Animaze Feels

[Vinacious G]

I noticed the devs deleted the other long post we had going, so here you go: Let us voice our feelings as consumers below :)

[Zefnoly]

引用自 Rabid Raccoon：

引用自 Zefnoly：

Rudest part is having to pay to use models you made yourself in your freetime...

^This^

I put a lot of hours into making my Raccoon skin. But I have to have a dollar to actually use it with Animaze? So I make a bunch of skins and then need a bunch more bucks too? Regardless of free or VIP, I am paying to use my own work.

Do I upload them? How do I import my own models and stuff for the $0.99? Surely my computer doesn't need me to insert $1(USD?) to drop files into a folder so I am assuming there is some cloud shenanigans involved if I want to import for 'personal use'.

(I'll admit I misread and jumped the gun on 'uploads' being a thing. But good example of why Holotech needs to clarify a few things.)

Does a message pop up saying "external files detected. Please insert coin to continue. Please enter PayPal/Credit Card details now."

If I have 20 skins/models do I have to pay $0.99 for each one individually, or does it tally up the file count and give me a one off bulk price?

Do I get a discount the more skins I import at once? Sort of buy 4 get one free? lol

And that is only a dollar for the free version, it's gonna be at least $1.66(USD?) a month if I also want the watermark to be gone.

If I stop using a skin or model I imported do I get my money back? Do I have to pay again if I delete or modify the files then have to reimport them?

If USD, then that "$19.99" becomes "$27.62" at current rates in my local currency. That "$99.99" becomes $138.....

Flashbacks to Mixamo and Fuse engaged. lol

I dont simply just make skins. But whole models from scratch... Which I have to animate and key into being usable in this software.

[Vinacious G]

引用自 Zefnoly：

引用自 Rabid Raccoon：

Flashbacks to Mixamo and Fuse engaged. lol

I dont simply just make skins. But whole models from scratch... Which I have to animate and key into being usable in this software.

Doesn't that take hours upon hours upon hours to design, mesh, and key animations? Per each model?

I can't imagine being charged afterwards to then have the ability to use the models in Animaze, holy cow.

[Zefnoly]

引用自 Vinacious G：

引用自 Zefnoly：

I dont simply just make skins. But whole models from scratch... Which I have to animate and key into being usable in this software.

Doesn't that take hours upon hours upon hours to design, mesh, and key animations? Per each model?

I can't imagine being charged afterwards to then have the ability to use the models in Animaze, holy cow.

Modelling alone can take days to weeks if you cant spend 100% of a day working on the model. Making that model when finished facerig capable takes a whole weekend alone. Holotech should know as they know how much it costs to pay an artist for just one model.

[Rabid]

引用自 Zefnoly：

引用自 Vinacious G：

Doesn't that take hours upon hours upon hours to design, mesh, and key animations? Per each model?

I can't imagine being charged afterwards to then have the ability to use the models in Animaze, holy cow.

Modelling alone can take days to weeks if you cant spend 100% of a day working on the model. Making that model when finished facerig capable takes a whole weekend alone. Holotech should know as they know how much it costs to pay an artist for just one model.

Yep even making 'skins' can take just as much work, and cost as much to pay a graphic designer to make.

I couldn't tell you just how many hours I put into just my raccoon skin and it is still not even finished.

I mean how are we even meant to test our models and skins out? I don't want to be paying every time I make a new avatar and want to simply test it out, or modify them,. Something I can easily do in Facerig.

I can literally load my new work every 5 seconds into facrig and check out how it is looking every step of the way in real time.

I'd like to see Holotech address how that will work in 'Animaze'.

I guess how it works is I have to pay $20 or $100 a year and then can work on my creations without 'insert coin to play' every time.

[Zefnoly]

引用自 Rabid Raccoon：

引用自 Zefnoly：

Modelling alone can take days to weeks if you cant spend 100% of a day working on the model. Making that model when finished facerig capable takes a whole weekend alone. Holotech should know as they know how much it costs to pay an artist for just one model.

Yep even making 'skins' can take just as much work, and cost as much to pay a graphic designer to make.

I couldn't tell you just how many hours I put into just my raccoon skin and it is still not even finished.

