer, by healing his entire team at the same time with the beam and AOE of the bubbles. His left click and penetrate teammates, so you can heal 5 people at once, so 500 hp/s potential.

His new change doubles down on the brawl/sustain/anti dive.

His healing got nerfed, but can still pierce teammates, and now it also does damage, so it was originally 150 hp/s but now since it also does damage its +100hp and -70 enemy hp a second. His impact was 150/s and now its 170/s. Its a buff. Not to mention his bubble can heal at the same time.

If an iron fist dives your other support, healing and damaging at the same time is more efficient than just healing them as they fight him off. You only need a little bit of healing to stop the instakill breakpoints from most dive. Doing damage at the same time drives the dive away quicker, or makes it easier to get a kill on them.

Also his right click now INSTANTLY INTERRUPTS ALL DIVE CHARACTERS BY LAUNCHING THEM UP.

You cannot dps jeff anymore, and you cannot instantly heal your tank with 4 bubbles, but this trade to fully realize his brawl/sustain/anti dive potential is absolutely worth it.

[Terotrous]

NOTE THAT THIS WAS ORIGINALLY POSTED BEFORE THEY REVISED THE JEFF CHANGES.

Originally posted by Bobr:

He was designed around being a brawl/sustain healer, by healing his entire team at the same time with the beam and AOE of the bubbles. His left click and penetrate teammates, so you can heal 5 people at once, so 500 hp/s potential.

He's actually outright worse at doing that now though.

Originally posted by Bobr:

His healing got nerfed, but can still pierce teammates, and now it also does damage, so it was originally 150 hp/s but now since it also does damage its +100hp and -70 enemy hp a second. His impact was 150/s and now its 170/s. Its a buff. Not to mention his bubble can heal at the same time.

The problem is it doesn't pierce enemies, so if an enemy is in the way you now can't heal.

Originally posted by Bobr:

If an iron fist dives your other support, healing and damaging at the same time is more efficient than just healing them as they fight him off. You only need a little bit of healing to stop the instakill breakpoints from most dive. Doing damage at the same time drives the dive away quicker, or makes it easier to get a kill on them.

This is also the problem here. It's great if the diver and your healer are lined up so the diver is on the other side of the healer. It's terrible if the diver is between you and the other healer.

They almost certainly need to make his heals also pierce enemies so that they're more consistent. Being able to get in Jeff's face and shut down his healing is quite bad.

[Shinkie]

Originally posted by Bobr:

His healing got nerfed, but can still pierce teammates, and now it also does damage, so it was originally 150 hp/s but now since it also does damage its +100hp and -70 enemy hp a second. His impact was 150/s and now its 170/s. Its a buff. Not to mention his bubble can heal at the same time.

Now lets say he was healing 2 teammates in a brawl now do the numbers? 150 times 2 is greater than 100 times 2 plus 70 and you have to be in los to get that 70 and put yourself in danger. Completely a net nerf. This also would require your enemy to line up for you so you can heal and damage them.

[Bobr]

Originally posted by Shinkie:

Originally posted by Bobr:

His healing got nerfed, but can still pierce teammates, and now it also does damage, so it was originally 150 hp/s but now since it also does damage its +100hp and -70 enemy hp a second. His impact was 150/s and now its 170/s. Its a buff. Not to mention his bubble can heal at the same time.

Now lets say he was healing 2 teammates in a brawl now do the numbers?

270 impact vs 300. its a slight nerf yes.

But what you lose in tank sustain, you gain in anti dive sustain. Where you're healing your support and damaging the dive attacking them. You don't have to worry about switching from healing to attacking, or hitting a skill shot with the bubble.

[Shinkie]

Originally posted by Bobr:

Originally posted by Shinkie:

Now lets say he was healing 2 teammates in a brawl now do the numbers?

270 impact vs 300. its a slight nerf yes.

But what you lose in tank sustain, you gain in anti dive sustain. Where you're healing your support and damaging the dive attacking them. You don't have to worry about switching from healing to attacking, or hitting a skill shot with the bubble.

Good luck getting the enemy to lineup for you and you not to be one shot in the face because you are peaking your fat head hit box out to do 70 damage.

You can't play jeff period anymore he is useless so have fun.

[Bobr]

Originally posted by Terotrous:

Originally posted by Bobr:

He was designed around being a brawl/sustain healer, by healing his entire team at the same time with the beam and AOE of the bubbles. His left click and penetrate teammates, so you can heal 5 people at once, so 500 hp/s potential.

He's actually outright worse at doing that now though.

Originally posted by Bobr:

His healing got nerfed, but can still pierce teammates, and now it also does damage, so it was originally 150 hp/s but now since it also does damage its +100hp and -70 enemy hp a second. His impact was 150/s and now its 170/s. Its a buff. Not to mention his bubble can heal at the same time.

The problem is it doesn't pierce enemies, so if an enemy is in the way you now can't heal.

