Scarlet Witch Buff Proposal

[KingJooJooMonke]

1. Chthonian Burst Projectile Damage 30 > 40

Chthonian Burst is a integral part of her kit and it feels weak and expensive only having 4 charges. Increasing the projectile damage will increase the total damage from 65 to 75 further rewarding great aim.

2. Make her primary fire tracking tighter

This one is not even a buff but Jesus Christ I don't even have to look at enemies for this thing to lock on. You can actually be looking 90 degrees away from somebody and this thing still locks on I'm not even joking about this one.

3. Dark Seal duration 4.5 seconds > 5 seconds and increase area from 3m > 4m

Dark Seal stuns every 1.25 seconds making 4.5 seconds a very odd choice, in order to stop blue balling, giving it the 0.5 seconds will allow the extra stun. Increasing the area will help achieve extra stuns and more effectively block off routes.

4. Grant melee attacks knockback and double melee interval.

Scarlet Witch lacks defensive options, with her only escape tool being Mystic Projection. Giving her a knockback with her melee would create more interesting gameplay. To balance this you can make the intervals between melee attacks twice as slow. Also her melee attack animation literally looks like it should push something.

5. For every elimination Mystic Projection cooldown is decreased by 4 seconds.

Scarlet Witch is very dependent on her Mystic Projection. Giving her the ability to lower its cooldown through eliminations will help her position, get a kill, then make her escape incentivizing a hit and run playstyle while also following the theme of charging chaos magic.

6. Ultimate charge increased by 10-30% and Wanda will recharge 10% of her ultimate for each elimination caused by Reality Erasure. When using Reality Erasure, Wanda will receive a 40% damage reduction (effectively 350 health at max hp).

Scarlet Witch's ultimate is easily one of the worst in the game. It is very easily countered and easy to notice when screaming at the top of her lungs. Instead of making it easier to get kills, I thought it would be more fitting to give her more chances with it playing into the powerhouse she's supposed to be. It could be an excellent tool for pushing the enemy back or winning team fights. If you're able to get some kills with the ultimate it can quickly be recharged to push the enemy back even further. Leaning into a high risk high reward snowball type ultimate is perfect for her kit seeing how she is constantly charging chaos magic. I also included damage reduction to make it more consistent and less easier to counter by just shooting her giving her more flexibility when it comes to positioning her ultimate.

7. Give her a team up with Doctor Strange.

Nothing else is needed to be said about this one.

[Arc]

Her second charge on her shift.
Most people don't have 2 charges.

[73Datsun240Z]

Originally posted by Arc:

Her second charge on her shift.
Most people don't have 2 charges.

Okay, that’s a weird way to phrase it, by that logic Mantis has 4 heal abilities and Jeff has 50 heal abilities and infinite escape abilities, Namor and Loki have 2 turret abilities each, and Iron Man and Spider Man have infinite escape abilities in the form of endless flight or wall climb. See how the lines get muddy when you start phrasing things that way?

She only gets 2 L Shift and they are on set cooldown timer with no way to speed them up. I mean Black panther has 2 separate abilities that incorporate mobility as a lunge while also dealing damage and debuffs, Magik has a portal that leads to extra damage and lunge dealing damage, and Cloak and Dagger has a similar M1 ability to SW along with more mobility/escape options as it has 2 unique kits to choose from.

[Arc]

Jeff's only escape tool is to shift or press E then shift away. You just shoot him. He immediately dies. He's the lowest ranked healer in the game because his ability to survive being dived is amongst the worst in the game its by far the worst in his own class. That you would even try to compare his shift to hers is showing a complete lack of understanding of the game and proof you shouldn't be talking about balance.

[Mora]

Pretty well thought out changes, my only disagreement is on her ult.
I dont think she needs to have easier or more consistent access to it given its nearly unblockable nature (I'm still not sure how I feel about mr fantastic being able to block it, but given that his body was stretched thin to hold reality together in that one Darkhold story I might be able to forgive it) and I'm not sure if she even needs the increased defense/bonus health during its duration. Maybe she can be immune to crowd control like being webbed, since I dont think she is currently.
However, having seen her teamed with magneto and hulk enough times to see her be shielded from damage long enough to guarantee kills on all low-mobility/guardless heroes, I think it's okay that something so powerful comes with her being a sitting duck.