I mean how are we even meant to test our models and skins out? I don't want to be paying every time I make a new avatar and want to simply test it out, or modify them,. Something I can easily do in Facerig.

I can literally load my new work every 5 seconds into facrig and check out how it is looking every step of the way in real time.

I'd like to see Holotech address how that will work in 'Animaze'.

I guess how it works is I have to pay $20 or $100 a year and then can work on my creations without 'insert coin to play' every time.

Yeah. I have to make both textures and models. And especially making models and animating them properly requires me to test the model several times to see if things is working as it should. Having to upload every time I do that would be a pain in the ***

Even VRChat has a system in place so you can test characters before uploading them to see if the animations applied works locally. And lets you upload free of charge, while being free itself.

[Rabid]

引用自 Zefnoly：

引用自 Rabid Raccoon：

Yep even making 'skins' can take just as much work, and cost as much to pay a graphic designer to make.

I couldn't tell you just how many hours I put into just my raccoon skin and it is still not even finished.

I mean how are we even meant to test our models and skins out? I don't want to be paying every time I make a new avatar and want to simply test it out, or modify them,. Something I can easily do in Facerig.

I can literally load my new work every 5 seconds into facrig and check out how it is looking every step of the way in real time.

I'd like to see Holotech address how that will work in 'Animaze'.

I guess how it works is I have to pay $20 or $100 a year and then can work on my creations without 'insert coin to play' every time.

Yeah. I have to make both textures and models. And especially making models and animating them properly requires me to test the model several times to see if things is working as it should. Having to upload every time I do that would be a pain in the ***

Even VRChat has a system in place so you can test characters before uploading them to see if the animations applied works locally. And lets you upload free of charge, while being free itself.

Yeah this is what worries me. How can we make sure our content works in the 'free' version before we import it, and if it doesn't work and we need to mend our files are we going to be charged each time we need to reimport them. Will Animaze have a fit if the filename or file size is different?

I've tried reading the FAQs and dev responses around here, but I'm not seeing any answers to the really important nitty gritty answers. Hell no responses to my post asking about if Animaze needs an online connection to work or if we can use it without an internet connection.

Important for me as I use Facerig for making local content to be uploaded later, more so than for live streaming.
I've had software, even 'standalone' with a lifetime license stop working on me during the middle of work because my ISP decided to take the network down for maintenance.
It's a frustrating experience to have the tools you're working with do that in the middle of a job.

e.g Voicemod App that I use to dub character voices with. If you had no net connection it would only allow access to the 'free' voices until it could phone home again. Would get locked out of the licensed voice I had paid for lol.

Actually need to check if 'Voicemod 2' still does that.....

[Zefnoly]

引用自 Rabid Raccoon：

引用自 Zefnoly：

Yeah. I have to make both textures and models. And especially making models and animating them properly requires me to test the model several times to see if things is working as it should. Having to upload every time I do that would be a pain in the ***

Even VRChat has a system in place so you can test characters before uploading them to see if the animations applied works locally. And lets you upload free of charge, while being free itself.

Yeah this is what worries me. How can we make sure our content works in the 'free' version before we import it, and if it doesn't work and we need to mend our files are we going to be charged each time we need to reimport them. Will Animaze have a fit if the filename or file size is different?

I've tried reading the FAQs and dev responses around here, but I'm not seeing any answers to the really important nitty gritty answers. Hell no responses to my post asking about if Animaze needs an online connection to work or if we can use it without an internet connection.

Important for me as I use Facerig for making local content to be uploaded later, more so than for live streaming.
I've had software, even 'standalone' with a lifetime license stop working on me during the middle of work because my ISP decided to take the network down for maintenance.
It's a frustrating experience to have the tools you're working with do that in the middle of a job.

e.g Voicemod App that I use to dub character voices with. If you had no net connection it would only allow access to the 'free' voices until it could phone home again. Would get locked out of the licensed voice I had paid for lol.

Actually need to check if 'Voicemod 2' still does that.....

Not just that but people I know who took part in the beta tried to do everything to talk the devs out of this anti consumer system. Not just that but their only excuse every time for this new buisniess model is that everyone who uses it more than 90 min are youtubers or streamers who earn cash using it for a living. Which not even a majority of youtubers or streamers using this does...