Originally posted by Bobr:

If an iron fist dives your other support, healing and damaging at the same time is more efficient than just healing them as they fight him off. You only need a little bit of healing to stop the instakill breakpoints from most dive. Doing damage at the same time drives the dive away quicker, or makes it easier to get a kill on them.

This is also the problem here. It's great if the diver and your healer are lined up so the diver is on the other side of the healer. It's terrible if the diver is between you and the other healer.

They almost certainly need to make his heals also pierce enemies so that they're more consistent. Being able to get in Jeff's face and shut down his healing is quite bad.

The last 2 points are a simple skill issue. Learn to position so your beam pierces better? Position so dive isn't between you and your other support. Or Have them move too so you can heal and damage at the same time.

As for your first point, the change is negligible. His left click got a nerf in raw healing, but his bubbles are now over time and do more healing than before so together its the same impact when healing the entire team, and an improvement when healing 1 person while they fight 1 other.

[Bobr]

Originally posted by Shinkie:

Originally posted by Bobr:

270 impact vs 300. its a slight nerf yes.

But what you lose in tank sustain, you gain in anti dive sustain. Where you're healing your support and damaging the dive attacking them. You don't have to worry about switching from healing to attacking, or hitting a skill shot with the bubble.

Good luck getting the enemy to lineup for you and you not to be one shot in the face because you are peaking your fat head hit box out to do 70 damage.

You can't play jeff period anymore he is useless so have fun.

Is positioning a hard skill for you? On most maps there's like 1-2 spots a dive can come from, its really not hard to keep that angle behind your other support so when they dive you can heal and damage at the same time.

[Shinkie]

Why pick jeff when you can pick Invisible woman and get 160hps and 80dps in a similar fashion except it also pierces enemies so you can hit multiple.

[Terotrous]

Originally posted by Bobr:

The last 2 points are a simple skill issue. Learn to position so your beam pierces better? Position so dive isn't between you and your other support. Or Have them move too so you can heal and damage at the same time.

You can't control the enemy's positioning. A character like Mr Fantastic or Hulk can simply get into your face and stay there and you now can't heal. Your self sustain is also now way worse since you can't burst heal yourself.

[Bobr]

Originally posted by Terotrous:

Originally posted by Bobr:

The last 2 points are a simple skill issue. Learn to position so your beam pierces better? Position so dive isn't between you and your other support. Or Have them move too so you can heal and damage at the same time.

You can't control the enemy's positioning. A character like Mr Fantastic or Hulk can simply get into your face and stay there and you now can't heal. Your self sustain is also now way worse since you can't burst heal yourself.

ok so the tank dive you as jeff instead of the other support, you're dead? Useless? Nah.

its a brawl comp, so you should be in a brawl positioning, within slapping distance of your dps and tanks and other support, so they'll instantly react and help.

But for the sake of your argument, lets say your team is busy.

Bubble yourself for the self heal. Right click the dive 3 times to launch them away. Then dive under the ground and swim to a teammate while the diver is stuck in the air.

ez pz lemon squeezy, kinda cheesy, makes me queasy.

[Revenant]

Originally posted by Bobr:

Hear me out. Most people played jeff wrong, either as a dps or a burst healer with the bubbles. Those are the incorrect way to play jeff.

He was designed around being a brawl/sustain healer, by healing his entire team at the same time with the beam and AOE of the bubbles. His left click and penetrate teammates, so you can heal 5 people at once, so 500 hp/s potential.

His new change doubles down on the brawl/sustain/anti dive.

His healing got nerfed, but can still pierce teammates, and now it also does damage, so it was originally 150 hp/s but now since it also does damage its +100hp and -70 enemy hp a second. His impact was 150/s and now its 170/s. Its a buff. Not to mention his bubble can heal at the same time.

If an iron fist dives your other support, healing and damaging at the same time is more efficient than just healing them as they fight him off. You only need a little bit of healing to stop the instakill breakpoints from most dive. Doing damage at the same time drives the dive away quicker, or makes it easier to get a kill on them.

Also his right click now INSTANTLY INTERRUPTS ALL DIVE CHARACTERS BY LAUNCHING THEM UP.

You cannot dps jeff anymore, and you cannot instantly heal your tank with 4 bubbles, but this trade to fully realize his brawl/sustain/anti dive potential is absolutely worth it.

1) there is no healer designed to be a brawler.

2) so if everyone goes in a straight line you will heal the team but good luck getting everyone in a straight line lmao.

3) his heals penetrate through allies but lets be honest his healing also got reduced by 33%. so in times where hes not healing 2-3 people at once where is the value at?

4) his new changes do not make him a brawler, it makes him like every other healer in the game, sit back and heal like a robot.

5) there is damage dropoff dude what are you smoking.

6) if iron fist dives you, your now dead due to the submerge changes

7) his right click went from 12 charges at 40 damage to 3 charges at 45 damage with recovering 1 charge per 3 seconds....