[RobAlca]

to op:
pls stop suggesting balance,u are horrible and uor ideas will kill the game
just stick to the memes

[73Datsun240Z]

Originally posted by Mora:

Pretty well thought out changes, my only disagreement is on her ult.
I dont think she needs to have easier or more consistent access to it given its nearly unblockable nature (I'm still not sure how I feel about mr fantastic being able to block it, but given that his body was stretched thin to hold reality together in that one Darkhold story I might be able to forgive it) and I'm not sure if she even needs the increased defense/bonus health during its duration. Maybe she can be immune to crowd control like being webbed, since I dont think she is currently.
However, having seen her teamed with magneto and hulk enough times to see her be shielded from damage long enough to guarantee kills on all low-mobility/guardless heroes, I think it's okay that something so powerful comes with her being a sitting duck.

That’s a very well thought out point of discussion surrounding her. I don’t want to make her too easy to play, and I think the OP had some good ideas, but all of them combined would skyrocket her to broken status. The fact this game is from the Marvel Universe and the lore surrounding it is lost on me cause I never got into MCU and have seen maybe 3-5 movies and none of the shows. I think canon lore shouldn’t be a deciding factor in balance given the game is PvP (if it were PvE then I would understand).

Currently her Ult is in a tricky spot because it is “feast or famine.” She announces to the whole map that she is using it. She has 4-5s of pure vulnerability with a huge movement penalty, and it either does something or it does nothing, and if it does nothing you are dead. Its damage is high but still not enough to kill some tanks with temp health and its range is good but not great. Iron Man does more damage with his Ult, leaves AOE damage in the area, and takes less than 2 seconds to use it. Scarlet Witch due to the speed penalty is regularly CC’d out of it if not killed by focus fire right away, even if keeping her moving in mostly random directions to try and dodge somewhat.

For it to get more then 1-2 kills you basically need to coordinate with your whole team which pretty much no other Ult needs to have some use. And the more people you try to land the Ult on the more vulnerable you are because it’s more enemies focusing you if they are grouped up. It’s why my thoughts about making her more of a conditional DPS who can play maps like a “jack of all trades” is a good compromise. Making her damage able to counteract heals and temp health makes up for her being squishy and only having 2 *not 3 cough cough* ways to engage/disengage from bigger threats. And when it comes to her Ult one of my suggestions if that it remains functionally the same as it is, still very hard to get massive use out of, but has the frequency boosted so it’s a looming threat to the enemy team. Making the enemy feel like they gotta stop a nuke from landing at any giving moment more than once per round is almost more strategic than the nuke landing if played right.

[Mora]

Originally posted by 73Datsun240Z:

Its damage is high but still not enough to kill some tanks with temp health and its range is good but not great. Iron Man does more damage with his Ult, leaves AOE damage in the area, and takes less than 2 seconds to use it. Scarlet Witch due to the speed penalty is regularly CC’d out of it if not killed by focus fire right away, even if keeping her moving in mostly random directions to try and dodge somewhat.

Scarlet Witch's ult is actually, afaik, an instant kill regardless of health, if youve seen anyone survive it it was because they have a weird conditional block like mr. fantastic, or simply werent hit by it. Conversely, Iron man's ult actually *does* simply do a lot of damage at once and is survivable with mitigation by most characters. Iron Mans ult can also be blocked by any shield, reflected by cap, and I believe absorbed by magnetos ult. It's why I feel like I do about scarlet, since it almost unconditionally vaporizes anyone it touches with some weird exceptions.

[Karnarax]

She doesn't have to aim nor to reload - and you want to buff her damage ?

[73Datsun240Z]

Originally posted by Mora:

Scarlet Witch's ult is actually, afaik, an instant kill regardless of health, if youve seen anyone survive it it was because they have a weird conditional block like mr. fantastic, or simply werent hit by it. Conversely, Iron man's ult actually *does* simply do a lot of damage at once and is survivable with mitigation by most characters. Iron Mans ult can also be blocked by any shield, reflected by cap, and I believe absorbed by magnetos ult. It's why I feel like I do about scarlet, since it almost unconditionally vaporizes anyone it touches with some weird exceptions.

There are definitely some blocks to it assuming her Ult is successful like the ones you mentioned above. From my experience any ability that offers Ult protection like Dr. Freaks shield protects from her Ult. At first I was under the impression it was an instant kill, but then I thought I saw a few times a buffed up Venom or Hulk survive it. Could be they were out of range, but they were low health afterwards so I assumed I did damage. Then I saw a few posts saying Iron Man has the highest damage Ult dealing 1,000dmg and she was 2nd with 750dmg with her Ult. That information could be wrong as there seems to be inconsistent data on damage numbers that haven’t been made public in the dev patch notes yet.