Also the fact you have to pay just to upload your own stuff, as repeated before. Is outrageous...

[Rabid]

引用自 Zefnoly：

Not just that but people I know who took part in the beta tried to do everything to talk the devs out of this anti consumer system. Not just that but their only excuse every time for this new buisniess model is that everyone who uses it more than 90 min are youtubers or streamers who earn cash using it for a living. Which not even a majority of youtubers or streamers using this does...

Also the fact you have to pay just to upload your own stuff, as repeated before. Is outrageous...

Well I've just had one of the devs confirm that you need an online connection and allow Animaze to phone home for it to work.

No internet connection, no Animaze.

So that's local content producers like me boned. Even if I was okay with a subscription, having the software I am using constantly monitored by some foreign company every time I am using it crosses a line for me.

I'm happy to pay for that which I use. But if I do not have complete control over what resides in my computer and what it does then it is a no go.

Yes I use Windows 10 Pro, but I have neutered the hell out of Micro$ofts 'telemetry' and such.
I block any software that wants to call the home base from doing so.

Seriously why do I even bother having a firewall when some crappy company can bypass it by forcing me to give them access via some EULA even when I have paid for their product?

Sadly it will not be about providing a better service but to protect their revenue. Kind of how Bethesda moved Quake to being an online only title with Quake Champions to protect their ability to bleed people via in-game micro-transactions. (Their words not mine.)

Yeah if I am paying up to $100 a year to use some software, then be ♥♥♥♥♥♥ if I am also giving that kind of access to the company I am already paying, especially when said company doesn't fall under my countries laws.

Hell I aint giving anyone that kind of access even if I am using their product for free.

Losing respect for Holotech with each passing day.

Quote from Dev in post in question.

引用自 david_animaze：

Yes, in order to use Animaze you will need an active internet connection. Without an active internet connection, Animaze’s tracker will not initialize and you won’t be able to control your avatars.

[Zefnoly]

引用自 Rabid Raccoon：

引用自 Zefnoly：

Not just that but people I know who took part in the beta tried to do everything to talk the devs out of this anti consumer system. Not just that but their only excuse every time for this new buisniess model is that everyone who uses it more than 90 min are youtubers or streamers who earn cash using it for a living. Which not even a majority of youtubers or streamers using this does...

Also the fact you have to pay just to upload your own stuff, as repeated before. Is outrageous...

Well I've just had one of the devs confirm that you need an online connection and allow Animaze to phone home for it to work.

No internet connection, no Animaze.

So that's local content producers like me boned. Even if I was okay with a subscription, having the software I am using constantly monitored by some foreign company every time I am using it crosses a line for me.

I'm happy to pay for that which I use. But if I do not have complete control over what resides in my computer and what it does then it is a no go.

Yes I use Windows 10 Pro, but I have neutered the hell out of Micro$ofts 'telemetry' and such.
I block any software that wants to call the home base from doing so.

Seriously why do I even bother having a firewall when some crappy company can bypass it by forcing me to give them access via some EULA even when I have paid for their product?

Sadly it will not be about providing a better service but to protect their revenue. Kind of how Bethesda moved Quake to being an online only title with Quake Champions to protect their ability to bleed people via in-game micro-transactions. (Their words not mine.)

Yeah if I am paying up to $100 a year to use some software, then be ♥♥♥♥♥♥ if I am also giving that kind of access to the company I am already paying, especially when said company doesn't fall under my countries laws.

Hell I aint giving anyone that kind of access even if I am using their product for free.

Losing respect for Holotech with each passing day.

Thought you wanted to avoid subscription based software at all cost?

[OperativeEchelon]

引用自 Zefnoly：

引用自 Rabid Raccoon：

Yep even making 'skins' can take just as much work, and cost as much to pay a graphic designer to make.

I couldn't tell you just how many hours I put into just my raccoon skin and it is still not even finished.

I mean how are we even meant to test our models and skins out? I don't want to be paying every time I make a new avatar and want to simply test it out, or modify them,. Something I can easily do in Facerig.

I can literally load my new work every 5 seconds into facrig and check out how it is looking every step of the way in real time.

I'd like to see Holotech address how that will work in 'Animaze'.

I guess how it works is I have to pay $20 or $100 a year and then can work on my creations without 'insert coin to play' every time.

