Animaze Feels

[Vinacious G]

I noticed the devs deleted the other long post we had going, so here you go: Let us voice our feelings as consumers below :)

[Klon22]

i downloaded the bete test and never runs on my system :(
i would like to test, when its official launch be happen will be free to play for 60 mins, so wait.

while read the news on animaze website.

[Kuro]

lol, I didn't even realize my initial post got deleted because I haven't been on steam since I posted it! Really goes to show how the devs feel about their userbase, I suppose. I just want to air my feelings that I think the devs are scumbags for creating a more accessible succesor to facerig, but with the godawful twist being that it relies on a subscription-based model; absolutely shameless in every sense of the word!

[Holotech Studios]

As a parenthesis: One of the reasons some posts/threads get deleted (or another moderation action is taken) is when people - for their own reasons - decide to cross the line with the amount of cuss words and ad hominem attacks. That happens very rarely (maybe once or twice per a whole year - thankfully most people chose to articulate their thoughts without an overflowing amount of cuss words even when delivering criticism), but as rarely as it does, it still happens and action has to be taken.

Deleting has a far more likely chance to happen for a whole thread if the thread starts that way, because it is more difficult to steer that back towards a constructive conversation.

Constructive criticism is great and we welcome it, because out of it comes a potentially better product. But exhibiting toxic behaviour is not constructive criticism.

[OperativeEchelon]

Originally posted by Holotech Studios:

As a parenthesis: One of the reasons some posts/threads get deleted (or another moderation action is taken) is when people - for their own reasons - decide to cross the line with the amount of cuss words and ad hominem attacks. That happens very rarely (maybe once or twice per a whole year - thankfully most people chose to articulate their thoughts without an overflowing amount of cuss words even when delivering criticism), but as rarely as it does, it still happens and action has to be taken.

Deleting has a far more likely chance to happen for a whole thread if the thread starts that way, because it is more difficult to steer that back towards a constructive conversation.

Constructive criticism is great and we welcome it, because out of it comes a potentially better product. But exhibiting toxic behaviour is not constructive criticism.

I liked that I own Facerig and not stuck on a monthly fee. As a Pro Facerig member, will there be a flat reasonable fee for Facerig pro users to upgrade instead of being stuck on the monthly fee model?

[Maverynthia]

So Animaze is just Facerig with a subscription fee or a super limited Free mode right? Is that what I'm getting from all of it?

[OperativeEchelon]

Originally posted by Maverynthia:

So Animaze is just Facerig with a subscription fee or a super limited Free mode right? Is that what I'm getting from all of it?

YUP! Maybe a bit better avatars and mocap, but yes! Sure seems so.

[Ryusho Yosei]

Originally posted by gamersofpain:

I liked that I own Facerig and not stuck on a monthly fee. As a Pro Facerig member, will there be a flat reasonable fee for Facerig pro users to upgrade instead of being stuck on the monthly fee model?

I am another one who actually got Facerig Pro, so the sudden "Drop of it to make a new one" does have me..kind of irked considering this, so it does make me wonder, "Are you doing anything for those who were facerig pro, or especialy face rig -studio- purchasers?"

[Cookie_Bow]

i dont care i need to buy avatars, i just wish the animaze vip was a one time purchase
i

[Zefnoly]

As someone who use facerig privatly to talk with friends and use it for pure fun. I must say this monthly fee thing is kinda bollocks to me. I never intended to use it for streaming and my calls with friends can last longer than 90. And I make my own models. I kinda feel like us non streamers are kinda pushed down as we wont "earn" money by using it unlike streamers. So this fee thing is well... Really dissapointing.

[Zefnoly]

Originally posted by Holotech Studios:

As a parenthesis: One of the reasons some posts/threads get deleted (or another moderation action is taken) is when people - for their own reasons - decide to cross the line with the amount of cuss words and ad hominem attacks. That happens very rarely (maybe once or twice per a whole year - thankfully most people chose to articulate their thoughts without an overflowing amount of cuss words even when delivering criticism), but as rarely as it does, it still happens and action has to be taken.

Deleting has a far more likely chance to happen for a whole thread if the thread starts that way, because it is more difficult to steer that back towards a constructive conversation.

Constructive criticism is great and we welcome it, because out of it comes a potentially better product. But exhibiting toxic behaviour is not constructive criticism.

I can easily understand where the toxicity comes from. A lot of facerig users dont even use this for streaming. Unlike streamers who use this as a program to aid their income during streams. We who only use it for talking with friends. This seems a tad... annoying. I prefer a single payment just to use the program and own it like a real product.