If anybody has these numbers please share, knowing that data affect some of my thoughts on her balance.

[Arc]

https://www.marvelrivals.com/heroes/?id=1d3f08cf-abee-4eb9-b2fd-31ce9947e5a1
its on the official site bro
750

[Mora]

Originally posted by Arc:

https://www.marvelrivals.com/heroes/?id=1d3f08cf-abee-4eb9-b2fd-31ce9947e5a1
its on the official site bro
750

I see. I didnt know this information was so readily available. With that known my feelings do change a bit but I still don't know how you could change it to feel better without making it feel terrible to get hit by.

[DOGE Auditor]

How about you don't ruin my main? She's fine. You're just bad.

[73Datsun240Z]

Originally posted by Mora:

Originally posted by Arc:

https://www.marvelrivals.com/heroes/?id=1d3f08cf-abee-4eb9-b2fd-31ce9947e5a1
its on the official site bro
750

I see. I didnt know this information was so readily available. With that known my feelings do change a bit but I still don't know how you could change it to feel better without making it feel terrible to get hit by.

I mean except for support Ults, all damage Ults should feel bad to get hit by. Having access to the data which I think some straight forward comparisons can be made between characters with similar Ults. Looking at the duelist class I feel like Iron Man and Moon Knight can be a decent comparison to Scarlet Witch due to having high burst damage.

Energy Cost:
Iron Man - 2800
Moon Knight - 2800
Scarlet Witch - 3400
Assuming no extra gains to energy are being used at 12energy/s being the passive gain rate. Both IM and MK get an Ult every 3.8min, and SW gets her Ult every 4.7min. In a standard 12min game IM and MK gets 3 uses and SW gets 2. Points go to IM and MK on this.

Charge Up/Casting Time:
Iron Man - 2s
Moon Knight - 1.2s
Scarlet Witch - 4s
This is kinda obvious who gets the points here. Each of these Ults also paints a different target on the user. MK casts and that’s it, nobody is looking to take him out once it’s cast to stop it, they just flee. Same can be said of IM though a good opponent could pop him out of it or deflect/absorb it with insane reflexes. SW has to be stopped so you are immediately the target. Points IM and MK. They can at least survive a failure of their Ult.

Area of Effect:
Iron Man - 10x5x5m rectangle
Moon Knight - 5m cylinder (up to the height where the hands spawn)
Scarlet Witch - 15m sphere
Mathematically SW seems to have best area coverage, but in the 3D space a sphere has many downsides. Her biggest impact of using it would be when she is closest to the ground to get a full 15m of ground coverage and half the sphere overhead. The higher she is in the air using it her actual coverage of the ground decreases, at 10m in the air you would hit less than a 5m patch of the ground below you. This one I will call even between them based on that, but IM seems to have the advantage here for consistency in having large area of effect.

Damage:
Iron Man - 1000 burst (plus lingering AOE)
Moon Knight - 1050 total (over 3.5 seconds)
Scarlet Witch - 750 burst
IM takes it obviously with the immediate burst. MK has even higher damage than him if somebody is hit by 14 hits at 75dmg (at a rate of 4hits/s), so it can pummel any enemy who doesn’t get out ASAP. SW deals 750 in one burst. IM takes the points on this one followed by MK and SW tied.

I see a pattern of one Ult being underwhelming when you stack up data like that next to each other. Maybe you will draw different conclusions, but this is how I view it.

[Arc]

Iron Man and Moon Knight are borderline the only aoe ults worth caring about. They both come out with near no warning and 1 shot most of the cast.
THen you see Scarlet flying over slowly to do the same thing.
Or Thor flying over slowly to be face tanked and still kill no one

[ryno1ni]

Here's my proposal. Buff her ult a little bit. Giver her orb the extra .5 seconds. And the big change, her secondary fire buff her primary. Maybe it doubles the % health damage you do if you direct hit for a second. That encourages good aim and consistent swapping btw primary and secondary for maximum damage output. I'd also say reduce the lockon for her primary but idk if that's actually necessary with how weak she currently is. (In spite of being one of only 2 characters to do % health damage, a pretty significant amount of the roster does more damage to tanks than her. Its kinda sad)