Shovel superior to the axe?

[Ol' Knife Ears <3]

Topic in the title. Acquiring the axe has given me more trouble than using the shovel. The range is abysmal, the windup time long, and the damage increase does not seem to make a noticeable difference. Agile foes (the dangerous ones who can game the very unforgiving combat system) still require three hits to kill.

On top of that, the shovel has some tech usage for digging up rubble and holes. If the axe has a similar usage I haven't progressed that far, but in regards to combat, the shovel seems overall better.

[Ivy]

Axe can break any wooden door... but yeah. Shovel feels overall better to use. Also got axe recently without crafting it (not telling how because it could be a minor spoiler)

[MazyRun]

A lot of players do prefer the shovel on some levels. I think this is partly due to it being the first decent melee weapon you acquire, even though it's hard to handle at first after a while you get used to it (it's the same deal with the axe)..

When the axe finally turns up in the game (it can be quite a while) it feels really different compared to the shovel which by now you've become pretty adept at using (and it probably has upgrades)..

The first noticeable difference is the shorter range but really it's not much different than letting an attacker get within touching distance before pulling the trigger on your shotgun.

After a while you get used to the range and perhaps learn to prefer the shorter time it takes to strike (compared to the shovel). The shovel has a longer wind back and follow through.

Judge the weapons on their fully upgraded state, this is where you will see their true performance level.

Try a number of play-through's and use the axe late-game as much as you've used the shovel early-game. It is mostly just preference but you may find you grow to prefer the axe (or like it just as much).

Personally I do choose the axe as my main melee weapon.. really I think the shovel, pitchfork & axe all do a great job in combat, I like mixing it up by using them all (pitchfork is highly underrated).

Once you have mastered all the melee weapons the ultimate test to find which one is the most reliable is to play on perma-death and note how many times you get in to trouble using a particular weapon..

When you play with infinite lives you don't tend to attribute deaths to the limitations of the weapon you were using. In other words you only remember the times you destroyed a bunch of savages with a shovel and not the times you got caught out with it (leading to a needless death).

I think overall the axe is more reliable in terms of all-round performance, you can only really feel this after a long testing period though..

When death means game over you become less likely to place your confidence in the slower weapon when a faster one is available (the shovel serves you well until the axe becomes available though).

Once you've mastered the axe you look forward to getting it so you can carry a fresh 100% shovel to dig with (& use as a secondary melee weapon). The upgrades ensure all the melee weapons remain viable the whole game.

[Darthzz]

I've used the shovel more than the axe and I can say...


...I like the axe a lot more. Upgraded, anyways. Shovel is much better than the axe until the axe gets the damage upgrade IMO. Shovel's good because of its long reach that can prevent you from getting hit if used correctly, but when you get better with the axe timings, the fact that it 1-2 shots basically everything is insane. I ended up almost never using my guns on the playthrough where I beat the game deathless because of how strong the axe was. But the shovel comes VERY close in usefulness. It just depends on which one feels better to you.

[Null Winter]

I prefer the shovel. You can kill most enemies with a fully charged swing with a quick-attack follow-up once you upgrade its damage; very few creatures have the speed or durability to survive this simple combo. It's far less risky than trying to one-shot with the axe.

[Darthzz]

Originally posted by Null Winter:

I prefer the shovel. You can kill most enemies with a fully charged swing with a quick-attack follow-up once you upgrade its damage; very few creatures have the speed or durability to survive this simple combo. It's far less risky than trying to one-shot with the axe.

IMO once you're better with the axe, there's no risk at all. Had no problem taking out a group of 3 red chompers and a centipede one night with axe-only.

[Darthzz]

I changed my mind. I like them both equally. In my last playthrough, I was using melee only and ended up using both. They both have their uses. Axe is better against singular and/or tankier targets like chompers and huge dogs, and shovel is better against weaker targets that come in greater numbers, like banshee babies and human spiders.

[MazyRun]

Also don't forget to compare the shovel and axe against the pitchfork, it's a good weapon and has a longer reach than the shovel (if you use barricades it can reach over tables).

I think players disregard the fork because in it's non-upgraded state it takes a lot of hits to kill things and degrades quickly (and also it can get stuck in walls/doors/furniture).

However if you upgrade it's damage and stamina in chapter 1 (durability upgrade in chapter 2) you will have a long reach stabbing weapon which barely drains your stamina (jab away without getting tired).

It's good for using outdoors at night, you can kite oncoming enemies, it's almost impossible to mistime a hit with it. You have plenty of resources to maintain it.