Also people are already full of monthly fees. They stack up. Im likely gonna pass this as problems I had with importing models to the older version was never solved or explained to me. And my calls with friends generally last longer than that. Guess its time for me to just forget about facerig completely... Or just remain using the old "unsupported" version of it. Or just continue to use VRChat further to communicate with friends in a fun way.

Not just that but previously ive been told in E-mails while having issues with my models and your rendering engines that you where going to remodel the whole rendering engine. Now I see where that "promise" is going. Behind a monthly paywall...

[Rabid]

I personally, if I've not made it clear elsewhere prefer to buy games or software for a one off fee, that I can then use as I see fit without further restrictions and conditions.

I tend to avoid 'online services' and subscriptions because I tend to make content 'offline' more than streaming.
I'm not on the net 24/7. Despite having 24/7 internet. Sometimes I like to just turn off the LAN and focus on the work at hand.

There is literally zero subscription or online service type programs installed on my PC and never will be.

Doing the math, and looking at how I have used Facerig and how often I use it for the last 5 odd years I would pay more for Animaze than I have Facerig with a Pro license in the same time frame.

I'm fine with having to purchase a new product with new features every couple of years, like I buy a new Paintshop Pro probably every 3 or 4 versions as they release a new one every year and I tend to wait until the features are different enough to validate said purchase.

I understand Facerig has been going for about 6 years and it's stupid to expect Holotech to just keep updating it and adding new features and content to it for free. They have bills to pay and mouths to feed like the rest of us. But I do feel they're doing this all wrong.

They should of probably expanded Facerig Studio into Animaze for the big money and aimed that at the professional/commercial streamers and content creators. e.g the 10 million sub types or TV and film studios and made a stand alone 'cloud' free Facerig 2.0 for the rest of us who use it to make videos here and there and like to have a bit of fun on Video chats.

Feels like this sub model is really alienating the majority of the user base Facerig has.
I understand Facerig is probably not bringing in the bucks anymore and it is time for new a new income source. But this is why you make a new product. Just like Game devs do. Just like software companies like Corel and Magix and more do.

I'd of bought a Facerig 2.0, A Facerig 3.0 in a few more years, and a Facerig 4.0 and so on and so forth. (Or skipped a version here and there.)
Just as I bought Paintshop Pro 2020 despite having a perfectly functioning Paintshop Pro X9.
Just as I have done over the years with games and software in general that I like.

There's a reason I bought Doom, Doom 2, Doom 3, Doome 2016 and Doom Eternal, but never spent a dime on Quake Champions, despite buying every other Quake game made.
There's a reason why I still buy Corel products, but no longer even look at Adobe ones let alone give them a cent.
There's a reason I play games like Morrowind, Oblvion and Skyrim, but avoid MMO's

Holotech would at least be making money from me for a true Facerig Sequel, especially one that fixed Facerigs shortcomings. Even fine with reasonably priced Avatar and scene packs.

Alas Animaze as it currently is won't make Holotech a single Penny from me, even if Facerig stops working I'll just move on.

Just feels like a step towards nickle and diming people. Of controlling our content.
I don't have to upload my graphics to Corel before I use them on a website.
I don't have to upload my videos to Magix first, every time I want to upload them to Youtube.
I don't have to pay any of them to use content I CREATED using their software I already paid for.
(I have plenty of HDD space. I don't need your storage thanks.)

Heck I use plenty of free open source software also. GIMP doesn't water mark my photos and graphics every time I use it.
It doesn't kick me out after 90 minutes.
A lot of 'webcam' software that is watermarked because it is free will remove said watermark after you've done a one off reasonably priced payment and not expect you to keep on paying.


What happens if I make a model or skin Holotech does not approve of?
Do I get stopped from using it? They might not like me making a sexy adult friendly "Fluffo"

Anyone on board for Animaze, especially those who create content. I'm gonna suggest you read the ToS, EULA's and fine print before you upload any of your content to their servers.

You want to be sure your property remains under your complete ownership and control.

Heck I don't even know if I can use Animaze offline like I can Facerig. Devs haven't responded to the post I made asking that.
But seeing as uploading is required for content. I'm guessing it is online only...

As a long time user and fan, not even knowing about Animaze or the Beta until the recently, this really feels like a kick in the nuts.

tl;dr I like to pay straight up for software then have complete control over how I use it and when I use it. Something Facerig Pro and every other piece of software I own does.
Something Animaze will not do.
Too many potential hooks and catches with a sub service.
Seriously sad we have to explain and even rationalise this to Holotech who I assume are adults and not 12 year olds.