Yeah. I have to make both textures and models. And especially making models and animating them properly requires me to test the model several times to see if things is working as it should. Having to upload every time I do that would be a pain in the ***

Even VRChat has a system in place so you can test characters before uploading them to see if the animations applied works locally. And lets you upload free of charge, while being free itself.

I don't understand why the company can't give creators like you some revenue share instead of charging you for your own work? If your models are good, and used by the community.. Then it would save the company overhead creating new content. Seems like a no brainer to me?!

[Zefnoly]

引用自 gamersofpain：

引用自 Zefnoly：

Yeah. I have to make both textures and models. And especially making models and animating them properly requires me to test the model several times to see if things is working as it should. Having to upload every time I do that would be a pain in the ***

Even VRChat has a system in place so you can test characters before uploading them to see if the animations applied works locally. And lets you upload free of charge, while being free itself.

I don't understand why the company can't give creators like you some revenue share instead of charging you for your own work? If your models are good, and used by the community.. Then it would save the company overhead creating new content. Seems like a no brainer to me?!

2015 *lets earn more money by letting creators sell unofficial content for our software/game. With us taking a small percentage of revenue*

2020 *Lets earn more money by forcing creators to pay for their own creations*

[Labandero X]

honestly, the fact that they are going to remove facerig from the steam store makes it look like they are not confident at all with their next product. what's the point of removing facerig from the store other than forcing people to use animaze instead?

also because of this, i can't even reccomend my friends to buy facerig anymore. i was planning on making some avatars for my friends and making them buy facerig for it. but now with the sudden update and the limitations of animaze, i'm now forced to look for an alternative.

i heard. prprlive is a good alternative though, right now i'm just looking for documentation on how to import live2d avatars there. if current facerig stops working, i'm probably moving to that instead

[Zefnoly]

引用自 Labandero X：

honestly, the fact that they are going to remove facerig from the steam store makes it look like they are not confident at all with their next product. what's the point of removing facerig from the store other than forcing people to use animaze instead?

also because of this, i can't even reccomend my friends to buy facerig anymore. i was planning on making some avatars for my friends and making them buy facerig for it. but now with the sudden update and the limitations of animaze, i'm now forced to look for an alternative.

i heard. prprlive is a good alternative though, right now i'm just looking for documentation on how to import live2d avatars there. if current facerig stops working, i'm probably moving to that instead

Well as a 3D artist there arent many good equilants... IF you can count VRChat as one. I guess I will use that if I want to socialize with my friends in my various characters Ive modelled together in my freetime.

[Vinacious G]

I wonder how the devs feel reading this.

"Hmm.... It seems no one likes our product... and 90% of the reason why is based on our having a subscription model, and some are irritated because we make them pay us to upload their self-created content. Maybe we should do something about tha-"

PSYYYYYCHHHHHHHH

All they must think is how rich they're gonna get off of youtubers and content creators, over and over and over, on repeat maniacally in their heads.

Honestly their best move would be to make this an Epic Store exclusive, to get more $$ for each purchase including microx.
All those dumb fortnite kids would love this, and not know any better.

[Vinacious G]

I wonder how the devs feel reading this.

"Hmm.... It seems no one likes our product... and 90% of the reason why is based on our having a subscription model, and some are irritated because we make them pay us to upload their self-created content. Maybe we should do something about tha-"

PSYYYYYCHHHHHHHH

All they must think is how rich they're gonna get off of youtubers and content creators, over and over and over, on repeat maniacally in their heads.

That obviously not going to happen, though, because it's not easy af to get $500 out of yt. They're also trying to say if you get >$500/m from yt, PATREON, and "other subscriber services," whatever that means, that they're then entitled to both A) require you buy their commercial edition; and B) Give them a cut of your subscriber-based earnings.
If this is incorrect, someone correct me.

And they will fail, because they won't be generating or churning out hip yt sensations left and right, but I imagine they think they will? Because no one wants an additional subscription every month, least of all some 3D avatar program. Kids, teens, and young adults might, if they have the disposable income. Perhaps that's their new demo, tho.

Honestly their best move would be to make this an Epic Store exclusive, to get more $$ for each purchase including microx.
All those dumb fortnite kids would love this, and not know any better.