12 x 40 = 480 damage in 1 reload vs 3 x 45 = 135 with knockup....... lmaooo cmon. Unless this knockup is like a 1s cc.... it probably wont do much. - recovers 1 charge per 3s..... which means to do the same damage it would take 24s.

hes not a brawler lmaooooooooo

[Bobr]

Originally posted by Shinkie:

Why pick jeff when you can pick Invisible woman and get 160hps and 80dps in a similar fashion except it also pierces enemies so you can hit multiple.

have both and completely stop all dive?

also

Invis is 40 healing and 20 every 0.5s

80 healing and 40 damage every second.

120 impact.

Where are you getting 160 and 80? Im looking at the marvel rivals website and her stat page right now. Or does the orb also heal and damage on the return? Cause It doesn't feel like it does but idk.

[Shinkie]

Yep hits twice one on the way through and one on the way back.

[Bobr]

Originally posted by Revenant:

Originally posted by Bobr:

Hear me out. Most people played jeff wrong, either as a dps or a burst healer with the bubbles. Those are the incorrect way to play jeff.

He was designed around being a brawl/sustain healer, by healing his entire team at the same time with the beam and AOE of the bubbles. His left click and penetrate teammates, so you can heal 5 people at once, so 500 hp/s potential.

His new change doubles down on the brawl/sustain/anti dive.

His healing got nerfed, but can still pierce teammates, and now it also does damage, so it was originally 150 hp/s but now since it also does damage its +100hp and -70 enemy hp a second. His impact was 150/s and now its 170/s. Its a buff. Not to mention his bubble can heal at the same time.

If an iron fist dives your other support, healing and damaging at the same time is more efficient than just healing them as they fight him off. You only need a little bit of healing to stop the instakill breakpoints from most dive. Doing damage at the same time drives the dive away quicker, or makes it easier to get a kill on them.

Also his right click now INSTANTLY INTERRUPTS ALL DIVE CHARACTERS BY LAUNCHING THEM UP.

You cannot dps jeff anymore, and you cannot instantly heal your tank with 4 bubbles, but this trade to fully realize his brawl/sustain/anti dive potential is absolutely worth it.

1) there is no healer designed to be a brawler.

2) so if everyone goes in a straight line you will heal the team but good luck getting everyone in a straight line lmao.

3) his heals penetrate through allies but lets be honest his healing also got reduced by 33%. so in times where hes not healing 2-3 people at once where is the value at?

4) his new changes do not make him a brawler, it makes him like every other healer in the game, sit back and heal like a robot.

5) there is damage dropoff dude what are you smoking.

6) if iron fist dives you, your now dead due to the submerge changes

7) his right click went from 12 charges at 40 damage to 3 charges at 45 damage with recovering 1 charge per 3 seconds....

12 x 40 = 480 damage in 1 reload vs 3 x 45 = 135 with knockup....... lmaooo cmon. Unless this knockup is like a 1s cc.... it probably wont do much. - recovers 1 charge per 3s..... which means to do the same damage it would take 24s.

hes not a brawler lmaooooooooo

1) yes there are? Loki, Invis, current jeff, rocket. When I say "brawl healer" I'm not saying the healers are doing damage, I'm saying their kit can work well in healing a brawl comp.

2) skill issue? Positioning issue? Go to the sides of the fight and do some "enfilading fire" on your team. Or ask them to position in a line.

3) 150 healing is 150 impact on the fight. 100 healing and 70 damage is 170 impact on the fight. Its situational, but more impactful. Also his healing isnt that low. Luna does 120 a second, so if shes healing an enemy tank, and jeff is healing a friendly tank, he'll win due to the damage.

4)healing the entire team with very little mechanical skill, and being good at anti dive with his right click launching them up, and his left click healing the support and damaging the dive, makes him pretty good in a brawl comp. Why would he not be good in brawl? refer to section 1).

5) BRAWL IS CLOSE RANGE AND SUSTAIN. damage dropoff doesn't matter, and its negligible when it does come into play.

6) BRAWL IS DESIGNED AROUND ANTI DIVE. If you're playing brawl, you should be close to your team. They can help you. Also you can bubble yourself for 30 hp/s, right click the dive to launch them away, and then dive for another 15 hp/s, so 45 hp/s total. Meanwhile your team should be healing you, and attacking the dive.

7)ITS NOT A DAMAGE ABILITY ANYMORE. ITS UTILITY FOR ANTI DIVE.

[Shinkie]

so 80 and 40 a shot and 2 shots in 1 second leading 160hps and 80dps and if lined up can hit multiple teammates and enemies.

[Bobr]

Originally posted by Shinkie:

so 80 and 40 a shot. which is 2 shots in 1 second.

You got me there. But I think jeff still has a place as a second brawl/anti dive support. Or if invis gets banned.