Yeah could understand 'studio' going this way. But not the program we casual types use and love.

[Zefnoly]

Originally posted by Rabid Raccoon:

I personally, if I've not made it clear elsewhere prefer to buy games or software for a one off fee, that I can then use as I see fit without further restrictions and conditions.

I tend to avoid 'online services' and subscriptions because I tend to make content 'offline' more than streaming.
I'm not on the net 24/7. Despite having 24/7 internet. Sometimes I like to just turn off the LAN and focus on the work at hand.

There is literally zero subscription or online service type programs installed on my PC and never will be.

Doing the math, and looking at how I have used Facerig and how often I use it for the last 5 odd years I would pay more for Animaze than I have Facerig with a Pro license in the same time frame.

I'm fine with having to purchase a new product with new features every couple of years, like I buy a new Paintshop Pro probably every 3 or 4 versions as they release a new one every year and I tend to wait until the features are different enough to validate said purchase.

I understand Facerig has been going for about 6 years and it's stupid to expect Holotech to just keep updating it and adding new features and content to it for free. They have bills to pay and mouths to feed like the rest of us. But I do feel they're doing this all wrong.

They should of probably expanded Facerig Studio into Animaze for the big money and aimed that at the professional/commercial streamers and content creators. e.g the 10 million sub types or TV and film studios and made a stand alone 'cloud' free Facerig 2.0 for the rest of us who use it to make videos here and there and like to have a bit of fun on Video chats.

Feels like this sub model is really alienating the majority of the user base Facerig has.
I understand Facerig is probably not bringing in the bucks anymore and it is time for new a new income source. But this is why you make a new product. Just like Game devs do. Just like software companies like Corel and Magix and more do.

I'd of bought a Facerig 2.0, A Facerig 3.0 in a few more years, and a Facerig 4.0 and so on and so forth. (Or skipped a version here and there.)
Just as I bought Paintshop Pro 2020 despite having a perfectly functioning Paintshop Pro X9.
Just as I have done over the years with games and software in general that I like.

There's a reason I bought Doom, Doom 2, Doom 3, Doome 2016 and Doom Eternal, but never spent a dime on Quake Champions, despite buying every other Quake game made.
There's a reason why I still buy Corel products, but no longer even look at Adobe ones let alone give them a cent.
There's a reason I play games like Morrowind, Oblvion and Skyrim, but avoid MMO's

Holotech would at least be making money from me for a true Facerig Sequel, especially one that fixed Facerigs shortcomings. Even fine with reasonably priced Avatar and scene packs.

Alas Animaze as it currently is won't make Holotech a single Penny from me, even if Facerig stops working I'll just move on.

Just feels like a step towards nickle and diming people. Of controlling our content.
I don't have to upload my graphics to Corel before I use them on a website.
I don't have to upload my videos to Magix first, every time I want to upload them to Youtube.
I don't have to pay any of them to use content I CREATED using their software I already paid for.

Heck I use plenty of free open source software also. GIMP doesn't water mark my photos and graphics every time I use it.
It doesn't kick me out after 90 minutes.
A lot of 'webcam' software that is watermarked because it is free will remove said watermark after you've done a one off reasonably priced payment and not expect you to keep on paying.


What happens if I make a model or skin Holotech does not approve of?
Do I get stopped from using it? They might not like me making a sexy adult friendly "Fluffo"

Anyone on board for Animaze, especially those who create content. I'm gonna suggest you read the ToS, EULA's and fine print before you upload any of your content to their servers.

You want to be sure your property remains under your complete ownership and control.

Heck I don't even know if I can use Animaze offline like I can Facerig. Devs haven't responded to the post I made asking that.
But seeing as uploading is required for content. I'm guessing it is online only...

As a long time user and fan, not even knowing about Animaze or the Beta until the recently, this really feels like a kick in the nuts.

tl;dr I like to pay straight up for software then have complete control over how I use it and when I use it. Something Facerig Pro and every other piece of software I own does.
Something Animaze will not do.
Too many potential hooks and catches with a sub service.
Seriously sad we have to explain and even rationalise this to Holotech who I assume are adults and not 12 year olds.

Yeah could understand 'studio' going this way. But not the program we casual types use and love.