The only weapons I tend to not use are the ones that don't interrupt enemy attacks (no stun), sickles & knives. These weapons do have some good situational usefulness though.

[Super]

I always have the Axe when I enter the swamp. I even prepare ahead of time and steal the second Axe blade from the villagers when they try to escape the forest. (I always kill the Sow for this scenario to happen.)

Upon entering the swamp I look for the parts to upgrade my workbench then get the Axe to max damage and increase durability fairly quick. I one shot Spidermen, Lizards, Dogs, Centepede Men, and two hit Chompers.

Although I always use the shovel before the Axe. Shovel is a good weapon to use before the Axe... I just prefer the Axe.

[Deformerad Dallarydsbo]

Originally posted by MazyRun:

Also don't forget to compare the shovel and axe against the pitchfork, it's a good weapon and has a longer reach than the shovel (if you use barricades it can reach over tables).

I think players disregard the fork because in it's non-upgraded state it takes a lot of hits to kill things and degrades quickly (and also it can get stuck in walls/doors/furniture).

However if you upgrade it's damage and stamina in chapter 1 (durability upgrade in chapter 2) you will have a long reach stabbing weapon which barely drains your stamina (jab away without getting tired).

It's good for using outdoors at night, you can kite oncoming enemies, it's almost impossible to mistime a hit with it. You have plenty of resources to maintain it.

The only weapons I tend to not use are the ones that don't interrupt enemy attacks (no stun), sickles & knives. These weapons do have some good situational usefulness though.

Can you repair the pitchfork?

[MazyRun]

Yes, same repair cost as shovel/axe/sickle.

[Deformerad Dallarydsbo]

Originally posted by MazyRun:

Yes, same repair cost as shovel/axe/sickle.

thanks fam, was afraid of using both axe and shovel because I tought they were destroyed like the pitchfork, time to go and F some monsters

[SpinDie426]

for my third axe upgrade should i choose light materials or stronger axe? I already have the extra damage and super durability. But i just discovered you can have 3 upgrades on it. Thats dope.

I also have the perk that says i deal less damage if my stamina is low

im thinking of going with lower stamina, which would benefit the fast-attack only i guess. i never seem to run into durability issues with the axe

[MazyRun]

That's good, 'Sharpened' and 'Sturdy Blade' are the best ones to prioritize as the initial 2 upgrade picks.. having both of these already gives more value to 'Light Materials' (stamina upgrade) over 'Better Materials' as your third pick (seeing as you already have 'Sturdy Blade', the 'much higher durability' upgrade).

You will end up with all 4 upgrades, 'Better Materials' will stack with 'Sturdy Blade' to give the weapon max durability but you're right about not really running into durability issues, it's fairly easy to maintain weapons even without durability upgrades, it's just a bonus when they have some durability.

Even though it is fairly optimal to get 'Sturdy Blade' before 'Better Materials' there are still plenty of circumstances when it's perfectly fine to get 'Better Materials' before 'Sturdy Blade' (like if it's just a temporary/secondary weapon).

The interesting upgrade picks are those early-game choices when there are only 2 upgrade slots available out of a possible 3 or 4.. the pitchfork is a good example of this, it slightly bucks the trend by sometimes being more useful to prioritize upgrading its stamina over durability.

Even though you have the 'Weakness' negative trait/debuff (which affects melee strength), you can still negate it a lot by maining firearms & throwables but also when you do use melee weapons you're character is strong enough by this stage of the game for that debuff to not be impactful..

..this is because your weapons are maxed out (with strength & stamina upgrades) and they are hitting hard (especially the axe), you're killing things in a couple of hits regardless of your stamina status (your weakened hits are still death blows)..

..where as the other debuff in that tier 'Weak Lungs' would cause all kinds of issues during combat (so 'Weakness' is by far the best negative trait to take in that tier).

[RdRStar]

Can the shovel be used for digging? Like the holes the bugs crawl out from? I couldn't figure out a way.

[MazyRun]

Originally posted by RdRStar:

Can the shovel be used for digging?

Yes, digging becomes more of an important interaction later in the game when you stumble upon dig piles (mounds of earth) that contain either random items or story related items (much like crates except you need a shovel instead of a lockpick or code).

You will know when you find a diggable pile, there will be a prompt to interact with it. So it helps to keep any kind of shovel in your hotbar or backpack (it doesn't have to be a super upgraded one, an un-upgraded shovel wears down at the same rate as an upgraded one when it is used for digging instead of melee).

There is a extremely useful diggable pile in the very first area which many players miss, this is the first indication that shovels can be used as a tool, not just a melee weapon.