Yeah. I agree with everything you say...I only use facerig to have fun with my models and art creations in videochats and 1-3 videos a year... Nothing more. Im one of the many alienated costumers. Multiple friends I have are also putting down their final interest in facerig due to these news and wont return unless they can buy and use it however they like after the purchase. It seems the community is going to crash. And holotech may look at a loss of costumers in the end. As most of their costumers will now be people who barely or almost make up the money they need by using facerig for their daily game streams. Its honestly silly and ignorant to assume we all are "streamers" with subscribers. If that is their target. Then animaze clearly is not for me at all. And I will just end up being stuck with their older outdated software with broken promises.

[OperativeEchelon]

Originally posted by Zefnoly:

Originally posted by Rabid Raccoon:

I personally, if I've not made it clear elsewhere prefer to buy games or software for a one off fee, that I can then use as I see fit without further restrictions and conditions.

I tend to avoid 'online services' and subscriptions because I tend to make content 'offline' more than streaming.
I'm not on the net 24/7. Despite having 24/7 internet. Sometimes I like to just turn off the LAN and focus on the work at hand.

There is literally zero subscription or online service type programs installed on my PC and never will be.

Doing the math, and looking at how I have used Facerig and how often I use it for the last 5 odd years I would pay more for Animaze than I have Facerig with a Pro license in the same time frame.

I'm fine with having to purchase a new product with new features every couple of years, like I buy a new Paintshop Pro probably every 3 or 4 versions as they release a new one every year and I tend to wait until the features are different enough to validate said purchase.

I understand Facerig has been going for about 6 years and it's stupid to expect Holotech to just keep updating it and adding new features and content to it for free. They have bills to pay and mouths to feed like the rest of us. But I do feel they're doing this all wrong.

They should of probably expanded Facerig Studio into Animaze for the big money and aimed that at the professional/commercial streamers and content creators. e.g the 10 million sub types or TV and film studios and made a stand alone 'cloud' free Facerig 2.0 for the rest of us who use it to make videos here and there and like to have a bit of fun on Video chats.

Feels like this sub model is really alienating the majority of the user base Facerig has.
I understand Facerig is probably not bringing in the bucks anymore and it is time for new a new income source. But this is why you make a new product. Just like Game devs do. Just like software companies like Corel and Magix and more do.

I'd of bought a Facerig 2.0, A Facerig 3.0 in a few more years, and a Facerig 4.0 and so on and so forth. (Or skipped a version here and there.)
Just as I bought Paintshop Pro 2020 despite having a perfectly functioning Paintshop Pro X9.
Just as I have done over the years with games and software in general that I like.

There's a reason I bought Doom, Doom 2, Doom 3, Doome 2016 and Doom Eternal, but never spent a dime on Quake Champions, despite buying every other Quake game made.
There's a reason why I still buy Corel products, but no longer even look at Adobe ones let alone give them a cent.
There's a reason I play games like Morrowind, Oblvion and Skyrim, but avoid MMO's

Holotech would at least be making money from me for a true Facerig Sequel, especially one that fixed Facerigs shortcomings. Even fine with reasonably priced Avatar and scene packs.

Alas Animaze as it currently is won't make Holotech a single Penny from me, even if Facerig stops working I'll just move on.

Just feels like a step towards nickle and diming people. Of controlling our content.
I don't have to upload my graphics to Corel before I use them on a website.
I don't have to upload my videos to Magix first, every time I want to upload them to Youtube.
I don't have to pay any of them to use content I CREATED using their software I already paid for.

Heck I use plenty of free open source software also. GIMP doesn't water mark my photos and graphics every time I use it.
It doesn't kick me out after 90 minutes.
A lot of 'webcam' software that is watermarked because it is free will remove said watermark after you've done a one off reasonably priced payment and not expect you to keep on paying.


What happens if I make a model or skin Holotech does not approve of?
Do I get stopped from using it? They might not like me making a sexy adult friendly "Fluffo"

Anyone on board for Animaze, especially those who create content. I'm gonna suggest you read the ToS, EULA's and fine print before you upload any of your content to their servers.

You want to be sure your property remains under your complete ownership and control.

Heck I don't even know if I can use Animaze offline like I can Facerig. Devs haven't responded to the post I made asking that.
But seeing as uploading is required for content. I'm guessing it is online only...

As a long time user and fan, not even knowing about Animaze or the Beta until the recently, this really feels like a kick in the nuts.

tl;dr I like to pay straight up for software then have complete control over how I use it and when I use it. Something Facerig Pro and every other piece of software I own does.
Something Animaze will not do.
Too many potential hooks and catches with a sub service.
Seriously sad we have to explain and even rationalise this to Holotech who I assume are adults and not 12 year olds.

Yeah could understand 'studio' going this way. But not the program we casual types use and love.

Yeah. I agree with everything you say...I only use facerig to have fun with my models and art creations in videochats and 1-3 videos a year... Nothing more. Im one of the many alienated costumers. Multiple friends I have are also putting down their final interest in facerig due to these news and wont return unless they can buy and use it however they like after the purchase. It seems the community is going to crash. And holotech may look at a loss of costumers in the end. As most of their costumers will now be people who barely or almost make up the money they need by using facerig for their daily game streams. Its honestly silly and ignorant to assume we all are "streamers" with subscribers. If that is their target. Then animaze clearly is not for me at all. And I will just end up being stuck with their older outdated software with broken promises.

I also barely use it. I'm also A PRO Facerig owner. Which on retail right now is a $65 upgrade. I'm fine with paying for new models. That encourages the developer to add new content and keep the program working. However, as a PRO Facerig owner.. who if i had to pay full retail would be over $150 into this software.. is being told I have to pay a monthly fee same as everyone else that gets the new Anaimaze software, or even having to pay a monthly fee at all is rude at best. The company should offer at a minimum to existing pro facerig owners a small one time fee upgrade to own Animaze. Then we could buy new avatars as we chose. The current suggested business model for their new software will kill their customer base.

I'm aware a large portion of their current users bought this on a site like Humble Bundle or Fanatical. Also i'm aware that's a huge hit to their profit. However, if you have to essentially give away your product to get the bulk of new users of your software. That's a marketing issue, not a fee issue. This company needs better marketing instead of nickle and dimeing existing users.

[Zefnoly]

Originally posted by gamersofpain:

Originally posted by Zefnoly:

Yeah. I agree with everything you say...I only use facerig to have fun with my models and art creations in videochats and 1-3 videos a year... Nothing more. Im one of the many alienated costumers. Multiple friends I have are also putting down their final interest in facerig due to these news and wont return unless they can buy and use it however they like after the purchase. It seems the community is going to crash. And holotech may look at a loss of costumers in the end. As most of their costumers will now be people who barely or almost make up the money they need by using facerig for their daily game streams. Its honestly silly and ignorant to assume we all are "streamers" with subscribers. If that is their target. Then animaze clearly is not for me at all. And I will just end up being stuck with their older outdated software with broken promises.

I also barely use it. I'm also A PRO Facerig owner. Which on retail right now is a $65 upgrade. I'm fine with paying for new models. That encourages the developer to add new content and keep the program working. However, as a PRO Facerig owner.. who if i had to pay full retail would be over $150 into this software.. is being told I have to pay a monthly fee same as everyone else that gets the new Anaimaze software, or even having to pay a monthly fee at all is rude at best. The company should offer at a minimum to existing pro facerig owners a small one time fee upgrade to own Animaze. Then we could buy new avatars as we chose. The current suggested business model for their new software will kill their customer base.

I'm aware a large portion of their current users bought this on a site like Humble Bundle or Fanatical. Also i'm aware that's a huge hit to their profit. However, if you have to essentially give away your product to get the bulk of new users of your software. That's a marketing issue, not a fee issue. This company needs better marketing instead of nickle and dimeing existing users.

Rudest part is having to pay to use models you made yourself in your freetime...

[Rabid]

Originally posted by Zefnoly:

Rudest part is having to pay to use models you made yourself in your freetime...

^This^

I put a lot of hours into making my Raccoon skin. But I have to have a dollar to actually use it with Animaze? So I make a bunch of skins and then need a bunch more bucks too? Regardless of free or VIP, I am paying to use my own work.

Do I upload them? How do I import my own models and stuff for the $0.99? Surely my computer doesn't need me to insert $1(USD?) to drop files into a folder so I am assuming there is some cloud shenanigans involved if I want to import for 'personal use'.

(I'll admit I misread and jumped the gun on 'uploads' being a thing. But good example of why Holotech needs to clarify a few things.)

Does a message pop up saying "external files detected. Please insert coin to continue. Please enter PayPal/Credit Card details now."

If I have 20 skins/models do I have to pay $0.99 for each one individually, or does it tally up the file count and give me a one off bulk price?

Do I get a discount the more skins I import at once? Sort of buy 4 get one free? lol

And that is only a dollar for the free version, it's gonna be at least $1.66(USD?) a month if I also want the watermark to be gone.

If I stop using a skin or model I imported do I get my money back? Do I have to pay again if I delete or modify the files then have to reimport them?

If USD, then that "$19.99" becomes "$27.62" at current rates in my local currency. That "$99.99" becomes $138.....

Flashbacks to Mixamo and Fuse engaged. lol